LATCHable boosters & center LATCH

[Carrie_R]

This might be the dumbest idea ever, and if so, please somebody don't be afraid to say so, lol.

I'm still trying to figure out my "best" second row configuration, 06 Honda Pilot, Monterey, (probably harnessed) Nautilus, Cosco Pronto, all seatbelt installs. I've had the Monterey outboard passenger, and the Nautilus center, with the Pronto driver, and I've also flipped Nautilus and Pronto, but I don't really like the Pronto center for a few reasons. (A -- I switch it almost daily with a Scenera, B -- it's the seat used by the only child I have who attends school daily, C -- it doesn't fit well and is difficult to buckle, D -- I don't like how the dual buckle stalks fit it.) As I've played around with it, it dawned on me that I could try the Monterey center, but I really like the fact that it LATCHes... I'm lazy and hate having to buckle the boosters all the time, lol. Plus, as heavy as it is, I would really hate to forget it. The Pronto would probably hurt if left unbuckled in a crash, the Monterey would be very bad news.

So, my question is this. I know my vehicle does not allow center LATCH, and I would never, never ever LATCH a harnessed restraint there. But if I'm leaving the Monterey somewhat loose, and only using the LATCH as a projectile-preventative, is it still completely unallowable to LATCH the booster there? (I know it takes some load in an accident, but I also know that the belt is what's restraining my child so even IF the LATCH were to fail, it would not be catastrophic.)

Is there any chance this falls under grey area/caregiver decision, or would you still consider it totally black and white?

Just curious. I haven't even tried the Monterey center to see if it works better. Trying to save my poor hands, my buckle stalks are long and floppy so buckling is quite a chore... the kids can't do it themselves, and we do it a lot lol.

 

[Pixels]

It's probably technically a gray area/parental decision, since Honda doesn't allow center LATCH.

However, I have no qualms telling you that it's okay to borrow LATCH for a booster. The LATCH is only there to hold the booster back in case of an unoccupied crash, to keep it from being a projectile. It's not there to do anything to protect your child in a crash, that's what the seatbelt is there for.

The only hesitation I have is that usually borrowing LATCH like that will block access to the seatbelts.

 

[Carrie_R]

Right... I also know they don't allow LATCH over 40lbs though which LATCH with a booster technically is, hence why I figured it was worth asking, lol.

Thanks for your input. I hadn't thought about blocking the seatbelts. The belts are forward of bight in those positions so it may not be an issue. And it may not work with the Monterey center anyways, but I wanted to find out if LATCH was an option before I got my heart set on it, lol.

Thanks again. We'll see if that setup makes my life any easier, lol.

 

[crunchierthanthou]

I'm posting from a phone and can't link, but the sunshine kids engineer addressed this in the chat session he did here. it's fine. you can use non-standard LATCH for the monterey. as you said, it's only holding the booster.

 

[Jeanum]

The other caveat is that it's allowable if it doesn't interfere with/overlap the vehicle seatbelt if you use the lower LATCH anchors on a LATCHable booster, and this is true even if it's a dedicated lower LATCH anchor equipped seating position in the vehicle. I have a dedicated LATCH position in the center of the third row in my Sienna, for example, that isn't compatible with LATCHing a LATCHable booster like our Monterey or the rigid LATCH Clek Olli because of the position of the lower LATCH anchor on the seatbelt buckle side. The third row center position's lower LATCH anchor on the driver's side is closer to the side of the van than the seatbelt buckle for the center seating position, and thus the seatbelt and the booster's lower LATCH connector interfere/overlap each other. :thumbsdown:

 

[Carrie_R]

Thanks, ladies. For future reference, I was able to center LATCH it and it did not interfere with the seatbelts I'm still not sure if the setup is any better, I think the fact of the matter is two boosters in a 3-across is a PITA any way you slice it, but hey, can't fault a girl for trying. LOL

 

[Carrie_R]

I'm bumping my own thread, since I came up with another question, that is similar/tangential with this one.

I'm thinking quite seriously about getting Montereys for all of my older boys, first as I love the seat, and secondly because of it's LATCHable capabilities. (I'm having a hard time with school dropoff and booster buckling.) It's the only one of the LATCHable seats that I can see working for us, aside from possibly using the Nautilus as a booster, which I don't think will go over too well with my gang. (N doesn't fit well in it, but it's "N's seat," ergo no one else wants to use it.)

If I did this, I'd be looking at a 3-across, with two outboard sets of LATCH. Would it be crossing out of grey area and into black if I were to LATCH each of the outboard ones, and also center LATCH the middle one? (So borrowing anchors *and* sharing anchors?)

I'm justifying this with the same methodolgy of the center LATCH in the first place, LATCH is just holding the boosters in, so that they're not projectiles, and not holding the kids. I'm pretty comfortable with it but wanted to get opinions here in case someone else can spot a major flaw in my reasoning that I didn't think about.

Sometimes, I think, I think too much

TIA

 

[mommycat]

Great questions. Subbing to see what others say. Not venturing my own thoughts on this one yet...

 

[Carrie_R]

If no one else replies, please do venture your thoughts! I'm 100% aware that I would be going against the vehicle manual, but I also know the "whys" and that's the only reason I'm entertaining the idea. I want to see what others think, like I said, to see if there's some obvious "duh" YOU'RE GONNA KILL YOUR KID! that I'm missing, lol.

 

[crunchierthanthou]

I think the worst case scenario is that the empty boosters turn into projectiles. I wouldn't expect for it to happen, but it's harder to reconcile two boosters connected to the same anchor, one of which from an unapproved seating position.

If the anchors fail when the children are in them, they are still secured by the vehicle seatbelt. The Monterey can be used without the lower anchor strap, so the biggest hazard there is an anchor hook flying free. and I think failing when occupied is incredibly unlikely because the booster will also be held back by the vehicle seatbelt. It probably won't be able to move far enough to put enough force on the anchor to cause it to fail. I would hope, anyway.

:twocents:

I think the biggest issue is whether two will fit side by side (they are kind of wide in the shoulder area), and if the lower anchor straps will interfere with the seatbelts.

 

[Carrie_R]

I do know that LATCHing in any position does not interfere with the seatbelts, I've been over that one already I'll need to measure the width of the seat, but it's pretty wide, so they may actually fit.

My problem boils down to this... I have two kids I drop off at school, one 2-3 days a week (awesome schedule ) and the other on a daily basis. 3 days, I then have to drive across town, and baaarely make it on time, to drop another child.

The dropoff line is such that the boys cannot buckle the seats themselves; as a matter of fact it's difficult for me to buckle the boosters in the first place because of the 3-across in that row. So having them unbuckle, turn around, buckle booster and get out does not happen without majorly holding up the dropoff line and making the school staff quite cranky.

I am able to pull over before pulling out of the dropoff circle and buckle the booster, but that adds about a minute to my schedule, which sounds insignificant but I need every minute I have. We're late to the second school all the time and I hate it (for the child, not myself... the staff is great but I hate that he has to walk in late all the time, and I'm yelling at the kids "Come on, hurry up, we're late!" LOL)

Of course the only other option is to not buckle that booster, but then it's *definitely* a projectile and I'm not down with that, especially since there's always another child in that row at this time of the morning. So we stop and buckle.

The other-other option is to put the non-Monterey school child up front with me, so that I can reach over and buckle his seat after he gets out, but that certainly doesn't seem "lesser of two evils" in this situation. Why expose the child to the airbag out of want for expediency, yk? That's just stupid talk.

FWIW, this is a "new pull test" vehicle, which says to me those anchors are rated for the 80lbs of my SL Radian, so I think it's doubtful they'd be stressed to failure, but who knows. I'm not a car seat manufacturer.

I've also left the boosters loosely anchored, so it would definitely be the belt holding them in while occupied, or at least much of the force would have been expended onto the belt before it got to the LATCH strap, if the crash was severe enough

Thanks for your input I'm not even sure this is what I want to do, but I'm weighing my options. I am completely aware that this is a parental decision area, and no one is going to tell me "go for it!" so I appreciate the insight and debate on whys and wherefores.

 

[crunchierthanthou]

Of course the only other option is to not buckle that booster, but then it's *definitely* a projectile and I'm not down with that, especially since there's always another child in that row at this time of the morning. So we stop and buckle.

well, if you absolutely can't re-buckle the first one, LATCH that one. You for sure have the capability to LATCH one of them. You can still manage to get the second one buckled after both kids are dropped off. You're right that the first is a definite projectile hazard rather than a potential one. I really don't think it's much of a possibility that the anchor will fail with both connected to it, but this solution is much more by the book.

I don't see putting one of them in the front as a solution at all.

What year is your Pilot?

 

[Carrie_R]

It's a 2006.

To clarify, the boys are Z (8), C (6), and N (5). Z has a Pronto and gets dropped off daily, and C, is in a LATCHed Monterey, and gets dropped off 2-3 times a week. So it's just Z's that needs to be worried about, since when C gets out it's a moot point. Of course the kicker is that C is the one worried about buckling; he was super relieved that his can be LATCHed and he doesn't have to worry about it. Z could care less. Z does not like the Monterey, but I think he is about to get overridden. I don't think there's any other LATCHable booster that meets my needs. The Frontier would be perfect but I cannot see spending $250 or whatever on an 8yo who won't be in boosters much longer. (He'll be an early 5-step test passer. He already passes in my 3rd row, except that he won't stay in position.)

N is not a drive-through dropoff, I get out and take him in, so there's no problem with buckling a booster for him if I were to get him one. (Except that I'm lazy. ) Right now he's officially in a Nautilus, but more often than not rides in C's booster. Hindsight being 20/20, I wish I would have just purchased him a Monterey when I got the kids new seats last month, but he was not yet 5 and I had no clue he'd do so well with the Monterey.

I think my solution for now is going to be to order another Monterey for Z, and keep N harnessed center (seatbelt install.) That way when Z & C get out for school, their seats are LATCHED, and even when/if I move N to a booster, I can just buckle it after I drop him off.

In the interim I could switch Z & C, at least on the days only Z is getting dropped off, but I don't know how that would go over. FTR, I don't tolerate a whole lot of fuss over things, normally what I say goes, but seats are a major compromise with us. Essentially, they have to ride in the type of seat (RF/harness/booster) that I say, but they get to pick which seat from a selection. Their parents are insanely lax about seat safety, so that's my way of making things 'fair' and why I'm not jumping to give one kid another's seat.

I measured, and I can definitely fit another Monterey on the 40 part of that bench; if I put one center (so a second one on the 60 part, where the first one is) the sidewings will cross the 'crack' but I *think* the base/buckle will be on it, so that should be fine. Since I know I can fit two Montereys and a Nautilus, I'll just order the second one and then see if I can fit them both on the 60. I can use the two outboard with the harnessed Nauti in the middle, for now.

Thanks for your help and advice. I really appreciate it.

 

[crunchierthanthou]

I think my solution for now is going to be to order another Monterey for Z, and keep N harnessed center (seatbelt install.) That way when Z & C get out for school, their seats are LATCHED, and even when/if I move N to a booster, I can just buckle it after I drop him off.

:thumbsup: That was going to be my suggestion as I read your first couple of paragraphs.

So, was your 2006 manufactured after 09/01/05? Given Sunshine Kids stance on the SL, that might make me even less hesitant about doubling up the boosters...

 

[Carrie_R]

You know, I haven't been able to find the dang manufacture date. I would guess probably, but maybe not, lol. That did factor into my figuring, if it's "new pull test" era, then ripping out is unlikely.

 

[crunchierthanthou]

I checked my friend's ODY before helping her install an SL. The DOM was on the top of the sticker inside the driver's door frame - the one near where it latches closed and that would be by your left hip as you're sitting in the seat.