LATCH in any SUV third row?

[wendytthomas]

@Wendy - I see that you are trying to keep all kids safe, but hounding a parent really isn't you business. This parent is doing just fine by turning his/her child around after 2 and at nearly 40 pounds. Furthermore, In an accident, a child can get hurt in either position. We had friends that had just turned their 2 year old around before a trip, where they rolled the vehicle. HP stated that had the seat been rear facing, the child would have died.

Hi unregistered,

Statistics, the NHTSA, and the AAP all recommend rear facing much longer. If you have studies and recommendations that show that forward facing after two is safer, I would love to see them.

Yes, kids can be hurt in either position. Statistically speaking they are significantly less likely to be hurt in 96% of crashes rear facing than they are forward. Carseats are about playing the odds. No seat and car combination guarantees 100% survival rates. But we do the best we can. Kids can die rear facing. They have. They can die forward facing. They have. Anecdotal evidence isn't really evidence, and a sample size of one isn't evidence either.

Infants and toddlers should ride facing the rear of the vehicle until at least 2 years of age. States may choose to adopt age 1 requirements immediately, and phase in a requirement to ride rear-facing until age 2 within 2 to 4 years, with provision for educating parents in the interim about the benefits of riding rear-facing as long as possible.

http://www.aap.org/en-us/advocacy-and-policy/state-advocacy/Documents/Child_Passenger_Safety_SLR.pdf

1 - 3 years1-3 Years
Keep your child rear-facing as long as possible. It’s the best way to keep him or her safe. Your child should remain in a rear-facing car seat until he or she reaches the top height or weight limit allowed by your car seat’s manufacturer. Once your child outgrows the rear-facing car seat, your child is ready to travel in a forward-facing car seat with a harness.

http://www.safercar.gov/parents/RightSeat.htm

Results: Children in FFCSs were significantly more likely to be seriously injured than children restrained in RFCSs in all crash types (OR = 1.76, 95% CI 1.40 to 2.20). When considering frontal crashes alone, children in FFCSs were more likely to be seriously injured (OR = 1.23), although this finding was not statistically significant (95% CI 0.95 to 1.59). In side crashes, however, children in FFCSs were much more likely to be injured (OR = 5.53, 95% CI 3.74 to 8.18). When 1 year olds were analyzed separately, these children were also more likely to be seriously injured when restrained in FFCSs (OR = 5.32, 95% CI 3.43 to 8.24). Effectiveness estimates for RFCSs (93%) were found to be 15% higher than those for FFCSs (78%).

(only children to 23 months were used in the study, but the researchers said the benefit didn't decrease after that right away, just that they only had kids up to that age in their study). http://injuryprevention.bmj.com/content/13/6/398.abstract

Severe crashes where rear facing has a proven benefit (frontal and side impacts) account for 96% of crashes. Severe rear crashes are relatively rare.

Check out the links here. http://carseatblog.com/5168/why-rear-facing-is-better-your-rf-link-guide/

Emphasizing to parents that this is likely more important than watching them at a pool, or buying outlet covers, or storing the knives somewhere safe doesn't mean I'm trying to beat a dead horse. I do try to stop before that point (not always successfully, but in rereading this two year old thread I don't think I crossed the line. If I did I can yell at myself two years ago, I guess). Just some parents honestly don't get that it's a big deal when it really is. Car crashes are the number one accidental killer of kids (http://www.cdc.gov/MotorVehicleSafety/Child_Passenger_Safety/CPS-Factsheet.html). This is a child passenger safety advocacy board. I'm a certified child passenger safety technician. If I didn't state best practice and the NHTSA and AAP recommendations I don't think I'd be a very good tech. Turning forward at two is the bare minimum. If the bare minimum is ok by you, you're the parent. If you're interested in a safer alternative, there is most certainly one.

Out of curiosity, unregistered, what made you respond to this thread two years after it happened? Why not one of the other threads about extended rear facing? Or another of my posts if you were coming after me specifically?

Wendy

 

[Admin]

@Wendy - I see that you are trying to keep all kids safe, but hounding a parent really isn't you business. This parent is doing just fine by turning his/her child around after 2 and at nearly 40 pounds. Furthermore, In an accident, a child can get hurt in either position. We had friends that had just turned their 2 year old around before a trip, where they rolled the vehicle. HP stated that had the seat been rear facing, the child would have died.

Yes, it is fine to turn a child front facing after they are 2 years old. We have no studies to determine any improvement in safety for rear-facing kids older than this, even though crash dynamics indicate all passengers would be safer when rear-facing.

We do often suggest best and/or safest practice to parents who inquire about their options here. Many are already restraining their children in a very safe manner, but it is not necessarily hounding them to mention that there might be an even safer method.

 

[maramarrie]

IIRC, the 2011 Honda Pilot has one set of lower anchors in the third row.

This started at least as early as the 2009 Pilot.

ETA: I just realized this was an old post and the car issue was resolved, sorry.
Unregistered poster: I think it is a very narrow view you hold to think that someone suggesting a safer alternative is bullying parents. Any parent should want to know what the safest options are, regardless of whether they choose to go that route. Yes, every parent makes his/her own choices for their kids; car seats, 2nd hand smoke, violent tv. The fact is, just because it's legal (or even beyond the minimum requirement) doesn't mean it's the safest. One thing might be "safe enough" but that doesn't make it the safest option. What is safe enough when we're talking about our kids? Wendy presented some facts based on current research. Research changes: 5 years ago it was different and 5 years from now it will be different. I'm sure some (and possibly you) will have a different opinion when laws start changing and standards raise to keep children RF well beyond age 2. Years from now, all who thought they were doing "just fine" back in 2013 and turned their kids around at age 2 will probably feel they could have done more. Our parents thought they were doing "just fine" to put us in a car seat at all.