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FF causing injury?
- Thread starter Stacy
- Start date
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fyrfightermomma
New member
WARNING: CHILD DEATH MENTIONED FROM INJURY
No links but let me tell you why I'm a tech today.
When I first started working for the fire department I was 18. This was in 2001. I had been on the job about two weeks. I was very very very very new. Fresh out of EMT school.
We got a call for a motor vehicle collision with a "child that wasn't acting right." Strange to say the least. We got on scene and a car had hit a tree at a fairly low rate of speed. Maybe 25-30(and most accidents they do slow prior to impact so probably even less than that). A good hit for sure, but we've seen way worse. There actually wasn't too much damage. It's what we call "moderate damage". No interior damage to the car. No other injuries. Mom and an aunt were walking around uninjured. However mom had a child in her arms and was screaming hysterically. We couldn't tell what she was saying. I took the child out of her arms and could tell right away he was what we call PNB. Basically not breathing and had no pulse.
We started CPR and kept trying to get out of mom what happened. It was a relatively low speed crash and not much damage. There was a child seat in the center of the car. We couldn't figure out why this child needed CPR. Did he have a medical condition that caused mom to swerve? Was he eating something and choked on the impact? We had no freaking clue!
We kept doing CPR and trying to figure out what was going on. Finally a police officer calmed mom down. She said he was fine. He was in his car seat and buckled and also mentioned she had been at the police department to get it installed the week before. After the accident she looked behind her and he was slumped over. She took him out of the car and that's when we came.
We still were baffled but kept doing CPR. However, he just didn't look right. His head just wasn't right. It moved too easily. Something just wasn't right. After an hour of working on him, we called the doctor at the hospital who okayed us to pronounce him dead. I will never ever as long as I live forget that moment I told that mother her child was dead. The screams will haunt me forever. We worked so hard to try to save him. She begged us to keep trying. There was nothing to try. She finally understood. We cried with her. giant big macho firefighters and all. We all circled around his body and prayed with her. Everyone was sobbing. It was a horrible day. I decided to stop firefighting after that call.
After I took 4 months off thankfully I realized this is what I want to do with my life and got back into it. 9 years later I'm still going strong!
A week later the medical examiner came to the firehouse with the autopsy report to give us his finding. He stated he had something called internal decapitation. I had never heard of it prior to this. He said basically in his own words "this injury only happens when a child or adult is forward facing. Had he been small enough to rear face he'd be alive." Now this was in 2001 where rear facing a 2 year old wouldn't and couldn't happen due to the seats that were out then. He was probably about 30 pounds and honestly there weren't too many seats or info out there about RFing.
The police officer who installed the seat looked at it and said it was still properly installed and the investigation determined the child was properly restrained in it.
So while this child couldnt be saved because of the technology of the time, it is possible now.
It's a day that changed my life and changed how I view CPS. I didn't have the opportunity to become a tech until two years ago, but at that first chance I knew this was my passion and I would not let that little boy die in vain.
So that's my story
No links but let me tell you why I'm a tech today.
When I first started working for the fire department I was 18. This was in 2001. I had been on the job about two weeks. I was very very very very new. Fresh out of EMT school.
We got a call for a motor vehicle collision with a "child that wasn't acting right." Strange to say the least. We got on scene and a car had hit a tree at a fairly low rate of speed. Maybe 25-30(and most accidents they do slow prior to impact so probably even less than that). A good hit for sure, but we've seen way worse. There actually wasn't too much damage. It's what we call "moderate damage". No interior damage to the car. No other injuries. Mom and an aunt were walking around uninjured. However mom had a child in her arms and was screaming hysterically. We couldn't tell what she was saying. I took the child out of her arms and could tell right away he was what we call PNB. Basically not breathing and had no pulse.
We started CPR and kept trying to get out of mom what happened. It was a relatively low speed crash and not much damage. There was a child seat in the center of the car. We couldn't figure out why this child needed CPR. Did he have a medical condition that caused mom to swerve? Was he eating something and choked on the impact? We had no freaking clue!
We kept doing CPR and trying to figure out what was going on. Finally a police officer calmed mom down. She said he was fine. He was in his car seat and buckled and also mentioned she had been at the police department to get it installed the week before. After the accident she looked behind her and he was slumped over. She took him out of the car and that's when we came.
We still were baffled but kept doing CPR. However, he just didn't look right. His head just wasn't right. It moved too easily. Something just wasn't right. After an hour of working on him, we called the doctor at the hospital who okayed us to pronounce him dead. I will never ever as long as I live forget that moment I told that mother her child was dead. The screams will haunt me forever. We worked so hard to try to save him. She begged us to keep trying. There was nothing to try. She finally understood. We cried with her. giant big macho firefighters and all. We all circled around his body and prayed with her. Everyone was sobbing. It was a horrible day. I decided to stop firefighting after that call.
After I took 4 months off thankfully I realized this is what I want to do with my life and got back into it. 9 years later I'm still going strong!
A week later the medical examiner came to the firehouse with the autopsy report to give us his finding. He stated he had something called internal decapitation. I had never heard of it prior to this. He said basically in his own words "this injury only happens when a child or adult is forward facing. Had he been small enough to rear face he'd be alive." Now this was in 2001 where rear facing a 2 year old wouldn't and couldn't happen due to the seats that were out then. He was probably about 30 pounds and honestly there weren't too many seats or info out there about RFing.
The police officer who installed the seat looked at it and said it was still properly installed and the investigation determined the child was properly restrained in it.
So while this child couldnt be saved because of the technology of the time, it is possible now.
It's a day that changed my life and changed how I view CPS. I didn't have the opportunity to become a tech until two years ago, but at that first chance I knew this was my passion and I would not let that little boy die in vain.
So that's my story
firemomof3
New member
Wow, thank you for sharing that story. Its heartbreaking 
2BunniesMommy
Well-known member
Keep in mind that when correctly installed and used, a front facing 5-point harness seat provides very good protection. The vast majority of serious injuries to kids in any type of child safety seat are in extremely severe crashes, due to misuse or just some extremely uncommon failure or fluke.
That said, we know rear-facing seats are inherently safer, primarily because they tend to keep the spine and head in alignment and also keep the head from moving outside the shell in the most common and severe frontal and side impacts.
So, it's great to encourage extended rear-facing. But also consider the resistance you get from parents, even friends and relatives. Using fear as a tactic is an age-old method of getting a response. The problem is that we don't want the response to be that parents become afraid of front facing seats, because they do protect very well. For every parent that gets the right message and turns their 2-4 year old rear-facing, it's quite possible another will slap them in a booster or just a seatbelt. Some won't know any better, others just don't want to go back to rear-facing. I've seen lots of these parents and there's no way their kid is going back to RF. Fear will most likely just make the situation worse.
Using tragic stories and accounts is not a bad way to promote a cause, but do so carefully because they results may not always be the ones you want!
That said, we know rear-facing seats are inherently safer, primarily because they tend to keep the spine and head in alignment and also keep the head from moving outside the shell in the most common and severe frontal and side impacts.
So, it's great to encourage extended rear-facing. But also consider the resistance you get from parents, even friends and relatives. Using fear as a tactic is an age-old method of getting a response. The problem is that we don't want the response to be that parents become afraid of front facing seats, because they do protect very well. For every parent that gets the right message and turns their 2-4 year old rear-facing, it's quite possible another will slap them in a booster or just a seatbelt. Some won't know any better, others just don't want to go back to rear-facing. I've seen lots of these parents and there's no way their kid is going back to RF. Fear will most likely just make the situation worse.
Using tragic stories and accounts is not a bad way to promote a cause, but do so carefully because they results may not always be the ones you want!
jeminijad
New member
Because of this, I am trying to stick with the good old simultaneous FFing and RFing crash test vids. They show what happens to a neck very clearly without the terrible anecdotes.
Of course, the anecdotes surely worked on me!
That last story is just... beyond upsetting, but a very good reminder of why I am doing what I am doing w/DD.
Of course, the anecdotes surely worked on me!
That last story is just... beyond upsetting, but a very good reminder of why I am doing what I am doing w/DD.
Stacy
New member
I understand what you mean, it really wasn't my intention to scare people off by asking this question, really just some information for myself to ponder over. Perhaps I should have posted this in the Coffee Break forum?
Now that I think about it, perhaps a mod could move this thread?
It's up to you, but your post was perfectly fine and in the right forum. My comment was just a general one on the topic- sorry!
fyrfightermomma
New member
Agreed. I have no clue *why* my case happened. It wasn't a severe accident. It must have just been the right circumstances and a fluke as you put it.
That being said, I"ve been on many many many accidents since then with children. Pretty much all forward facing if they were past infancy. Except for two other cases (non survivable crashes) none of the other kids were seriously or fatally injured.
So like Darren said, a properly used 5 point harness is very very safe. The cases of injury from FFing is rare, but does exist. There are many other forward facing children who fare just fine.
I just wanted to share my experience and how it got me doing what I do, and believing what I believe. Despite my experience I am still not in the "rear face as long as you can" camp believe it or not
I'm glad you found your way into the profession, fyrfightermomma. I can't imagine how difficult that scene must have been. It's frustrating to know what needs to be done (and we knew back then rf was safest), but not have the technology to do it.
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