Is it worth it to keep Rear Facing?

[samandel]

Hi!

This site has been so helpful in the past, I hope it can help us in our current predicament!

I have a 3.5 year old RF in a Radian and an 18 month old RF in a Britax Boulevard. We just found out we are expecting baby #3 next summer. We have a 2006 Mazda 5 and we have tried playing around with all the seats to allow for 3 RF kids, but can't get it to work. My husband and I are both tall, and there just isn't enough room in the 3rd row for any of the seats rear facing, even the infant seat, and also us safely sitting in the front.

We had always planned to leave my older son RF as long as possible - it is why we recently got him a Radian. He is only 33lbs, so he could really get another few years RF in this seat. So, our question is - how much safer is it at this age? Does it warrant getting another car so that they can all fit? Keep in mind that our current Mazda has 110,000 miles on it, and probably wont last too much longer anyway. But, financially it would be nice not to have to get another car right now.

My instinct is - yes, we should invest in another car now. All the research that I've done says that it IS much safer at any age to be RF. Plus, we'll be needing a new car in the next few years anyway, and if we flip him forward now, he wont want to go back then, even if he's still under 45lbs.

But, my husband is skeptical. He thinks it is ridiculous to get another car just for this reason.

What would you do?

 

[Brianna]

I'm not sure of differences through the model years, but here is a set-up that allowed 4 rear facers in a 2010 Mazda 5! http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=163445

*ETA
The Radian angle adjuster may also help your problem, it will allow you install the Radian more upright.

 

[jnamommy]

Maybe with the angle adjusters you would still be able to get 3 RFers in your current Mazda. It is worth a try.

Yes, RFing at any age is safer, but not practical for everyone for every age . Given that your oldest would be 4 or nearly 4 when the new baby comes, I don't think I would go out and buy another vehicle just to keep RFing. If you have to get a vehicle anyway, sure, I would get one that allows all the kids to RF. But at that age, I would not put any financial pressure on my family to keep the 4 yr old RFing. You did an awesome job keeping your kids safe, so I would give a pat on the back and turn the oldest when the baby comes.

 

[MorgieBear'sMama]

Not sure exactly what you drive, but I have a 2001 Mazda MPV (with 234,168 miles ) and can easily fit a rf seat in the 3rd row.

ETA: I now clearly see Mazda 5... Ignore me.

Ashley
Mama to Morgan- 2/25/04
Jackson and Colton- 11/1/10

 

[penguingrooves]

congratulations!! i know other members feel that a 3 1/2 year old (4 by next summer) is just as safe FFing as RFing, but i don't. when my baby #3 comes next year, i'm going keep RFing the older two (ages almost 5 and 2 1/2) because i managed to fit 3 across in a honda fit. it did require purchasing a new carseat and giving up the convenience of an infant carrier, but i never liked those anyway.

like brianna and jnamommy said, the diono angle adjuster should help with creating legroom space. since your instinct is to continue RFing, it's only a $10 risk if you want to explore that option.

 

[Carrie_R]

I am a big believer in RFing to the limits -- my nanny charge (5 in Feb) is RFing in my car, and although it is her decision it would be a lie to say I did not influence it, lol. I am not in a hurry to turn her. I say that for background as I say that I don't think I would purchase a new vehicle to keep a nearly 4yo RFing. Without question, there are benefits at any age, but spinal ossification completes between 4-6 and that means an almost-4yo would be extremely safe in a properly installed and used FFing seat.

On the other hand, I WOULD try my best to get all three RF in the vehicle you have, and if you have to get a new vehicle regardless I would probably seek one out that allowed you to keep your oldest RF. But, if it doesn't happen, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.

 

[ketchupqueen]

I would try my best to rear-face as long as possible. That said, I wouldn't buy a new car over it if you didn't otherwise need one. If you try the angle adjuster and just CAN'T make it work, I'd simply leave him rear-facing until as close as possible to time for the baby to come.

 

[beetlemama]

If I were in your shoes I would first try a diono angle adjuster and see if that makes it possible to keep your current car for a little while longer. That said, I see no reason to hold off replacing a vehicle that you're pretty sure you'll be replacing in the semi-near future anyway (regardless of the RF versus FF issue). We are planning to have 3 kids and strongly considered the 5 because I love the concept of a smaller and fuel efficient option to drive extra people, but it seems like there wouldn't be enough cargo room to get by without being able to fit 3 across the second row and use the entire back for storage, and that's coming from someone whose only car currently is a beetle for a family of 4!

I'm also jealous that your kids are small enough to RF so long! My 4 year old already outgrew the radian for height FF (she has an ultra long torso!) and my 2.5 year old may not make it to 4 RF (we will go to the limits of the seat).

 

[mkmama]

First I'd try the Radian angle adjuster...there's a good chance you'd be able to get the Radian comfortably installed somewhere RF'ing in your current vehicle with it.

If you still couldn't get the Radian RF'ing, I'd sit down and consider exactly when/if you'd otherwise be replacing your current car. If its pretty close to when the noob will be coming, I'd just keep the car for now and continue to RF. Then I'd reevaluate when the noob got here...if you're very close to getting a new car anyways and a few months won't make much difference etc on how much of a down payment you'll have, I'd go ahead and get the new car at that point.

However, I'd also like to point out that just because he goes FF'ing for awhile doesnt mean he won't like RF'ing again when given the chance. My oldest was FF from 1 year to 4.5 years (back before I knew the safety benefits of RF'ing as long as possible), and LOVED it when he got to go back to RF'ing (by that point it was a novelty since he didn't actually remember ever RF'ing) at the ripe old age of 4.5. He got mad when he eventually outgrew the Radian RF'ing right after his 5th birthday and had to go back FF..even now, 2 years later he occassionally asks if he can "ride backwards", even though he knows he's too big and knows I'm going to tell him no. My 3.5 year old has also spent short periods of a few weeks FF'ing in various vehicles for various reasons, and has no issue going back to RF'ing, even when he had to FF in my van (primary vehicle) for a few weeks...he's been primarily RF'ing his entire life.

 

[lourdes]

What if she gets a radian for the 18 month old and 2 angle adjusters and leave the boulevard to the new baby? A convertible will give her more space than the infant seats

 

[Jessica61624]

What if she gets a radian for the 18 month old and 2 angle adjusters and leave the boulevard to the new baby? A convertible will give her more space than the infant seats

Not at a newborn angle. They can take up just as much if not more room.

 

[Kaitsmom]

Do you have a new generation BLVD or an older one?

 

[legaleagle]

We also have a mazda5 and a similar age split - will be 3.75, 24 months and newborn in May. I decided to put my oldest ff'ing in the 3rd row because while I definitely found some combos that would keep all rearfacing, I didn't want to make my husband have to kneel in the back to get a kid in because he has terrible knee problems and I wanted to be able to load everyone in without having to open the garage door (since my younger DS is prone to darting into the street when the door is open). The coccoro fits at the newborn angle behind the first row pushed all the way back. A more upright new generation britax fits upright with inches to spare. Someone posted pics with the angle adjuster and apparently you can have the front row all the way back - it gets it to about 30 degrees.

 

[carseatcoach]

What if she gets a radian for the 18 month old and 2 angle adjusters and leave the boulevard to the new baby? A convertible will give her more space than the infant seats

A classic Boulevard will not fit a newborn.

 

[samandel]

I'm not sure of differences through the model years, but here is a set-up that allowed 4 rear facers in a 2010 Mazda 5! http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=163445

*ETA
The Radian angle adjuster may also help your problem, it will allow you install the Radian more upright.

Would you mind if I ask the height of the 2 adults sitting in the front? I've actually seen this photo before - from the tech who helped me pick out the radian a few months ago. I keep thinking about it when I look at the 3rd row and think 'there is no way'... I am 5'8 and my husband is 5'11. I wonder if the driver and passenger were much shorter here.

 

[samandel]

Thank you all for all your thoughts! Its nice to know that there possibly isn't too much of a difference in safety at age 4 between FF and RF. I still really want to keep him RF though.

Some more info:
-We already have the angle adjuster. Without it - it was questionable if it was installed right when my husband drove. The radian 'kinda' lifted off the seat a bit in the back, but now its totally right and my husband isn't smooshed. So, that wont change anything. We also have the older generation boulevard - the one that goes RF to 35lbs.

-We really like the 5 even thought is SUPER tight already with 4 people on road trips (and 2 dogs). We like that it is fuel efficient. That is one of the motivating factors in trying to make it work and keeping it. If we were to replace it, we would try to get a small suv that we could fit 3 across, but I think that will be hard to find and we will have to get a van or larger SUV and sacrifice the fuel efficiency. It will be a pain to get the kid in/out in the 3rd row - but also nice not to have car payments, which is the alternative...

-I dont think my son will want to turn back around (I mean we can force him of course, and might). He is a creature of habit - one of the reasons he never questions being RF when all his friends are already turned around. He also loves driving and I think he will LOVE being able to see everything and have a fit if after a year or so he looses that.

-So, some of you are saying, if we possibly replace the britax and don't use an infant seat, it might work. I know there is no way we can fit a 2nd radian in anywhere (you can't brace on the passenger seat, and it would have to, and its definitely too tall for the 3rd row). We will look into trying it out with some different seats.

Thanks again! We are going to play around with it more this weekend and I will repost some more questions, I'm sure, and ask for suggestions for cars that fit 3 across (any small SUV's/wagons)?

 

[mylittlet]

The thread above has 2 coccorros, 1 truefit and a radian (without the adjuster). She did move the middle row up 1 notch to get the coccorros to fit. I would look at a coccorro for the newbie.

Congrats on the addition!!

CPST in Iowa
mom to dd11y, ds10y, ds 5.5y (red monterey), dd 4.5y (cow frontier85), EDD 8/17/12 (who knows what??)

 

[legaleagle]

Oh, I meant to come back and post a few combos that *may* work, with a second row moved up a notch in some cases. I haven't tried any of these personally, but based on what I have tried and with a very helpful thread in the car safety section called "seats that fit in the mazda5" you can probably get one of these to work. Both older kids seats will need to be as upright as possible. This also assumes driver seat all the way back but passenger can move up a couple notchs.

D P
CCO Radian
New Britax (either side, apparently if you brace and have at 30 degrees the second row can be all the way back)

Radian with adjuster Truefit/new britax/maybe old britax (depending on how much room the passenger needs
CCO

Britax (old or new) (any not-huge seat for the baby)
Radian (braced, probably either side, depending on how far up you can move the second row)

And if you have 2 kids in the 3rd row, there are even more combos, but then almost no cargo space.

HTH!

adding: I'm sure there are plenty of other combos too, this is just working with the seats I already owned!

 

[tanusscott22]

I second that...see if a combi coccoro (CCO) would fit for the new little addition.

 

[samandel]

In case anyone is still following, I wanted to let you know that it fits!!!!! I can not believe it. We took advantage of amazons free returns policy and ordered a new Boulevard and a cocorro to play around with in the car. My husband put the new Britax in the 3rd row seat behind my older son's Radian (Drivers side). He had to unrecline the seat back of the 2nd row, which will give him a little less leg room, but that was the only adjustment that had to be made! Its a really good fit. Especially with the RF tether - it is really secure, and is barely bracing the seat. We didn't even need to try the Cocorro, because we know the infant seat we already have (a Chicco Keyfit) will fit behind the driver. We'll stick with that for the added option of being able to move baby, since there is *extra* room! It might also fit behind that seat in the 3rd row as well, and when the time comes we will play around with those 2 options to see which works best.

I'm shocked and amazed and we are so thrilled that we dont have to flip him around OR get a new car right now! I think this Mazda can last at least 2-3 more years, when we are in a much better position to afford a new car.

This is the 2nd time where this website helped us out so much. The first was choosing the Radian over a new Britax to keep my son RF a few months ago. Now that we see the new Boulevard, we are even more thrilled - it is so much shorter than the old Britax and he might have already outgrown it in height. He still has years left in the Radian.

Happy Holidays to all!