Britax Training 9/21/07

[brightredmtn]

Thank you so much that was great!

 

[cheerbop]

Fantastic, informative post! Thanks so much:thumbsup:

 

[rebeccah5]

:cool!:

I'm so glad you posted this! I feel much better about my Regent now.

So I wonder if, after they continue testing this new mold using the other installations, if it is possible that later down the road they'll OK other methods of installation for our "recline-bar-only" models...

 

[Simplysomething]

~~~~~~~

She talked some about the Fisher-Price products. Basically, that they're technically discontinued, but that Britax is depleting their inventory... which, I think we knew. She said the reason they didn't do well was that people didn't associate the name Fisher-Price with car seats, so it was like trying to break-in a whole new manufacturer. People didn't tend to notice the "made by Britax" part on the box.

She showed photos of the FPSVD and the MA bases without the rest of the seat attached, and you could tell that they are somewhat different.

Did she say anything else? I wished I'd thought of submitting questions when they were requested in the delphi forum. Dang it! lol


Maybe I (or someone else, who isn't afraid of the telephone. lol), should call them and ask--what about those of us with the Fisher-Price seats, what are we going to do when they run out of stuff, and we need new parts? Since, technically we aren't supposed to use the Britax named stuff on them.

ETA: Awesome post-- I forgot to add that. lol

 

[sb518]

Thank you so much for all of the great information!!!

 

[steph]

For lap-only belts, the belt should be routed under the LATCH bar on both sides. For lap/shoulder belts, it must be routed over the LATCH bar on both sides to allow the shoulder belt to pass through the FF lock-off. The seat is not crash-tested with the lap-only belt over the LATCH bar, so it's not recommended... even if the latch plate on the seat belt is too large to pass between the shell and the LATCH bar.

Thank you, that confirms that my Marathon can not in fact be installed in the center of my car when rearfacing.

So is this for rear facing or forward facing

 

[CDNTech]

So is this for rear facing or forward facing

It's for forward facing... AFAIK, there was no mention of rear facing from the reps.

 

[ignora]

Thanks for all the nice words. I guess I did take decent notes, but they also provided us with a packet that had all of the powerpoint slides printed out... so I was able to write in the margins and whatnot, but I didn't have to copy down everything. But, since I'm a new tech and have never actually installed a Britax (oh, the shame...), I felt like I needed to get as much info as I could to be as accurate as possible.

I wasn't sure if I should do one long post or several shorter ones, but it was just easier for me to do it all at once. Sorry, again, that it was so long... but I'm glad it was helpful in some way.

Anyway, I'll try to answer some questions. I'll have to do them in more than one shot because the site will only let me multiquote 5 posts at a time...

~~~~~~~~

I have a couple of questions.

1. RF tethering. How much of an angle from the seat does the tether need to be? I understand they don't want it going straight down to the floor, but small compact cars may not allow for a much bigger angle. You can see the tether in my siggy. It is not straight down, but it is not much of an angle either.

2. Energy absorbing tether. Can we request an energy absorbing tether and install it on a seat that came with a standard tether?

I called britax a few months ago and ask them, and they told me that if it was for a Boulevard, I could, but that I couldn't on my Marathon because Marathons don't come with energy absorbing tethers....she even put me on hold and went and asked somone.

1. She didn't say it had to be at any specific angle other than it can't be straight down or going under the seat. Yours is going out at an angle from the back of the restraint, so I think it's fine.

2. She didn't say if the rip-stitch tether could be retrofitted... and I didn't think to ask. However, the Marathon and Boulevard are listed as the two seats that come with it on one of the pre-printed powerpoint slide copies we were given. Then Sarah added that the Diplomat and Decathalon now also come with it. So, if the MA didn't come with it before, it does now and maybe they'll send you one. :shrug-shoulders:

~~~~~~~~

Was there any discussion about a combination booster seat in the works?

Also, I've heard from a few different people that "Britax tests their seats at twice the required speed" I've never passed that info on to anyone, because I have never heard it from a reliable source. From my own experiences with Britax (I attended one of these training sessions a few years ago) they do not give up that sort of detail about their testing. So...any more specifics about more severe crash testing than FMVSS 213? In other words if after listening to Sarah, would it be appropriate to tell a parent that the seat exceeds fmvss 213? If so, is there any more detail that can be added, explaining that?

Finally, does anyone know if they make a longer connector strap?(

When she told us the developers already have ideas in the works out to 2010, a convertible booster was one of the things she said she thought they were working on. Thanks for reminding me of that. I don't recall any other info on it other than that.

As far as the crash testing stuff... well, that's a hard call to make. You're right... she didn't give up a lot of crash-testing info. Again, we got a powerpoint slide that says the following:

Why Britax Products?

Testing beyond the standards

Additonal testing performed at Britax:

- Structural integrity testing performed using ATD of a larger size than the upper weight limit of the seat.
- Structural integrity testing using largest size ATD for the seat but using a more severe crash pulse than FMVSS 213.
- Side impact testing to substantiate side impact protection claims.
- In vehicle crash testing.
- Alternative attachment methods (3 point belt).
- Misuse testing (loose harness or belt).
- Durability cycled harness.

I think she also said something about testing @ 70mph when she was talking about using a more severe crash than required by FMVSS 213, but I didn't write that down. I'm relying on my memory for that, so take it for what it's worth.

I don't have any info about a longer connector strap...

~~~~~~~~

The info. on the Regent's new mold was the type of information we've been trying to get for months! Thank you very much for taking the time to type all of that out.

Yeah, I was happy to hear about that, too! But, it did make me wonder why they just didn't cough up that info in the first place. I mean, how hard would that have been? Sarah did say they took a lot of flack for the Regent advisory, but that they felt it was the right thing to do even though they weren't required to because the old install methods pass FMVSS 213 also. I think they would have had less flack if they had just explained about the new mold in the first place... and it wasn't like they'd be giving up any proprietary info by doing so.

~~~~~~~~

Wow.. I didn't read your whole post, but it looks like you summed it up pretty well. I had a blast. Sarah(mommy4girls) and I really enjoyed it.

NHCPSTECH Sarah did mention the d-ring strap briefly. She said that she is looking into it, but right now, there isn't a longer strap. Would be nice. I need a longer one for my Focus.

I know... it was kind of long-winded. I wanted to be thorough, though.

I was so excited to be able to go, too!! It was really fun meeting some internet friends.

Thanks for the d-ring strap info. She didn't mention that for us. See? That's why it's good to get input from other people that have attended other trainings... because different questions get asked and new info comes out. Cool. :thumbsup:

~~~~~~~~

My husband and I were just having a conversation about where Britax seats were made as we were tooling around Charlotte the other day. I would love to be able to tour their facility.

Actually, someone did ask if they ever do tours of the facility. She said they sometimes do and that they did some when Lifesavers was in North Carolina. It didn't sound like it was a regular thing, though. :thumbsdown:

 

[jaded]

Umm, she meant when FORWARD FACING. The LATCH bars don't matter when you are rearfacing..

However, the manual clearly shows the buckle having to go underneath the LATCH bar when rearfacing. At least my manual does, I have an '04 Marathon.

If I mis-understood it, I'm sorry, but I just really want confirmation that I'm going to need a different convertible seat than the Marathon I own. I'm pregnant, and am eventually going to need to use the Marathon rearfacing again, and the center is the only place it's going to be able to go, since I have 2 other kids who require the shoulder belts in my car. The buckle on the lap belt in my car is too tall(or wide) however you want to think about it, to fit under the LATCH bar.

 

[ignora]

I was talking on the phone to Heather at Britax on Friday about the Regent. She said that the old Regent passed certification with a final score of 7.5 ( out of a possible 10 ) and that the new Regent passed with a score of 8. Not that big of a difference actually.

It's funny you should mention that. Sarah said that it wasn't that the old Regent didn't pass FMVSS 213... because it does... but that the new Regent had slightly better results and they felt obligated to let people know. She used almost those exact same numbers, but made it sound like they were just a 'for instance'. She said something to the effect of "it was only a difference of a point or so... like if the old Regent passed with a 7 or 7.5 and the new one passed with an 8... but I don't know the exact numbers." She told us at one point during the day that she thinks they don't always give her all the specifics on some things because they're afraid she'll tell people.

~~~~~~~~

The boxes are also going to be in spanish. 2 sides will be english and 2 sides will be spanish and they are working on getting spanish manuals too.

Oh, and for the RF lock-offs that keep popping open, you can call Britax and get a fix to turn them 180 degrees, so that the hinge is to the back of the seat.. All the new seats will be coming with it like that anyway.

She didn't tell us about the Spanish stuff... good to know!

Yeah, I put that stuff about the lock-offs up there in my novel, but it's good to reiterate that. They'll be free for seats under warranty... but she also said that people with seats that are 2 or 3 years old would probably still get free replacement lock-offs under warranty. People with seats older than that might have to pay for new ones.

~~~~~~~~

For lap-only belts, the belt should be routed under the LATCH bar on both sides. For lap/shoulder belts, it must be routed over the LATCH bar on both sides to allow the shoulder belt to pass through the FF lock-off. The seat is not crash-tested with the lap-only belt over the LATCH bar, so it's not recommended... even if the latch plate on the seat belt is too large to pass between the shell and the LATCH bar.

Thank you, that confirms that my Marathon can not in fact be installed in the center of my car when rearfacing.

No, it's for FF seats only. I put FF up in the heading to that section, but I'm sorry if I didn't make it more clear.

~~~~~~~~

So I wonder if, after they continue testing this new mold using the other installations, if it is possible that later down the road they'll OK other methods of installation for our "recline-bar-only" models...

Ummm... you got me! I doubt, though, that they'll 'go back' after they made such a big deal about it with the advisory and all. You never know with Britax, though... they're always testing...

~~~~~~~~

Did she say anything else? I wished I'd thought of submitting questions when they were requested in the delphi forum. Dang it! lol


Maybe I (or someone else, who isn't afraid of the telephone. lol), should call them and ask--what about those of us with the Fisher-Price seats, what are we going to do when they run out of stuff, and we need new parts? Since, technically we aren't supposed to use the Britax named stuff on them.

Another 'I wish I had thought to ask' question... a really good one, too. I have no idea what they're going to do for people who need new parts down the road...

 

[jdchic3]

Thanks so much for the detailed information! There was one of these training sessions in Sacramento?!!!! I live right there! Gah! I would have loved to have gone!

 

[Jordynsmama]

Wow that was long. Good job!:thumbsup:
One question. I have a pre-enhancement regent bought in march or something...
What exactly are "enhancements" and how would you get them added I dont get that part.
So pre enhancement seats for a 47lb kid can be used sbp with tether and recline bar ....or the LBP with tether and recline bar?

 

[ignora]

Other stuff I've remembered or have been reminded about...

~~~~~~~~

Sarah said that the LATCH connectors on the seats with the LATCH bar come out of the box oriented for RF.

She also said that the connectors used to say 'driver side' and 'passenger side' on them, but that it was confusing to people because they thought it had to do with the seat itself and not the LATCH connectors. So, they stopped doing that (she didn't say when) and now the connectors just say 'Up' with an arrow.

~~~~~~~~

This is for Steph...

Someone on Delphi reminded me that it was brought up that the Advocate will be a "souped up Boulevard" that goes to 65 lbs... which is when Sarah said she expected lots of replacements for little things like the fancy lights going out. She did mention briefly during that discussion that the Advocate will be RF to 35 lbs and FF to 65 lbs. So, there you go.. :thumbsup:

~~~~~~~~

Britax will now be following the industry standard in their manual revisions regarding RF height limit. The manual will now say "The child is too tall when the top of the head is 1 inch from the top of the restraint."

~~~~~~~~

And, oh my gosh.... someone pointed out my rep for this post. Thanks everyone!! I seriously didn't expect that... I was just trying to be helpful. My little green square might eventually get a friend after all...

 

[ignora]

Thanks so much for the detailed information! There was one of these training sessions in Sacramento?!!!! I live right there! Gah! I would have loved to have gone!

Oh man!! I only found out by accident. One of the girls over on Delphi (she posts here, too, but not very often) is from my area. She posted about the training before I even became a tech. I probably wouldn't have found out, otherwise. It would be nice if Britax would posts Sarah's lecture schedule so that people who don't have access to a SK coalition or whatever can know about the trainings.

~~~~~~~~

One question. I have a pre-enhancement regent bought in march or something...
What exactly are "enhancements" and how would you get them added I dont get that part.
So pre enhancement seats for a 47lb kid can be used sbp with tether and recline bar ....or the LBP with tether and recline bar?

The 'enhancements' are the kit that Britax will send you (if they haven't already) if you call them and let them know you have an advisory period Regent. I know there's a longer LATCH connecter as well as some rubber grippy things you stick onto the bottom of the car seat... but I can't remember what else it includes. But, if you put the new things on, you have to abide by the new instructions, too.

I'm a new tech, so I'm not sure about what was allowed under the old instructions. But, under the new ones, a 47lb kid would use SBP and the recline bar. The tether is highly recommended but isn't required until the child is 50lbs. Unless using SBP with the lap/shoulder belt... in that case Britax requires the tether for all installations regardless of the child's weight.

If you want to know what was allowed under the old instructions, someone else will have to answer that... sorry I'm not more help in that respect...

 

[skaterbabs]

However, the manual clearly shows the buckle having to go underneath the LATCH bar when rearfacing. At least my manual does, I have an '04 Marathon.

If I mis-understood it, I'm sorry, but I just really want confirmation that I'm going to need a different convertible seat than the Marathon I own. I'm pregnant, and am eventually going to need to use the Marathon rearfacing again, and the center is the only place it's going to be able to go, since I have 2 other kids who require the shoulder belts in my car. The buckle on the lap belt in my car is too tall(or wide) however you want to think about it, to fit under the LATCH bar.

You do NOT have to pass the lap belt under the LATCH bars for REAR FACING. You DO have to pass it under for FORWARD FACING. While the illustrations show it under for both instances, the text of the instructions only requires it FF.

 

[crunchierthanthou]

Britax will now be following the industry standard in their manual revisions regarding RF height limit. The manual will now say "The child is too tall when the top of the head is 1 inch from the top of the restraint."

Interesting. I had noticied that in the Diplomat manual.

 

[steph]

This is for Steph...

Someone on Delphi reminded me that it was brought up that the Advocate will be a "souped up Boulevard" that goes to 65 lbs... which is when Sarah said she expected lots of replacements for little things like the fancy lights going out. She did mention briefly during that discussion that the Advocate will be RF to 35 lbs and FF to 65 lbs. So, there you go.. :thumbsup:

Woohoo!!!!:cool!:

Thanks

 

[jdchic3]

Did she say anything about discontinuing the Decathlon? I heard that they were on another board I think.

 

[safeinthecar]

:cool!:

I'm so glad you posted this! I feel much better about my Regent now.

So I wonder if, after they continue testing this new mold using the other installations, if it is possible that later down the road they'll OK other methods of installation for our "recline-bar-only" models...

Heather also mentioned that people finding incompatibility issues with the new instructions should call Britax and they will try to talk you through ways to work around it. IE: she told me that in some cars, it may be acceptable to not use the recline bar if the installation meets other criteria regarding the stability of the top of the restraint.

 

[ignora]

Woohoo!!!!:cool!:

Thanks

Hey, no problemo!

Did she say anything about discontinuing the Decathlon? I heard that they were on another board I think.

No, she never mentioned anything about discontinuing the DC... :shrug-shoulders:

Heather also mentioned that people finding incompatibility issues with the new instructions should call Britax and they will try to talk you through ways to work around it. IE: she told me that in some cars, it may be acceptable to not use the recline bar if the installation meets other criteria regarding the stability of the top of the restraint.

That's really good to know...

Hey!! Did you change your user name?