Would you call it quits??

[Carrie_R]

I couldn't get it in FF without a huge gap. Maybe theirs is a diff year and it's slightly different? (Mom says it's a 2007.) I'll try to get the pics up later tonight, it depends on how/if the internet works tonight.

 

[Carrie_R]

Okay... I took a bunch of pics. I did some with FF seats and some with RF seats; please don't take it as a critique or criticism but rather a 'data mine' for your use and the use of others who might look for this topic at a later date -- just to see what works and what doesn't. Take from it what works for you.

All I had with me was a Radian, Monterey, MyRide and Literider. I wish I had thought ahead and grabbed a couple of extra seats but it didn't occur to me until I was in my parents' garage working on another project.

First up -- I tried a FF MyRide in the center. (I tried it outboard later and the results were similar, but I don't hae photographs.) I can't remember what the verdict was in regards to the back flush, the feet touching the seat, the front hanging off etc so I would encourage you to thoroughly research that. (I know TechnoGranola had some correspondance with Carol at Graco about that last year.)

Here's that thread -- http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=169182&highlight=MyRide -- and I found this bit, quoted from an email from Carol, in post #14:

You must have a tight installation for the MyRide 65 - if you have contact with the vehicle back to the car seat and the bottom of the front of the MyRide 65 you must have a tight installation. Some vehicles have very customized seats so as you know you have to work with each vehicle seat as they come through a car seat check. We must have a tight installation - the one inch rule is a must.

It sounds like, from further reading in that thread, that the gap issue was never clarified. However, I think now that I read that I need to rescind my post from last night -- I went out and installed again and I feel comfortable with what I did.

The FF MR, with the feet on the seat, caused a huge gap in the back. The way it's seatbelted in in the first few photos, the feet are just barely touching the seat. In the next few photos, where it's not seatbelted, the back is flush partway up but then there is a gap, and the feet are floating above the seat. I went back out and installed it -- those pictures are at the end.

Belted -- (feet touching, gap)


Unbelted -- (feet not touching, less gap)


When I went back out and did an install with the unbelted version, I was actually really pleased with the results. I'm not sure that the headrest was interfering at all, I think it hit where the top of the MR would naturally be, due to its curve. It doesn't have too terribly much recline, either.



Next up, I tried my Monterey. The manual says that the booster must be against seatback, but the current info coming from Allana is that a gap behind the booster is okay if it's due to the headrest pushing the seat forward. IF Diono sticks with this info, I think the Monterey is an option for a HBB in this vehicle.

It sits within the side bolster:



There is a small gap, but it's not too wide, and I don't think it extends all the way down. I was able to push the backrest back against the vehicle seat with not too much pressure -- in fact, it might be in contact just with a child's weight pushing back on it.



Space next to buckle, width-wise:


It also fits within the canopy. This is at its most extended:



Buckled, approx. how a child with an 18" torso would use it:



I have too many images, so I'll put the rest of my pictures in a second post.

 

[Carrie_R]

Now, for some combinations. I put the Monterey next to a FF MR. It took some pressure (mild, but still wiggle/push) to get it into place, but it puzzles beautifully! It also worked better with the headrest higher, so it's not going to be outgrown at a growth spurt, kwim?



For reference, how it fit next to a RF MR. It fits, but in order to get it there I had to move the MR towards the driver's side, meaning the space on the other side is narrower and would not fit another Monterey. Might be an option for someone who needs HBB/RF/backless or HBB/RF/seatbelt as a configuration. Buckling space is okay, not great.


So, I tried it with a RF RN, and it fits, Monterey on either side (I only have one so you'll have to take my word for it.) Buckling space is a little sparse, though.



Added the AA for the RN, and life got better all around:



Lastly, I tried the RN FF. I didn't photograph it with a booster on either side, guessing I couldn't get the puzzle to work or I didn't try hard enough lol. Does the RN allow a gap behind it? Because it sure has one. My fingers are at the highest point of contact with the seatback:



I do know I DID try RN outboard (thinking it would sit lower and have less gap,) Literider center and Monterey outboard, and it fit (albeit super-tight) width-wise but the RN still had a gap.

Lots of scenarios, mostly lots of data, but I hope it helps. I'm here for a few more hours, let me know if you need anything else... my parents are being weirdly tolerant of my CPS stuff this weekend and don't care if I go play carseats, lol!

 

[Cath3114]

How do you feel about the FF RN? Would you be comfortable with a child riding in it? I have a '10 Impala, and even though we are years from FF, it's likely I will end up with a FF RN in there at some point.

 

[love-pink]

If you start with the top of the convertible seat shell under the headrests and the push back and slide upwards you get a much smaller gap. It flattens the headrest a bit as opposed to just setting the seat down and tightening like you normally would

I had an rn ffing with a smaller gap and was completely confident with the install. I'm not a tech but I'm extremely picky.

 

[Kendrab2315]

I read through page 4 where you posted a pic of your headrest so if his suggestion has been said, im sorry My headrest is the same (if not then very similar) and our probooster works perfectly! Also, this is according to the manual, "both the seat base and seat back of the hold restraint should fit as close to the vehicle seat as possible". The way the back curves, it sits under the headrest. If needed (and you could even fit 2 back there), I will gladly take a pic and post it!

 

[Carrie_R]

Awesome, good to know. I wanted to get some pics for you but at the same time no one was going to ride in it... I'm a very very very far away from needing a FF carseat in my parents' cars so I didn't invest the time I otherwise might've! LOL!

Cath, I would not, but it might be possible (1) depending on love-pink's tip and (2) depending on what the RN manual says about gapping.

That RN was darned upright, too. Like straight up and down. LP, was it that way when installed with your trick?

 

[love-pink]

I think the rn is always pretty upright because the back is so flat, but the week or two that dd rode in it ffing in the Impala she had zero head slump. Head slump is my pet peeve

 

[love-pink]

Now that Im on the computer and I can view your pictures better, your parents back seat is definitely different than mine.

I dont have the fold down ability so my back seat is a tad more flush with the headreasts and not so angled from the seat back. I also have different seat belt buckles, mine are longer and flimsy.

 

[Carrie_R]

Oh, interesting! So their headrest jutting is more severe than yours, or less? If less, than I think there's about a 99% chance a Monterey would work for you... it really wasn't terribly far off. Although, how it fits with the FFing MyRide at that point would be anyone's guess.

Bummer about the buckle stalks. With them being rigid, it would be much easier for a kiddo to reach down there and get them buckled. I know all about buckling with floppy buckle stalks and tight three-acrosses, it is NOT fun.

Sorry it wasn't more helpful, I tried!

 

[love-pink]

I think the headrests are exactly the same, it's the seat backs that are different. It's like mine fluff out more so it's not such a squared angle where it meets the headrest.

The seat belts are definitely an adjustment for my kids Weve had nothing but stiff seatbelts in the last 6 years. My ds2 told dh my seatbelts were broken because the don't sit up by themselves like in our other vehicle lol.

 

[love-pink]

Here is the MR install. I honestly was installing quickly because dd2 was waking up from her nap but Im sure if someone gave it a little more time it could be installed with no gap at all.

Another trick I found yesterday to deal with the angled headrests:

Set the seat in and attach the latch (or seatbelt, I use latch center to keep my older two from accidentally unbuckling the seat).
Use your fore arm to push the headrest back.
Put your knee is the seat and press it down and back.
Then finally tighten the latch with your free hand.

It fit in quickly and without any trouble.

I also got a good picture showing the gap Im getting with boosters because of the headrest angle. This is the Amp HBB. Its the closest Ive come with a HBB that fits the bends of the seat. There is a gap there.

 

[love-pink]

I forgot to add yesterday my middle two rode in the HBBs and fell asleep on the way home. My son had some major head slump and dd was sliding down in the seat

I think its because the headrests make the HBB more upright so it seems to push their bodies forward. When they fall asleep and no longer control their neck they have no where to go but forward. The headwings are pretty non exsistant so my sons head rolls right off the wing and ends up almost under it.

Im going to try the HBBs a little longer but will probably go back to the NBBs. In those they stay nicely in place even when they sleep because my vehicle seats are naturally reclined and they dont reach the headrests yet to push their heads forward.

 

[Baylor]

Still gotta say it. For the safety of those kids in boosters you should turn MR rfing. If just for the fact that in a side collision their heads will not be banging off that hard cat seat.

ETA: and clarify, if you are going back to LBB.
auto correct hates me

 

[Carrie_R]

Baylor, you, the OP, and everyone else on this board know how very VERY strongly I feel about RFing. But after being in the same(ish) vehicle this weekend, turning the littlest RF in her MR is going to cause the backs on the HBB not to fit. If they do go back to the backlesses, the story changes, but with the seats she has at the moment that's the best setup she's going to get.

It's not what I would choose, it's not what you would choose, but my job (as a tech) is to get those kids "leaving" safer than they "arrived." Arguing about how to get the safest setup, which is outside the parameters that the parent has set, is only going to drive the parent away and afford her no assistance in determining a safer setup for her kids.

L-P, a few questions... 1) isn't that gap just due to the curve of the MR's back? It's not flat, so it's not going to end up perfectly flush.

2) How do they sleep in the Literiders? If they have headslump issues there, too, I really felt pretty comfortable with the Montereys, and your backseat looks less contoured, so they should fit better overall. Recent Diono drama aside, my kids sleep amazingly well in their Montereys and there are a few in swap for reasonable prices at the moment. I would try one locally before purchasing if possible (do you live near a member that might have them?)

3) Is the gap behind the Big Kids behind the backrest, or behind the "neck" area? Behind the "neck" is normal and expected, we are just trying to get the backrest flush.

I thought I had another question for you but I can't remember it now, so I will follow up later if I remember it lol.

 

[jessi f]

Still gotta say it. For the safety of those kids on boosters you should turn my rfing. If just for the fact that in a side collision their heads will not be banging off that hard cat seat.

auto correct hates me

I'm going to start a SO so I dont derail so please look for that thread if you have comments But I could have sworn I read before that being beside a seat or even just another person had some benefit in a side impact? It may have been part of the SICT (is that the acronym for the fancy FR? ) discussions but it definitely referred to regular seats as well. I think... I may just be channelling a weird c-s.org dream...

 

[arly1983]

I'm going to start a SO so I dont derail so please look for that thread if you have comments But I could have sworn I read before that being beside a seat or even just another person had some benefit in a side impact? It may have been part of the SICT (is that the acronym for the fancy FR? ) discussions but it definitely referred to regular seats as well. I think... I may just be channelling a weird c-s.org dream...

I also remember reading this and way before the britax sict. Let me see if I can find it.

 

[canadiangie]

Years ago I read a few posts referring to some study that said sbs installs may provide some protection in a crash. I actually remember Kat (mom of ruthie et al) posting about it on bbc.

We're talking 2005 ish.

I'm going to start a SO so I dont derail so please look for that thread if you have comments But I could have sworn I read before that being beside a seat or even just another person had some benefit in a side impact? It may have been part of the SICT (is that the acronym for the fancy FR? ) discussions but it definitely referred to regular seats as well. I think... I may just be channelling a weird c-s.org dream...

 

[Baylor]

Baylor, you, the OP, and everyone else on this board know how very VERY strongly I feel about RFing. But after being in the same(ish) vehicle this weekend, turning the littlest RF in her MR is going to cause the backs on the HBB not to fit. If they do go back to the backlesses, the story changes, but with the seats she has at the moment that's the best setup she's going to get.

It's not what I would choose, it's not what you would choose, but my job (as a tech) is to get those kids "leaving" safer than they "arrived." Arguing about how to get the safest setup, which is outside the parameters that the parent has set, is only going to drive the parent away and afford her no assistance in determining a safer setup for her kids.

L-P, a few questions... 1) isn't that gap just due to the curve of the MR's back? It's not flat, so it's not going to end up perfectly flush.

2) How do they sleep in the Literiders? If they have headslump issues there, too, I really felt pretty comfortable with the Montereys, and your backseat looks less contoured, so they should fit better overall. Recent Diono drama aside, my kids sleep amazingly well in their Montereys and there are a few in swap for reasonable prices at the moment. I would try one locally before purchasing if possible (do you live near a member that might have them?)

3) Is the gap behind the Big Kids behind the backrest, or behind the "neck" area? Behind the "neck" is normal and expected, we are just trying to get the backrest flush.

I thought I had another question for you but I can't remember it now, so I will follow up later if I remember it lol.

My post was in reaction to her saying she may go back to LBB. IF she is I would hope that she would consider turning LO rfing to avoid the kids hitting their head on the MR in a crash.

 

[KaysKidz]

My post was in reaction to her saying she may go back to LBB. IF she is I would hope that she would consider turning LO rfing to avoid the kids hitting their head on the MR in a crash.

Unless the OP is going to get a different car, at some point, this child will have to go FF (though I'm fairly certain that she is staying FF) and the children will have to be next to her car seat. It's inevitable.

There is the 'ideal world' and then there is 'real world'. And in the real world, a family with a sedan and 3 children...somebody at some point, will be sitting next to a car seat.