Upright RF seats/3 across/2 RF side by side... Help!

Starlight · Mar 6, 2007

I've got a friend that needs to fit 2 RF seats, plus a booster seat, in the rear of her extended cab pickup.

It's one of those that has the 1/2 doors that pull to the back, and has real seats. Shoulder belts outboard, lap belt middle. The drivers side rear back door doesn't work, so all kids have to go through the passenger. Yes, this is a PITA.

3 kids:
5 yr old, 40ish lbs, 42 ish inches. Has been boostered for atleast 1.5 yrs.
2 yr old, itty bitty. Maybe 25 lbs soaking wet. Not sure on height.
8-9 months old, 19 lbs, long, but short torso. Fits in the Snugride w/ about 2 inches.

Seats... HB TB, Car Go (not sure which one) w/ out harness, Evenflo Tribute or Vanguard or Titan, I'm not sure. It's the super cheap one available to techs in a 2 pack, and the nearly outgrown Snugride.

If this truck has retractable belts, I can't get them to work. I fiddled with the latchplate, and wasn't able to get them to lock. I'll check the manual tomorrow.

Anyway, right now, she's got the booster on the drivers side, next to the broken door, the Evenflo crap in the middle w/ the 2 yr old RF, and then the baby in the Snugride on the pass side. Problem is, Mom can't sit in the front like that, and she hates the Snugride.

I've already shown her the Scenera, and I'm going over in the morning to play w/ her seats and my Scenera.

Does anybody have any (budget conscious) suggestions for narrow, 3 across, 2 RF side by side, still-allow-Mom-to-sit-in-the-front-seat seats?

If I can't get this to work, I can try in their other car, which is a Daewoo 4 door sedan. It really really is a questionable vehicle, prone to breaking down at will, so the truck, as crappy as it is, is better.

(If you've got through my novel, Thank you! If you have suggestions, YAY! And yes, they need a new vehicle. I'll tell them again.)

lynsgirl · Mar 6, 2007

It's one of those that has the 1/2 doors that pull to the back, and has real seats. Shoulder belts outboard, lap belt middle. The drivers side rear back door doesn't work, so all kids have to go through the passenger. Yes, this is a PITA.

First question - are there headrests at all back there? If not, then budget or not, I honestly don't recommend any rear-facing seats that can not be tethered. If they're not tethered, they're going to rebound right into the glass. I can pretty much guess that the center position does not have a headrest, so obviously, regardless of if there are OB headrests, at least one of the RF children will need something that can be tethered.

Second question - what year is the truck and what make/model (if you know off-hand)?

3 kids:
5 yr old, 40ish lbs, 42 ish inches. Has been boostered for atleast 1.5 yrs.
2 yr old, itty bitty. Maybe 25 lbs soaking wet. Not sure on height.
8-9 months old, 19 lbs, long, but short torso. Fits in the Snugride w/ about 2 inches.

Seats... HB TB, Car Go (not sure which one) w/ out harness, Evenflo Tribute or Vanguard or Titan, I'm not sure. It's the super cheap one available to techs in a 2 pack, and the nearly outgrown Snugride.

Ok. If the 5yo can sit still and stay in position, than the HB TB should be fine. Usually, even though they're not very deep, depth-wise, truck bench seats are pretty wide across, so I think it'll be ok for fitting 3 seats.

I've already shown her the Scenera, and I'm going over in the morning to play w/ her seats and my Scenera.

Does anybody have any (budget conscious) suggestions for narrow, 3 across, 2 RF side by side, still-allow-Mom-to-sit-in-the-front-seat seats?

The Scenera's a good idea for the outboard position, if there are headrests. If it doesn't fit, I would honestly try the Uptown. Even though it's a bit taller, sometimes that works better in a tight fit like that, since the top of it hits higher than the shorter-shelled seat. And both of the RF kiddos are not newborns, so should be ok with a more upright install.

Can they come up with the money for possibly 1 or 2 Radian 65s?

If I can't get this to work, I can try in their other car, which is a Daewoo 4 door sedan. It really really is a questionable vehicle, prone to breaking down at will, so the truck, as crappy as it is, is better.

It's so tough to figure out the best way for everyone in situations like this, but it's also a good brain-working challenge

. It's so great that she has you to help! If the situation with the truck is different than the way I'm leaning in my post, just correct my line of thought and I'll probably have more ideas

. But then again, so will lots of other great people here!

Starlight · Mar 6, 2007

Headrests outboard, yes.

But, there is absolutely no way that the Radian would fit RF back there, and ditto w/ the MA.

IIRC, it's a Dodge Ram, late 90's - pre LATCH.

Jewels · Mar 6, 2007

Okay, I know this may not be the most ideal suggeston, but I do know I got a good install with a graco Comfortsport in the back middle of the RAM, and I have gotten a Chase (FF) in the middle as well. So if the Comfortsport fit with my DH and I on either side with plenty of room I don't see why the Scenera wouldn't work. When I had the Chase in the middle I easily got the MA (FF) behind the driver as well with my DH on the other side of the Chase.

So I am thinking maybe a Apex for the oldest (don't know if it will work, might be too big), and maybe two Sceneras RF?

I think the Radian would fit but only FF and that doesn't help for a RF seat but it would work for the oldest with two Scenera's.

If they are wanting to keep the oldest in the TB then maybe two Scenera's would work the best

If they have the front centre console down I would guess a MA would fit there RF, but finding a tether spot might be hard to find (sure you could do it though). That would be the spot where you would likely want the RF tethered seat too! And I would but the bigger child in there.

lynsgirl · Mar 6, 2007

starlight said:
Headrests outboard, yes.

But, there is absolutely no way that the Radian would fit RF back there, and ditto w/ the MA.

IIRC, it's a Dodge Ram, late 90's - pre LATCH.

Jewels had a great suggestion with the Apex for the oldest, if that interests them. If they could do that, it could go in the center. OR the Radian FF in the center and two RF Sceneras. I like that idea better than my next train of thought, which was to FF the 2yr old in the center, even though I am definitely all about RF to the max. Would she consider re-harnessing the 5yo?

Jewels · Mar 7, 2007

lynsgirl said:
Jewels had a great suggestion with the Apex for the oldest, if that interests them. If they could do that, it could go in the center. OR the Radian FF in the center and two RF Sceneras. I like that idea better than my next train of thought, which was to FF the 2yr old in the center, even though I am definitely all about RF to the max. Would she consider re-harnessing the 5yo?

I think there is only a lapbelt in the back middle. Plus the back driverside door is broken so I am thinking that might be a pain to put one in RF there

Starlight · Mar 7, 2007

There's no headrest in the middle, so the Apex is a no go, plus how would the RF kid get to the seat behind the driver?

This is an evil, evil carseat problem.

mominabigtruck · Mar 7, 2007

I would put the two year old ffing in the middle, the oldest in the turbo booster on the drivers side and the baby on the passenger side rfing. The evenflo seats will actually install really well rfing in a truck because of the super flat seat so I would put the baby in that and then see about getting the two year old a dedicated ffing seat, maybe a cargo or chase.

Starlight · Mar 7, 2007

Is the consensus that the itty bitty 2 yr old is better FF then RF in front of the window?

That doesn't seem right.

lynsgirl · Mar 7, 2007

starlight said:
There's no headrest in the middle, so the Apex is a no go, plus how would the RF kid get to the seat behind the driver?

This is an evil, evil carseat problem.

LOL you know what? I woke up this morning thinking that I'd said such a dumb thing! Of course the Apex can't go in the middle! It's sad when I wake up actively thinking on those lines (shaking my head)

. Off to catch up on the rest of this hehe.

lynsgirl · Mar 7, 2007

starlight said:
Is the consensus that the itty bitty 2 yr old is better FF then RF in front of the window?

That doesn't seem right.

I hate even saying that, but almost, yes. The older/heavier/bigger a child is, obviously the force of their rebound will be greater. Planting my toddler's face into a glass window isn't high on my list, kwim? And honestly, when we had a crew cab truck with headrests only in the OB positions, I kept ds2 outboard while he was RF, since all I had for him at the time was either a Touriva or an EF Horizen and he was 2 and 3 yrs old when we had that truck. I didn't have a decision to make regarding putting someone teeny FF early, though

IF they can get a Radian for the oldest, then I don't see that it would be too terrible to get a RF child behind the driver. You can usually flip the driver's seat forward and I've buckled a RF child from above/behind before. Not terribly fun, but it can be done. And the FF child can either get in between the RF seat on the passenger side and a flipped forward passenger seat OR come in from the front (is it a bench in the front or separate seats?). If a Radian is out of the question, than yes, I'd put the 2yo FF in the center

.

I totally hesitate to recommend any of the EF convertibles because they don't adjust well at all. And in that kind of a set-up, adding any more inconvenience is certainly not desirable. You're right that this is a bad carseat situation. I hope it can get figured out well!

Oh hey! Regarding the Radian, techs can get a discount. I believe it's $129 + shipping for the 65, if that would help them.

Jewels · Mar 7, 2007

lynsgirl said:
I hate even saying that, but almost, yes. The older/heavier/bigger a child is, obviously the force of their rebound will be greater. Planting my toddler's face into a glass window isn't high on my list, kwim? And honestly, when we had a crew cab truck with headrests only in the OB positions, I kept ds2 outboard while he was RF, since all I had for him at the time was either a Touriva or an EF Horizen and he was 2 and 3 yrs old when we had that truck. I didn't have a decision to make regarding putting someone teeny FF early, though

What about if it were a MA RF and tethered? Would you still opt for FF or the side?

lynsgirl · Mar 7, 2007

Nope, if it was a tethered RF convertible, that changes things

. It's all about not rebounding into that glass

. I was thinking that a MA was probably out of the question, though, since it seems budget is an issue. If they could get a tethered seat RF in the center, that would be great!

Starlight · Mar 7, 2007

I'm on the phone with her now, she's thinking the 2 yr old is closer to 20-21 lbs, and about 32 inches tall.

And she is wearing 18-24 month clothes.

She is itty bitty.

We're going to fiddle today, and try the Radian in the middle.

Neither of us are comfortable putting the 2 yr old FF, especially when she is about the size of my 10 month old. We'd never even consider putting him FF, I can't see doing it to another child his size.

Jewels · Mar 7, 2007

lynsgirl said:
Nope, if it was a tethered RF convertible, that changes things . It's all about not rebounding into that glass . I was thinking that a MA was probably out of the question, though, since it seems budget is an issue. If they could get a tethered seat RF in the center, that would be great!

I was thinking if they could get a MA and tether it RF then they could keep the oldest in the TB (I think they want to keep her in a booster), the second oldest in the middle in the RF MA tethered, and the baby outboard in a Scenera. I only put the second oldest in the middle because the MA seat shell is taller but it really wouldn't matter as long as she had room in the Scenera

Of course the Radian might work instead of the MA, it is worth a try!

Jewels · Mar 7, 2007

starlight said:
I'm on the phone with her now, she's thinking the 2 yr old is closer to 20-21 lbs, and about 32 inches tall.

And she is wearing 18-24 month clothes.

She is itty bitty.

We're going to fiddle today, and try the Radian in the middle.

Neither of us are comfortable putting the 2 yr old FF, especially when she is about the size of my 10 month old. We'd never even consider putting him FF, I can't see doing it to another child his size.

WOW, she is tiny!

nisi · Mar 7, 2007

lynsgirl said:
Nope, if it was a tethered RF convertible, that changes things . It's all about not rebounding into that glass . I was thinking that a MA was probably out of the question, though, since it seems budget is an issue. If they could get a tethered seat RF in the center, that would be great!

Just echoing Amy here. As far as I know this isn't addressed in the training anywhere, but I think most techs would agree that it is preferable to put a toddler ff when rf would make rebounding into the back window a possibliity. From her height and weight, she's probably right on the verge of where I personally would be uncomfortable rf-ing her in this vehicle (unless it was tethered to prevent rebound)

Evenflo Tribute or Vanguard or Titan, I'm not sure. It's the super cheap one available to techs in a 2 pack

That's the Tribute. Not my favorite seat, but it's pretty narrow and usually easy to install.

So... my first choice would be to get a hwh for the 5yo (radian? FPSVD?), put her(?) in the middle, then get a Scenera and put the other 2 kids rf outboard - 1 in the Scenera and 1 in the Tribute. Yes, it'll be a pain to buckle the rf-er behind the driver, but if you want the safest solution...

Barring that, leave the 5yo in the TB behind the driver. If she can possibly manage a rf-tetherable seat, put the 2yo in that in the middle and the baby in the Tribute behind the psgr.

If she can't get a rf-tetherable seat, then they have a choice to make. They could put the 2yo rf behind the psgr and the baby rf in the middle FOR NOW. If he(?) has a short torso, and the seatback isn't too low, the baby might be small enough to not be in much danger of contacting the glass on rebound. Obviously not a permanent solution because babies do grow

but it might buy enough time to save up for a rf-tetherable seat or replace the vehicle with something more family friendly. If they go that route, I recommend somethign for the baby that sits really low, like maybe an Enspira or baseless Intera, and leave the 2yo in the Tribute.

If they aren't comfortable doing that, which would I totally understand, then get get another seat for the 2yo and ff her in the center.

Starlight · Mar 7, 2007

Re: Upright RF seats/3 across/2 RF side by side... NO HEADRESTS! Help!

Well, I'm here, and I've had a better chance to check things out.

There are no headrests in any of the seats. None.

The Daewoo is apparently being sold, so this is the only car option.

The Scenera does fit really well though. Very nice, actually.

I've been sharing these posts with Mom, and I'll let her make the call.

Starlight · Mar 7, 2007

Okay.

I took Mom outside, demonstrated to her the rebound/cocoon thing, and she's not happy. She can maybe see (but doesn't want to) turning the 2 yr old FF, but does not want to turn her son that early. I had convinced her that it was 2 yrs and 30 lbs for FF, so she thinks 1 & 20 is way to young, LOL.

SOOOO, she's on her way right now to go get the daewoo. For now, atleast until it's sold, they'll use it, and we'll cross the next bridge when we get there. A suburban is in their future, hopefully sooner rather than later.

So, wish me luck in getting 2 RF seats, plus an outboard booster (only lap belt in the middle still) in this car. This shall be fun.

I do have my MA and Radian, if push comes to shove, I can demonstrate the Radian in the middle, and talk her into it. Lets hope it doesn't come to that, as they really don't have the funds right now.

Thanks everyone for all your help.

Upright RF seats/3 across/2 RF side by side... Help!

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