Cosco Scenera - Outgrown Rear facing?

Angela · May 24, 2011

I know we always say a seat is outgrown rear facing when there's less than 1 inch of shell over their head. Does it actually state that anywhere in the Scenera's owner's manual? If not, is there anywhere we can point parents so they can see it for themselves?

featherhead · May 24, 2011

Angela said:
I know we always say a seat is outgrown rear facing when there's less than 1 inch of shell over their head. Does it actually state that anywhere in the Scenera's owner's manual? If not, is there anywhere we can point parents so they can see it for themselves?

Apparently the Scenera actually states that the seat can be used rear-facing until the head is even with the top of the shell.

Angela · May 24, 2011

featherhead said:
Apparently the Scenera actually states that the seat can be used rear-facing until the head is even with the top of the shell.

That's what someone is telling me. I looked in the manual and saw nothing about it, so thought I'd ask. Thoughts? Where does it say that in the manual?

Pixels · May 24, 2011

It's not in the manual at all. I just searched the manual of the 35 pound version for the word "head" and it's only in there once, talking about the midpoint of the child's head not going over the top. The Scenera is outgrown RFing if the child is over 35 pounds, over 36 inches, or the midpoint of the child's head (top of ears/eyes) goes over the top of the seat.

Angela · May 24, 2011

So what do we tell parents for rear facing? 36 inches, 1 inch from the top of the shell, or at the top of the head?

PunkyMonkey · May 24, 2011

Looking at mine right now it says on the side of the seat " DO NOT USE this child restraint if the midpoint of your child's head is above the top of the child restraint's back" but that's all it says anywhere on seat or manual about it and it's on the FF side instructions not on RF side instructions....? I would prob go with the one inch rule to be safe... I think I'll call their customer service.

Jillybeans5 · May 24, 2011

Someone should check the Scenera40RF's manual, when I bought that one it said the seat was outgrown RFing when the childs head reaches the top of the shell or something to that effect.

PunkyMonkey · May 24, 2011

Oops took me a while to type that lol sorry to be redundant to what was already said!!!

Pixels · May 24, 2011

Angela said:
So what do we tell parents for rear facing? 36 inches, 1 inch from the top of the shell, or at the top of the head?

If it's a 35 pound model, it's 35 pounds, or 36 inches, or midpoint of the head at the top of the seat. The one inch rule and top of the head do not apply.

The Scenera40 has different rules (I know that it has a 40 inch limit, for example) but the manual is not available online that I can find so I can't tell you what those rules might be.

Chely7425 · May 24, 2011

Pixels said:
If it's a 35 pound model, it's 35 pounds, or 36 inches, or midpoint of the head at the top of the seat. The one inch rule and top of the head do not apply.

The Scenera40 has different rules (I know that it has a 40 inch limit, for example) but the manual is not available online that I can find so I can't tell you what those rules might be.

Ok, if those are the rules do you just go by whatever happens first? What if the kids head isnt over the shell but they are over 36 inches? And does anyone ACTUALLY use the Scenera RF with no shell over the kids head?

KaiLing · May 24, 2011

"top of head not above headrest" with a picture on the side of the Scenera 40 RF next to RF belt path.

ETA: a flip through the manual and I can't find that info, nor the one that's on the FF belt path ("Midpoint of top of head below top of child restraint").

Pixels · May 24, 2011

Right, it's whichever happens first. In order to use the Scenera 35 rear facing:
Child must be over 5 pounds
Child must be under 35 pounds
Child must be over 19 inches
Child must be under 36 inches
Midpoint of the head must be below the top of the seat
Straps must be coming from at or below the shoulders

All of those must be true.

The child being under 36 inches pretty much takes care of the shell over the head for most kids. My DD is 35 inches and right about the one inch mark. It's been a while since I've put her in one. I'd be flabbergasted to see a 36 inch child whose ears were at the top of the seat.

The Scenera is just one of many seats that do not have the one inch (or top of head) rule. I can think of three other seats, by three different manufacturers, that also don't have a one inch rule.

Angela · May 24, 2011

Pixels said:
Right, it's whichever happens first. In order to use the Scenera 35 rear facing:
Child must be over 5 pounds
Child must be under 35 pounds
Child must be over 19 inches
Child must be under 36 inches
Midpoint of the head must be below the top of the seat
Straps must be coming from at or below the shoulders

All of those must be true.

The child being under 36 inches pretty much takes care of the shell over the head for most kids. My DD is 35 inches and right about the one inch mark. It's been a while since I've put her in one. I'd be flabbergasted to see a 36 inch child whose ears were at the top of the seat.

The Scenera is just one of many seats that do not have the one inch (or top of head) rule. I can think of three other seats, by three different manufacturers, that also don't have a one inch rule.

Thank you! What other 3 seats are you thinking of? I tend just to default to 1 inch from top of shell.

Carrie_R · May 24, 2011

Radian & CA, but CA is also Dorel so Pixels must have something different in mind.

Not sure what the others are.

So here's the logical follow-up question: *would* you use the Scenera to the top of the shell? I just lent S's parents a Scenera40RF as he hit 35lbs; he has 2" or so to the top of the shell and is only around 34" tall. I told his mom he had about an inch until they needed to get a new seat or turn him... they indicated they want to keep him RF but haven't gotten a new seat yet.

Pixels · May 24, 2011

The CA has the top of head rule. The Coccoro and ComfortSport (and Radian) were what I was thinking of. I believe there are probably more, but we have the one inch rule so ingrained in our brains that we don't even realize it when it's not there.

Angela · May 24, 2011

Carrie_R said:
Radian & CA, but CA is also Dorel so Pixels must have something different in mind. Not sure what the others are.

So here's the logical follow-up question: *would* you use the Scenera to the top of the shell? I just lent S's parents a Scenera40RF as he hit 35lbs; he has 2" or so to the top of the shell and is only around 34" tall. I told his mom he had about an inch until they needed to get a new seat or turn him... they indicated they want to keep him RF but haven't gotten a new seat yet.

Yes, I'm curious what other's would do too. Would you trust putting a child in a car seat rear facing when their head is at at or above the shell, if the manual says it's okay?

KaiLing · May 24, 2011

Carrie_R said:
So here's the logical follow-up question: *would* you use the Scenera to the top of the shell?

Yes. But I'm not a tech, and I'm looking at a very very clear image here next to the RF belt path telling me when to stop, with a red line and everything. Not 1", even, very clear.

(I'm also the owner of a seat that allows RFing above the shell, due to a difference in US / European standards, so I'm not your average user, for sure.)

christineka · May 24, 2011

I emailed dorel a few years ago for clarification. The avenue is tall, but still had the 36 inch rule. The cpst in the email said it could be used until 36 inches or the child's head was at the top of the shell. The ears thing is for forward facing. I can't see a 36 inch tall kid getting anywhere near the top of the avenue, though.

Angela · May 25, 2011

Hmm.... maybe I should do a little emailing today. The issue with that is then you're telling the parents to go against the manual, which I've been doing anyway by saying to go by the 1 inch rule. I'm definitely going to go through a few manuals and see what they say today. Does our spreadsheet say anything about the height limit or other rules? If not, maybe I should make up a list, so I know. Especially with the one's we see most often at checks.

joolsplus3 · May 25, 2011

Britax used to have the tops of ears rule for rearfacing, and most of the advocate/experts said that was a bad idea, due to belt stretch and harness stretch and ramping and possibly loose harnesses, that it's really a good idea to keep some shell over the head. There's even this lovely graphic showing head injury statistics to RF'ers... http://carseatblog.com/34/kim-im-here/ (likely because kids under one RF, and they are more fragile, but *contact with something in the vehicle* is known to be the biggest source of injury, so it's better to keep heads contained, IMO.
A Swedish seat with a footprop isn't going to dump down and allow ramping, so those seats can be used with the head above the top.
Britax retracted it's top of ears RF rule, I don't know why Dorel doesn't adopt it, it's SO much easier than measuring your kid and probably safer than allowing their head to creep above the top of the seat. Evenflo invented it, they are so clever with the little rules, aren't they?

Cosco Scenera - Outgrown Rear facing?

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