How many of us have own/do own or have encountered a short strapped Radian?

What is the procedure to have a short-strap RN replaced? I emailed Russ who then referred me to the Canadian distributor who then sent me a form and a letter/notice.

According to this notice/letter, I have 2 choices: return it to the retailer or send the seat (freight paid by me) to the distributor for inspection and possible replacement of the straps or replacement of the seat. What am I not clear is that it sounds like IU have pay freight for both trips.

Are you kidding me? At the weight of the RN, the returned shipping cost across the country - I might as well buy another Marathon instead, kwim?

Can someone tell me what they did or have been doing to get long straps or seats with long straps? And before someone suggest going to different CT to find one.. . I can't for 2 main reasons - 3 kids w/ an infant and CTs w/in 30 minutes driving are all out.

What to do? Thx

Tam I'm in the same boat!

That is crazy!!!
Hmm if you got the 99.00 deal I would still think it worth it to pay another 40.00 or so to ship it back to get a new 65 lb version and not a short strapped version.
But it still would bug me since that is not what they have been doing all along.

I would email them back saying it was a problem in their production & you'd be happy to send it back for exchange provided they pay for shipping. Otherwise you will use it as long as the harness fits & then ship it to TC for further investigation since it's cheaper to ship there since the distance is shorter, & your retailer is out of stock and won't be getting more in, so exchange through them isn't an option.

I would refuse to pay money to have a mistake fixed that the manufacturer a) knows about and b) has replaced for others free of charge.

They can just mail a pre-paid UPS label to parents if they're concerned about getting the seats back. I don't care what price parents paid for a seat, that doesn't change that the seat has a defect and the company needs to stand behind it. It's not the parents problem that they screwed up & parents shouldn't have to bear the expense as a result. If they were really concerned, they should've contact canadian tire, requested all august 2006 DOM's back and reimbursed Canadian Tire for the cost of the seats. :twocents:


Consumers don't have to pay money to a company when a seat is recalled to get a fix kit. Maybe it would be better for TC to just recall all seats with the affected short straps and then SK would have no choice but to replace the seats free of charge.

And I like Snowbird's idea much better :thumbsup:
The over nice make, things easy for others always comes out in me in these situations.

Wow, it was only a little over 2 wks ago that I emailed Russ and my new 65lb seat came about a wk later, no problems My sister and BIL just got a short-strapped one (thanks to my advise) and I got them all excited about getting a new one. They're in the middle of moving and waiting for baby #4 so they won't be dealing with it for a few wks, but I'd like to hear updates on what people are now being told so I can let them know what to expect.

supermommyof2 said:

Wow, it was only a little over 2 wks ago that I emailed Russ and my new 65lb seat came about a wk later, no problems My sister and BIL just got a short-strapped one (thanks to my advise) and I got them all excited about getting a new one. They're in the middle of moving and waiting for baby #4 so they won't be dealing with it for a few wks, but I'd like to hear updates on what people are now being told so I can let them know what to expect.

Click to expand...

Are you saying they sent you a new 65lb seat in replacement for a short strapped Radian, free of charge? If that's the case, it makes my situation even worse We received a used seat for our replacement which meant we had to clean it up, came in a damaged box which was left on our doorstep overnight (didn't know it was out there as I was in labour), it had an older DOM then our original and it has the old Safe Stop. Loser on all accounts - I emailed Russ and got nowhere. Just a flowery email about how he'll be there for me in 7 years should the seat have any issues? Yeah, ok - I guess he has a crystal ball.

As I just posted on the other thread, we are never buying any Sunshine Kids products ever again as this company is disorganized, inconsistent and dishonest.

Tiger

tiger926 said:

Are you saying they sent you a new 65lb seat in replacement for a short strapped Radian, free of charge? If that's the case, it makes my situation even worse We received a used seat for our replacement which meant we had to clean it up, came in a damaged box which was left on our doorstep overnight (didn't know it was out there as I was in labour), it had an older DOM then our original and it has the old Safe Stop. Loser on all accounts - I emailed Russ and got nowhere. Just a flowery email about how he'll be there for me in 7 years should the seat have any issues? Yeah, ok - I guess he has a crystal ball.

Click to expand...

I would keep fighting it until they send you a brand new seat. That is totally uncalled for. There is no reason to be sent a used seat at any time and I wouldn't use it knowing that it is used as the history of the seat is unknown. You could even bring that up to him or demand your money back

They sent you a used seat?!?! OMG!

How do you know it wasn't in an accident? You have no idea if it was dropped, the history, etc.

Oh, I'd raise holy hell.

tiger926 said:

We received a used seat for our replacement which meant we had to clean it up, came in a damaged box which was left on our doorstep overnight (didn't know it was out there as I was in labour), it had an older DOM then our original and it has the old Safe Stop.

Click to expand...

I'd BBB report that. However--did it come from Russ or did it come from TJs Kids in Vancouver? TJs Kids thinks nothing of used carseats (they sell them)...and I wonder if Russ knows how sketchy their Canadian distributor is?

-N.

tiger926 said:

Are you saying they sent you a new 65lb seat in replacement for a short strapped Radian, free of charge? If that's the case, it makes my situation even worse We received a used seat for our replacement which meant we had to clean it up, came in a damaged box which was left on our doorstep overnight (didn't know it was out there as I was in labour), it had an older DOM then our original and it has the old Safe Stop. Loser on all accounts - I emailed Russ and got nowhere. Just a flowery email about how he'll be there for me in 7 years should the seat have any issues? Yeah, ok - I guess he has a crystal ball.

As I just posted on the other thread, we are never buying any Sunshine Kids products ever again as this company is disorganized, inconsistent and dishonest.

Tiger

Click to expand...

That is totally unacceptable and sad re. the treatment you got. Based on a few things I now know and on my own communications with Russ and PJM on my short-strapped RN, I'm not impressed. They are still steadfast refusing to own up that it was a 'manufacture defect' but was intentionally done with the short-strapped for the 48-lbs seat.

Thanks to all for your concerns, but I posted on here with photos and about how I had to get Russ involved (doing all of this while giving birth, by the way!) because I wanted him to know about the shady seat we got. Several techs responded that they thought the seat was fine, and I should let it go. This bothered me since there are people on here who seem to continually bug Russ for straps, buckles, etc., yet we got an obviously used, banged up, etc. seat of some sort.

Sending Russ the photos did no good - he too had just had a baby (day before our baby) and seemed to be a bit out of touch, IMHO. He said after looking at the photos, that it was more than likely the conveyor belt, yet said he was surprised that they still had a seat with such a long DOM on it still in the warehouse. He gave me a whole song and dance about how it would be fine, but if is wasn't, he'd be here for us in 7 years time. Huh? We spent time cleaning and inspecting the seat (it came with a brown, sticky substance on back), and it's been installed since a few days after receiving it. Since the cover was in mint condition with labels attached (that doesn't mean anything since they could have been re-attached, but he didn't seem to want to consider this either), he said we had to keep it. I sent a very wordy response (I am an English teacher, so I wrote Russ several emails) after this, I've never gotten a response back to this day from Russ.

My hubby is still angry about it and we pray that this wasn't a used seat. We've thought about replacing it, but again, no Radians in our city, our daughter is too long for Marathon (she still fits in our baby's new Marathon, but just barely). Bottom line - we got shafted big time. Like I said, I've gone toe to toe with many companies as I'm known as an amateur consumer advocate, but Russ' lack of help here has really angered me and I don't know what else to do?

After reading these threads re: the new shipping policy for replacement seats, I feel sick to my stomach. Part of it is Sunshine Kids' horrible inconsistencies and part of it is the Canadian distributor (TJ's) for the nasty seat they sent us.

I seriously at this point don't know what to do, but with a newborn, and several sick relatives in hospital, I don't have a lot of time to be emailing Russ as he obviously was not concerned despite seeing photos of the seat they sent us. Basically he said since the manual and labels were attached, the seat must have just got banged up in the warehouse as he assured me that they don't re-use seats. Whatever.

Tiger who likes the Radian seat, but hates the company who makes it

tiger926 said:

Thanks to all for your concerns, but I posted on here with photos and about how I had to get Russ involved (doing all of this while giving birth, by the way!) because I wanted him to know about the shady seat we got. Several techs responded that they thought the seat was fine, and I should let it go. This bothered me since there are people on here who seem to continually bug Russ for straps, buckles, etc., yet we got an obviously used, banged up, etc. seat of some sort.

Click to expand...

I did a little search and here is the thread about this? With the hair and gooey stuff I would still be complaining. Did you have to send your original seat back?

Also, I think Russ does better with short to the point emails But I would still fight this and tell him that you will report them them to BBB.

tiger926 said:

I seriously at this point don't know what to do, but with a newborn, and several sick relatives in hospital, I don't have a lot of time to be emailing Russ as he obviously was not concerned despite seeing photos of the seat they sent us. Basically he said since the manual and labels were attached, the seat must have just got banged up in the warehouse as he assured me that they don't re-use seats. Whatever.

Tiger who likes the Radian seat, but hates the company who makes it

Click to expand...

Holy cow - as long as the stickers and manual are there? That's a rather naive statement. A seat could be used for stinking years and be returned with stickers & manual in tact so that means it's likely new if a new customer gets it?

How is it that TJ's kids can sell seats that have been used? I wonder if their insurer knows about it. I know shops around here like once upon a child etc. have quit selling used seats and consigning them for a few years now, I'm guessing due to liability concerns.

Do you think SK could be held liable if a kid was:

- transferred to a booster because at 40lbs the harness no longer fit in his radian seat due to strap length even though he had room to go til reaching the top slots
- got in a crash in the booster seat & then died?

If said kid's parents had planned to keep him harnessed as long as possible, but only switched to a booster because the harness didn't fit anymore? Since there are no other seat options on the market, a parent could be faced with this decision if they're not able to afford to ship the old seat back - or if they didn't realize some seats had short straps.

And I'm getting more and more irked by the turn around that the short straps were an intentional design when so many people have been told differently. And how do they explain DOM's older than Aug 06 not being affected, and none of the after that either? That's a lot of things they need to address. Not to mention it's likely the short straps wouldn't fit the 6yr old dummy in such a way that made the seat usable - somebody would've noticed when buckling the dummy in with short straps that the harness wasn't long enough. But I'd place money that the seat wasn't tested with the shorter harness straps.

So at this point they're trying to cut their losses, tick some people off & hope that everyone soon forgets/moves on and they never have to replace another short strapped seat again. Apparently there are enough short straps out there that it's more financially sustainable to lose business & customers than to fix a manufacturing defect they're now pretending was designed on purpose.

tiger926 said:

Thanks to all for your concerns, but I posted on here with photos and about how I had to get Russ involved (doing all of this while giving birth, by the way!) because I wanted him to know about the shady seat we got. Several techs responded that they thought the seat was fine, and I should let it go. This bothered me since there are people on here who seem to continually bug Russ for straps, buckles, etc., yet we got an obviously used, banged up, etc. seat of some sort.

Sending Russ the photos did no good - he too had just had a baby (day before our baby) and seemed to be a bit out of touch, IMHO. He said after looking at the photos, that it was more than likely the conveyor belt, yet said he was surprised that they still had a seat with such a long DOM on it still in the warehouse. He gave me a whole song and dance about how it would be fine, but if is wasn't, he'd be here for us in 7 years time. Huh? We spent time cleaning and inspecting the seat (it came with a brown, sticky substance on back), and it's been installed since a few days after receiving it. Since the cover was in mint condition with labels attached (that doesn't mean anything since they could have been re-attached, but he didn't seem to want to consider this either), he said we had to keep it. I sent a very wordy response (I am an English teacher, so I wrote Russ several emails) after this, I've never gotten a response back to this day from Russ.

My hubby is still angry about it and we pray that this wasn't a used seat. We've thought about replacing it, but again, no Radians in our city, our daughter is too long for Marathon (she still fits in our baby's new Marathon, but just barely). Bottom line - we got shafted big time. Like I said, I've gone toe to toe with many companies as I'm known as an amateur consumer advocate, but Russ' lack of help here has really angered me and I don't know what else to do?

After reading these threads re: the new shipping policy for replacement seats, I feel sick to my stomach. Part of it is Sunshine Kids' horrible inconsistencies and part of it is the Canadian distributor (TJ's) for the nasty seat they sent us.

I seriously at this point don't know what to do, but with a newborn, and several sick relatives in hospital, I don't have a lot of time to be emailing Russ as he obviously was not concerned despite seeing photos of the seat they sent us. Basically he said since the manual and labels were attached, the seat must have just got banged up in the warehouse as he assured me that they don't re-use seats. Whatever.

Tiger who likes the Radian seat, but hates the company who makes it

Click to expand...

I was one of the techs that said the seat looked okay from the pictures you posted. The brown sticky, gooey substance was incredibly small (quarter sized from the photos) and located on the back of the carseat near the bottom. It may very well have come from a conveyor belt, someone eating on the job, ect. Otherwise the seat looked fine from the pictures you had posted.

If I recall the DOM was only a month older than the seat you originally had, so I don't honestly think that is something to complain about.

The straps also tend to fold over rather quickly and leave marks where they fold when using them. If the seat had been used, we should have seen more actual evidence of use.

All of the above reasons and your original pictures is what led me to believe that the seat was okay to use.

I do think that you got bad customer service and I think the biggest problem is that you contacted the Canadian distributor first, who seems to be horrible to deal with. I honestly can't wrap my brain around the many people who got great customer service and how you got such poor service... it truly was incredibly strange what happened to you with the companies track record at that time (which was excellent).

aidensmom02 said:

I was one of the techs that said the seat looked okay from the pictures you posted. The brown sticky, gooey substance was incredibly small (quarter sized from the photos) and located on the back of the carseat near the bottom. It may very well have come from a conveyor belt, someone eating on the job, ect. Otherwise the seat looked fine from the pictures you had posted.

If I recall the DOM was only a month older than the seat you originally had, so I don't honestly think that is something to complain about.

The straps also tend to fold over rather quickly and leave marks where they fold when using them. If the seat had been used, we should have seen more actual evidence of use.

All of the above reasons and your original pictures is what led me to believe that the seat was okay to use.

I do think that you got bad customer service and I think the biggest problem is that you contacted the Canadian distributor first, who seems to be horrible to deal with. I honestly can't wrap my brain around the many people who got great customer service and how you got such poor service... it truly was incredibly strange what happened to you with the companies track record at that time (which was excellent).

Click to expand...

I agree with most of what you say, except the brown substance was much bigger than you stated - it was in several places on the back of the car seat and it was a considerable amount. We spent a great deal of time cleaning it and thoroughly checking the seat.

I agree that I just received bad customer service for the most part for whatever reason. Although I am very glad that we received a new seat for no charge, this is what they should have done since they caused this whole issue in the first place.

We hope that our seat will be ok as there really isn't anything else we can do. The mostly bad customer service (Lucy from the Canadian office was wonderful to speak with and Russ did get back to me promptly at first), added to the bad condition of our replacement seat, the inconsistencies on the part of the company and the whole short strap issue to begin with, is enough for us not to purchase another Sunshine product again - it's really too bad though as we really like this seat.

Tiger

This won't help people that can't get a new one from Canadian Tire (either cause they got it somewhere else, or because their CT doesn't have stock)... but I'll tell you my story.

I just found out I had a short strap when my 41", 43# DS no longer fit!!! I love the Radian, but come on!

So I phoned Russ, he told me to email him the info, he emailed that to the Canadian guy Brad, and Brad emailed forms and word documents with information.

From the word doc:
"We apologize for any confusion or inconvenience experienced with your Radian seat. We understand that your Radian seat may have been mistakenly advertised as a ’65 lb capacity’ seat, when it is really a 48 lb capacity seat. <editorial - I knew nothing about this>

Transport Canada recently increased the allowable capacity of harnessed child restraints to a 65 lb occupant. Anticipating this, Sunshine Kids phased into the Radian design longer harness straps and during a transition in manufacturing, some of the Radian48 models still had the original designed shorter harness straps installed. Please note, there is absolutely no compromise regarding the safety of Radian48 models with the original length straps. These seats can be identified by their 6 digit harness lot ID number (either 452280, 487599, 436235 or 493361) printed on a label sewn into the end of the car seat shoulder harness strap. <editorial - so they admit it!>

While the original harness strap length for the Radian48 seats was based on anthropometric data for average sized occupants from 5 to 48 lbs in weight, as well as measurements from anthropomorphic test dummies, some customers prefer the longer straps of the Radian65 seat. <editorial - my @$$!!!>

If you have a Radian48 seat with the original/shorter straps and you do not wish to have them, the most expedient remedy will be for you to return the seat to the retailer from whom you purchased it. This will insure that your issue is resolved immediately.

In an effort to maintain the highest level of customer care, we are offering a second option: Send back your current Radian seat (freight paid) to our facility in Vancouver, BC. After inspection and verification, we will then either replace the harness straps on your seat or replace your seat and send it back to you (freight paid). If you choose the option of sending back your seat, please let us know and we will forward to you the appropriate forms.

Again, we apologize for this inconvenience and also for any misunderstanding that may have been caused by a retailer’s advertisement.
"

I consider the vast majority to be BS... they're no longer replacing free of charge, it's just a "convenience" issue apparently, that I can't fit my WAAAAY within spec child into their seat even WITHOUT a winter coat.... grrrrrr.

So I went to Canadian Tire. They had a newer DOM in stock. I asked if they can do an exchange even though I purchased this thing MONTHS ago.... and you know what!!!! The answer was yes in 1 minute... they said that they actually have a 1 year warranty on almost everything in the store... except hockey sticks she said.

So within 10 minutes I walked out with a brand new one. :thumbsup:

Radian Car Seat = :thumbsup:
Radian Customer Service on this problem = Medium -->:thumbsdown:
Canadian Tire = :thumbsup::thumbsup:

It might not be a solution for some people, but if any one is thinking "but I bought it from CT MONTHS ago?".... go for it!

HTH!
MommaMea

hipmaman said:

What is the procedure to have a short-strap RN replaced? I emailed Russ who then referred me to the Canadian distributor who then sent me a form and a letter/notice.

According to this notice/letter, I have 2 choices: return it to the retailer or send the seat (freight paid by me) to the distributor for inspection and possible replacement of the straps or replacement of the seat. What am I not clear is that it sounds like IU have pay freight for both trips.

Are you kidding me? At the weight of the RN, the returned shipping cost across the country - I might as well buy another Marathon instead, kwim?

Can someone tell me what they did or have been doing to get long straps or seats with long straps? And before someone suggest going to different CT to find one.. . I can't for 2 main reasons - 3 kids w/ an infant and CTs w/in 30 minutes driving are all out.

What to do? Thx

Click to expand...

We understand that your Radian seat may have been mistakenly advertised as a ’65 lb capacity’ seat, when it is really a 48 lb capacity seat.

Click to expand...

What does that have to do with the harness in the top slots not fitting a child over 40lbs??

Transport Canada recently increased the allowable capacity of harnessed child restraints to a 65 lb occupant. Anticipating this, Sunshine Kids phased into the Radian design longer harness straps and during a transition in manufacturing, some of the Radian48 models still had the original designed shorter harness straps installed

Click to expand...

If this were true, why do the seats with DOMs before Aug 06 not have the same problem??

This is only proof that SK is full of crap!! How will we be able to believe anything they say anymore?

supermommyof2 said:

What does that have to do with the harness in the top slots not fitting a child over 40lbs??
If this were true, why do the seats with DOMs before Aug 06 not have the same problem??

Click to expand...

That's what irritates me the most... my child is ONLY 41", 43#'s... why doesn't he fit? That's not "inconvenient", that's a DEFECT!

supermommyof2 said:

This is only proof that SK is full of crap!! How will we be able to believe anything they say anymore?

Click to expand...

I'm not that impressed with the treatment of this problem as a "concern" and not a recall... but I still love the Radian... and would still suggest it, but gosh it's made life annoying.

A couple friends of mine are putting together a bulk buy of the new Radian Premier, trying to get wholesale. I just wish they went to 80lbs!

mommamea said:

That's what irritates me the most... my child is ONLY 41", 43#'s... why doesn't he fit? That's not "inconvenient", that's a DEFECT!

Click to expand...

Not according to Russ' latest email to me because it was not a manufacture defects.

I was not going to air emails between him and I, but I'm beyond being discreet for his sake...

Thank you for your email. The Radian48 harness straps are not a 'manufacturing defect'. The original lenght of the Radian48 straps were based on anthropometric data for average sized children 5 to 48 lbs in weight, as well as measurements from the ATD's (anthropomorphic test dummies) used in crash testing. While the decision was made to increase the length of the harness straps for higher capacity occupants, some of the Radian48 seats manufactured in August, 2006 were made with the original length harness straps. Our Canadian distrbutor is working to accommodate the preference of some people who prefer the longer strap length.

Feeding me the same crap as in the letter PJM sent.