Question What would you do? Radian vs. M70

I've been stalking this site for over a year now but just recently signed up more-so because I'm debating car seat questions and I really am just desperate for more input and info.

So my first question ever for you ladies involves my 20 mo. old son. Up until yesterday he's been in a Radian XTSL in my Odyssey. My biggest issue with the Radian until recently has always been that the back of it seems to slip and slide more than my DD's Marathon ever did even though it didn't move at all at the belt path and in all reality did have a good install. That seemed to be lessened with the purchase and use of the Sunshine Kids brand grippy seat protector thing. [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Sunshine-Kids-Grip-Seat-Gripper/dp/B00081L2R6/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1305747718&sr=8-8"]This[/ame] Although it still moves at the top back more than I'm used to even with a great install and the use of the tether.

In the past couple weeks, though, it has been brought to my attention the concerns surrounding the SuperLatch. Mine has never loosened by getting him in or out, or even me leaning on it to reach over to help my DD get in. However, I noticed that because the seat sits so low and the place where the SL buckle sits right next to the seat as soon as DS decides he wants to put his feet on the outside of the seat it would be shockingly easy for his tennis shoes to catch the SL and have it 'let go' or loosen while we are riding in the car without me ever knowing it. So because it kind of freaked me out a bit I first tried to see if I could move the Radian or somehow tighten the SL so that the buckle was hidden underneath kind of in the path for the SL strap. It worked, but barely and I'm still not super confident in the seat or the company based on how they've handled the whole thing so far.

So I borrowed the Marathon 70 that my MIL had for DS and installed that yesterday. Now I'm really torn. I feel like the LATCH is much safer on the M70 than the Radian. And I like how much easier it is to get that rock-solid install in the M70. However, I prefer the seat on the Radian. It seems more sturdy to me. In the M70 once it's in tight the top of the shell seems to bend a bit. Like it kind of starts to twist or something. But the Radian is solid and stiff-even though it slips more than I'm used to. Does that make sense? Neither seat budges at the belt-path but the back of the radian seems to slip a bit. The M70 doesn't slip, but the shell seemed wobbly and flimsy? Also, DS's feet don't even touch the vehicle seat when he's in the Radian but they do and his legs must start to bend a bit in the M70.

Originally I thought that I would just keep borrowing the M70 until either SK somehow fixed the problem or my birthday in Sept. when I *hopefully* would get enough gift $ so I could purchase another M70 for DS then. But now seeing how flimsy the shell is on the M70 I don't know which is worse? A problem that we haven't even run into yet on the Radian, and could possibly be avoided if I could get a good and tight install with the seatbelt? Or a seat that seems to be flimsy and wobbly in comparison and could be outgrown earlier? I used to have the for both seats, thinking that they were both the bee's knees. But now comparing them in person, side-by-side, in the same vehicle seat, one right after another, now I'm not quite happy with either.

If you were me, what would you do? Is there another option I'm not considering?

If you haven't yet, please file a NHTSA complaint about the Superlatch slipping. It seems to be happening in a lot of Odysseys.

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

Honestly, I'd keep the seat you're most comfortable with. LATCH isn't any safer than a seatbelt, provided they both function properly. I have an XTSL and I never install with the SL strap. My vehicle isn't new enough for the Super to be relevant and I don't mind a belt install anyway. My sons are 32 and 38 lbs, and I have a 40 lb limit on my LATCH.
You don't check for movement anywhere but at the beltpath, so movement at the top of the seat is irrelevant. Untethered rf seats will move.
Personally, if your goal is to rearface as long as you can, I'd go with the Radian and install with the seatbelt if you don't trust the SL. If your goal is to have a seat that is easy to move around and installs fairly easily, go with the MA70.

Can you get a good seatbelt install?

Stelvis said:

Can you get a good seatbelt install?

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I haven't tried it yet. I was hoping to meet with a good car seat geek friend of mine who's also on here for someone to look over my shoulder the first time as I've only ever installed DD's M65 with a seat belt and never the Radian before. Where as she used to have a van that didn't have LATCH and she's VERY used to installing multiple seats with belts. I'm kind of hoping that it goes in nice and solid with the belt and it's not as big of a PITA as I'm imagining it to be. Then I think I might just stick with the Radian as then I won't have to borrow MIL's M70 and have that over my head.

Other thing that I just remembered is that once baby comes in October both DD and DS will be moved to the 3rd row with baby behind the driver and the other middle seat removed. So I suppose since there is no LATCH in the 3rd row I'm going to have to use the seat belt anyways. Maybe I'll just wait to see which one has a better seat belt install and stick with that seat. Either stay with the Radian or save up for the M70. So much to consider! I still have to come up with the $ for baby's seat, too. Which I'm hoping will be a Britax Chaperone.

I would wait and see first what you can do with the seatbelt. Also techs please correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't the grippy seat protector things generally not recommended?

In my 03 Ody, I could only get a good install with the seatbelt for the first few tries. Then I don't know what happened, the LATCH was finally just the right length that I could just snap the seat on and off and finally got no movement (pulling the cover up and out of the way so you can pull the LATCH or seatbelt UP and IN the seat helps a lot, pulling out off to the side doesn't make it tighten as well). It's really a learning curve to get that seat in as tight as you want it to be, RF. It won't install RF in my third row at ALL, but it's fantastic FF with the seatbelts. A trick you can use with the Ody is the seatbacks recline...recline them a little, install the seat, then upright them again to make a good install a little more solid and better.

Stelvis said:

I would wait and see first what you can do with the seatbelt. Also techs please correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't the grippy seat protector things generally not recommended?

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I know they aren't ideal, but I thought that if you got the kind that was the same brand/label/came from the same company as the seat it was ok? I'm really hoping that's the case at least

joolsplus3 said:

In my 03 Ody, I could only get a good install with the seatbelt for the first few tries. Then I don't know what happened, the LATCH was finally just the right length that I could just snap the seat on and off and finally got no movement (pulling the cover up and out of the way so you can pull the LATCH or seatbelt UP and IN the seat helps a lot, pulling out off to the side doesn't make it tighten as well). It's really a learning curve to get that seat in as tight as you want it to be, RF. It won't install RF in my third row at ALL, but it's fantastic FF with the seatbelts. A trick you can use with the Ody is the seatbacks recline...recline them a little, install the seat, then upright them again to make a good install a little more solid and better.

Click to expand...

I'm assuming your speaking of the Radian? Glad to hear that you got a good seatbelt install -although I'm really hoping that I can do so in my 3rd row. I just remembered that when baby comes in October DS and DD will be bumped back there anyways and I don't have LATCH back there, just tether points.

I do use the seat-back trick when installing the Radian b/c is is a little slippery-er on the bottom if that makes sense at all. Recline the seat, strap the thing in as far as possible with as tight as install as humanly possible (I even have DH climb in there and kneel on the thing to make sure the vehicle seat is as compressed as possible) and then when I'm comfortable with the install propping the back of the vehicle seat back up so it tightens it even more. But that still doesn't give me as solid an install as I'm used to getting with the two Marathons.

I'd just like a tech to give you the go-ahead on the sticky mat. SKJP does make some aftermarket car seat products that are not at all safe to use (Mighty Tite for example).

I tried to install the Radian in my van this afternoon ('04 Odyssey) with little success. Neither my friend nor I were able to get it in RF with a safe install. And my friend was able to get it in FF but it wasn't easy and with my pregnant belly I wasn't even going to try. If she says it's not easy then I'm sure I couldn't do it. She's a car seat goddess. So my plan was to sell it and use the $ to go toward another M70 so I could return my MIL's but now I see SK issues a news statement about replacement SuperLatches? So I'm thinking I'll hold off on posting it for sale and see if I feel safe with the replacement.

Thanks everyone for your input and suggestions. I helps to have such a great sounding board!

Grippy seat protectors aren't recommended, as it can give a false sense of security on the install. Even a SKJP product isn't always safe with their seat (case in point, the mighty tite). If you want something on the seat use a receiving blanket or thin towel laid flat that is your safest bet.

They issued the statement about replacement Superlatches, but as of yet no one seems to have received one...I have heard that the SL issue and the inability to get a good seatbelt install are both really common in Odysseys. You did file a NHTSA report, right?