Cars affected by SuperLATCH loosening - Video included.

Let's keep this appropriate -- No bashing or flaming.

I'd like to be able to link a mass thread to NHTSA regarding which vehicles are affected by SuperLATCH, so I figured we'd make this it. :thumbsup:

This is my original thread regarding my problem.

Please post what vehicle (make, model, year) you have noted that is affected by SuperLATCH loosening.

Please also specify about your Radian -- RF or FF, outboard, inboard.




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Perhaps I'm just under the impression that "it would never happen to me". But it did. And I'm very upset and embarrassed with myself.

I have my RNXTSL installed FF outboard with LATCH in my '04 Grand Am. It's been there since I got the seat, so a month or two. ETA: This makes it sounds like it's been installed there without ever moving. I mean that it's been installed here, and taken out, numerous times, and I've never noticed a problem. The seat itself has been installed *here* for maybe a week or so. This morning I had to drive an hour each way to go pick up a kid, the kid who would be using my seat.

I moved the crotch buckle to the outer most position because it's been getting in the way. I obviously didn't notice a problem with the install, and I had my arm in the RFing belt path to move the crotch buckle. I didn't notice anything.

We got home and the kiddo got out of the seat. I decided to try to move the headwings down just a tad, as they were up a bit too high for my liking.

The back of the RN pulled off my vehicle seat.

I was very leery to check for movement. There was several inches of movement in my seat.

My installs are rock-the-car solid. I know it's not because it was not properly installed to begin with. It was the darned superLATCH.

Why didn't I notice the looseness? The stupid rubber grips on the bottom of the seat. :thumbsdown:

Video:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_r3fwy7vQU"]YouTube - MVI 0676[/ame]

Remember what I said? This is while I had a kid in the seat. For an hour drive. On the interstate. A FOUR lane interstate.

03 Ford Expedition Rearfacing, outboard, center, outboard (occurred at a faster speed outboard than center)

mid 2000 Honda Accord Rearfacing outboard

ETA:
I have contacted SKJP and filed a complaint.

For now, SKJP is just sending out non-SL LATCH belts. This poses a big problem because the old, push-style button LATCH straps are being sent to parents who are complaining. This is NOT acceptable! What happens if the old LATCH strap gets sent to a parent who isn't so car seat savy and they continue to use the non-SuperLATCH straps to the full limit of the seat? The old style straps are not meant to handle those extreme forces; the SuperLATCH straps are.

You can see in the pictures below that the SuperLATCH connectors were redone with more metal "tab" type things inside the connector which handle the higher crash forces. If a parent continues to use a non-SuperLATCH strap on a SuperLATCH seat (because after all -- It says right on their car seat, the car seat box, and the car seat manual that they can use LATCH to the full weight limit of the seat) there will be a big problem.



They need to fix it. Just put the OLD LATCH metal thing on it, so you have to push the button to loosen it.


Non SL on top, SL on bottom -- You can see that there's an actual button you have to push, whereas on the SL seats, you just lift the metal tab.








If you follow this link, you can see the vast differences between the SuperLATCH straps and the non-SL straps. There are definite differences. http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?p=1402105


Also, if you have not submitted a complaint to NHTSA, please do so. You can follow this link and fill it out online. https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/online.cfm


OR, you can print out this form and mail it in. The first one is the front, the second one is the back. When you print, print off the first one & then rethread the paper back through when you print off the second one, that way it makes it double sided.

http://www.car-seat.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8504&d=1288681141

http://www.car-seat.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8505&d=1288681141

2010 Nissan Sentra passenger outboard with a rf install. Happened twice over a four day period.
Called SKJP and received a new SL strap for my seat.
Filed a complaint with NHTSA.
Both SKJP and NHTSA are requesting the original SL strap.

Could I make a suggestion?

It would probably be useful for anyone who has written communication from SKJC to add those to this thread. I think the way this matter has been handled should be brought to the attention of NHTSA as well.

Posting on behalf of friend who is a CRST.

2006 dodge grand caravan. Captains chair. Rear facing. Canadian 2010 radian xt.

My SL straps continuously loosened when using rear-facing, outboard in a 2003 Ford Taurus. Also frequently when outboard rear-facing in a 2007 Ford Freestyle and noticed it happen once forward facing in the 2007 ford freestyle.

ks1978 said:

03 Ford Expedition Rearfacing, outboard, center, outboard (occurred at a faster speed outboard than center)

99 Saturn SL2 Center Rearfacing

mid 2000 Honda Accord Rearfacing outboard

ETA:
I have contacted SKJP and filed a complaint.

Click to expand...

A '99 Saturn SL2 doesn't have LATCH so I'm puzzled about how SuperLATCH loosened in that car when you would have to use a seatbelt for carseat installs in it? Were you copying this from a successful Radian install post perhaps that lists all the cars you've installed your Radian in and forgot to take the Saturn SL2 out here in this new thread?

2006 Ford Explorer RF outboard.
Radian is completely incompatible FF in this vehicle's 2nd row.

RF outboard (not allowed to use center for LATCH) in 2007 Kia Optima...its not even a matter of it loosening....you can NOT get it tight, because the superlatch hits the edge of the baltpath EXACTLY at the 90 degree angle, and therefore the superlatch, which needs the strap to be parallel to acheive a "lock" simply will not lock - at all, period. It's a complete incompatibility. A non-SL strap does not have the same issue.

Ok, so here's my story:

I have an XTSL RF behind the driver's seat in an '09 Chevy Express, (although the issue isn't resolved by putting it in any of the other 3 LATCH positions in the vehicle).

Once I realized that my seat WAS, in fact, having this same problem, I emailed Susan at SKJP. She forwarded my email on to Russ, who asked me to call him.

We played phone tag for a bit, and finally got a chance to talk this afternoon.

Russ asked me a lot of questions about exactly how it was installed, what position in the vehicle, where the locking mechanism landed with regards to the belt path, etc. He said he'd received a couple of other calls about a similar issue and he wanted to talk to an engineer about a possible fix before he told me to do it. So we hung up and he called me back a few minutes later, telling me his fix wouldn't work since they'd never crash-tested it that way. He was wanting to twist the one side of the LATCH connector a half-turn. I couldn't understand how that would work anyway, since it would put the locking mechanism on its back against the RF boot. (At least that's how I pictured it in my mind....maybe Russ had something else in mind.)

Ok, so that was a no-go. Then he's asking more questions....he wants a detailed description of exactly where the opening (where the belt goes in and comes out) of the locking mechanism hits the belt path. In my vehicle, it's right.at. the belt path. He asked if I could tighten it down more by pushing just on the corner of the RN to see if I could get the mechanism to go *inside* the belt path. But since I already had the seat as tight as possible, that was a no-go as well.

He decided that the issue was that the piece of webbing between the connector and the mechanism was just the right length to be a problem in my vehicle. It either needed to be shorter or longer. He said he was going to think about this for a few days and get back to me. He said they might have to make a few new straps with shorter or longer pieces of webbing in that spot for anyone else who might have my same exact vehicle. I asked what had been done in regards to other people who'd called with the same issue and he told me my issue was different. The other people's issue was solved by tightening the LATCH. He said they just hadn't tightened it enough originally. But since it's likely that there are other people in the country with my same vehicle, they'd make a few different straps in case this happened again.

I asked him about the new locking mechanism and why they couldn't just switch back to the old push-button type. He said that they had to completely design this new LATCH strap themselves since nothing currently on the market could withstand the level of crash forces it needed to to be able to hold in an 80 lb child. So no other connectors or mechanisms currently on the market would work.

I'm going to now file a complaint with NHTSA since this seems to be an issue needing to be addressed by someone outside of SKJP.

ETA: *complaint filed

Chex, your problem was exactly mine..the length of the webbing caused the latch to sit EXACTLY in the place where it enters the beltpath, therefore it WILL NOT stay locked. And that was with the seat in as tight as it could go. If the webbing were an inch shorter, or 3 inches longer(so it could be inside the beltpath), it wouldn't have been an issue...but because it is the exact length that it is.....it's a complete incompatibility.

Jeanum said:

A '99 Saturn SL2 doesn't have LATCH so I'm puzzled about how SuperLATCH loosened in that car when you would have to use a seatbelt for carseat installs in it? Were you copying this from a successful Radian install post perhaps that lists all the cars you've installed your Radian in and forgot to take the Saturn SL2 out here in this new thread?

Click to expand...

Yes, you are very right. No I didn't copy it, I was just thinking in my head of the cars I only install with seatbelt now! I've been keeping the SL seat in the Saturn because of that very reason. I just keep the XT in my car because I like the install better with latch... Next time, I might think before I post quicky. Thanks for catching that.

Also, I did not get any written communication from SJKP. I got a promise of a phone call and ignored on a previous occasion. I haven't really pushed the issue because I am using that seat in a car that doesn't have latch anyways.

ks1978 said:

Also, I did not get any written communication from SJKP. I got a promise of a phone call and ignored on a previous occasion. I haven't really pushed the issue because I am using that seat in a car that doesn't have latch anyways.

Click to expand...

Please e-mail or call SKJP again. If your seat has the same issue, they need to know. I can't use SuperLATCH in my vehicle for the child I bought the seat for either, but I still reported it so it's on record.

I have had the same problem in my car with the SL loosening. It happened when the seat was installed rear facing in the outboard position of my 2010 honda odyssey.

The Superlatch latchplate sits directly at the belt path, and while I can get it tight enough, the strap does not lock at all and immediately loosens when I touch it.

2009 Ford Flex, RF and FF. Works fine both ways with the regular LATCH strap on the non-SL XT.

rodentranger said:

Please e-mail or call SKJP again. If your seat has the same issue, they need to know. I can't use SuperLATCH in my vehicle for the child I bought the seat for either, but I still reported it so it's on record.

Click to expand...

I've been playing email tag with them this week. I first emailed them MONTHS ago and heard nothing back. This is irritating, because otherwise I LOVE the Radian, but it is hard to recommend this seat to friends when this many people are having issues with the latch.

Because I have been reading here and knew how things were being dealt with, I have not contacted SK at all about this.

05 Grand Caravan middle row bench seat both out board and middle rfing never used it ffing. In the middle it woul rock all over but out baord it would wedge its self between the seats so I dont know how long it was like that before I realized the webbing didnt look right and pinchd a very big fold in it yet the seat was wedged so bad it was still rock solid even after unhooking the latch
I kinda wish I had known this was a problem with the seat I thaught it was my van so I traded it with a friend.

05 Mazda Tribute. RF'ing outboard, center, outboard.
Contacted SKJP and was told I wasn't installing my seat tight enough (it's completely rock the car solid) was told that it has nothing to do with the ANGLE of the adjuster or the straps (where they hit in the beltpath) but that my seat just wasn't tight enough.
I have 2 Radian XTSL that both loosen.