Update! Frontier 90 tether issues....

[snowbird25ca]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

Someone asked if any manufacturer addresses "v" tethers earlier up thread. GM has addressed it in their manuals since at least 2007.

General rule of thumb with a tether is not to interrupt it's natural path. I wouldn't prematurely join the top tether together to put it between the poles of the head rest - either side, yes - or remove the headrest completely, but I wouldn't join it together to slide it under the headrest.

Hopefully an answer from Honda comes up for this...

 

[bnsnyde]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

I thought between the posts was its natural path. It seemed so natural.
I never even thought anything of it while installing, until this post. Is there a certain was the tether should be installed? I can change it, of course.

 

[LISmama810]

Someone asked if any manufacturer addresses "v" tethers earlier up thread. GM has addressed it in their manuals since at least 2007.

General rule of thumb with a tether is not to interrupt it's natural path. I wouldn't prematurely join the top tether together to put it between the poles of the head rest - either side, yes - or remove the headrest completely, but I wouldn't join it together to slide it under the headrest.

Hopefully an answer from Honda comes up for this...

Has Britax ever chimed in on that?

 

[tl01]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

Has Britax ever chimed in on that?

I'm waiting for that. Sent photos and a description....

 

[snowbird25ca]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

Has Britax ever chimed in on that?

I've never heard them say anything - it would actually be nice if there was that guidance in their manuals. I'm glad that GM provides the good guidance in that regard in their newer vehicles.

And no, putting it between the headrest posts isn't going to be natural path in most cases. (I won't say all since I haven't seen all vehicle seat combos.) In most cases though, the tether anchor is quite a bit lower down on the vehicle seat back and without the headrest in place the top tether would sit quite a bit wider than if it was passed between the poles.

Tethers are in some ways this really gray area - vehicle manufacturers test their anchorages and tell you how to route the tether, and car seat manufacturers test their seats top tethered - but there aren't all sorts of different tether anchors on the bench.

Britax has said they don't allow their tethers to be attached with 180* turn the way Ford SUV's ask you to. It would be great if there was a statement about premature joining of the tether - but then where would that leave people if they were splitting hairs about between posts under the headrest and under the headrest but outside of posts?

When manuals only address single tethers, I really think some common sense is important when it comes to versa tethers, but it sure would be nice if there was some direct guidance on the topic. (Which again - hard to do unless you have vehicle manufacturers in agreement...)

 

[tl01]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

I've never heard them say anything - it would actually be nice if there was that guidance in their manuals. I'm glad that GM provides the good guidance in that regard in their newer vehicles.

And no, putting it between the headrest posts isn't going to be natural path in most cases. (I won't say all since I haven't seen all vehicle seat combos.) In most cases though, the tether anchor is quite a bit lower down on the vehicle seat back and without the headrest in place the top tether would sit quite a bit wider than if it was passed between the poles.

Tethers are in some ways this really gray area - vehicle manufacturers test their anchorages and tell you how to route the tether, and car seat manufacturers test their seats top tethered - but there aren't all sorts of different tether anchors on the bench.

Britax has said they don't allow their tethers to be attached with 180* turn the way Ford SUV's ask you to. It would be great if there was a statement about premature joining of the tether - but then where would that leave people if they were splitting hairs about between posts under the headrest and under the headrest but outside of posts?

When manuals only address single tethers, I really think some common sense is important when it comes to versa tethers, but it sure would be nice if there was some direct guidance on the topic. (Which again - hard to do unless you have vehicle manufacturers in agreement...)

So tonight when I went to install my frontier 90 again I did something different. I did it with the headrest and really tightened the tether and then removed the headrest (since it seems to push the headrest of the seat forward which causes head slump from my son and wakes him up plus I don't like how it is constantly straining the frontier headrest) and then I tightened the tether at the same time as I removed it and the tether seems to be staying a little better. We haven't used the seat yet but I'm hoping it will work out better this way.

I also followed up with Britax today but they didn't write back. I'll call in the morning.

 

[tl01]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

Someone asked if any manufacturer addresses "v" tethers earlier up thread. GM has addressed it in their manuals since at least 2007.

General rule of thumb with a tether is not to interrupt it's natural path. I wouldn't prematurely join the top tether together to put it between the poles of the head rest - either side, yes - or remove the headrest completely, but I wouldn't join it together to slide it under the headrest.

Hopefully an answer from Honda comes up for this...

Sorry... For some reason I am not completely following the paragraph about the general rule of thumb. Could you elaborate just a little more? Are you saying you wouldn't put it through the posts and wouldn't remove the headrest? So leave the headrest and let the tether follow its path with the headrest in place?

I'm curious if anyone can elaborate on what GM says. I don't have my LATCh manual with me.

 

[snowbird25ca]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

Sorry... For some reason I am not completely following the paragraph about the general rule of thumb. Could you elaborate just a little more? Are you saying you wouldn't put it through the posts and wouldn't remove the headrest? So leave the headrest and let the tether follow its path with the headrest in place?

I'm curious if anyone can elaborate on what GM says. I don't have my LATCh manual with me.

I might have a picture of my manual, if not I can take one over the weekend.

By not interrupting the natural path of the tether, I mean don't take the V, and make it come together faster than it otherwise would. If the natural width where it's coming over the seatback is narrower than the headrest posts, then I'd go in between the posts. If it's wider, I'd go on the outside of the headrest posts. As for leaving the headrest on or off, I'd go with whatever the vehicle manufacturer says to do or whatever gives you the best fit. Taking the headrest off is an easy solution to avoiding the decision of "between" or around the posts of the headrest, but not something I'd advise for or against unless the vehicle manual stipulated leaving the headrest on or off etc. (I have seen vehicle manuals say the headrest must be on when a top tethered seat is installed there, so it does happen.)

Keep in mind that I say general rule of thumb for a number of reasons:
- top tethering is required with all ff'ing harnessed seats in Canada, so it has to be attached
- vehicle manuals often aren't present, so the "how to route" part of a vehicle manual often isn't available
- general rule of thumb increases the likelihood that someone without a vehicle manual is going to route the tether the way the vehicle manufacturer wants it routed.

There are always exceptions in this, but the versa tethers create a bit of a unique circumstance because most vehicle manufacturers simply don't address them. I really wish they all did.

 

[Syllieann]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

My 07 also says to route the tether under the headrest. I have ff bv70 in capt chair now. When routing under headrest and behind handle its nice and tight and the posts keep it where it goes. I tried routing outside the posts since that seemed more direct with the way the angle worked out but the strap ended up right on the release lever and I could slide the headrest out, which concerned me wrt projectiles. So, I have it under the headrest and I've had no interference from ff seats but idk what I would do if the headrest did interfere.

 

[Athena]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

I'd also be surprised if the V shaped tether, especially the new wider 90, falls inside the vehicle headrest unless it's being held inside there by an attached vehicle head rest. My vehicle head rests are off and our 90's tether falls well outside of the holes for the head rest, something I noticed because it's so far out that it interferes with the middle seat belt. Of course, with two outboard seats that middle position is useless anyway. At least one of our vehicles explicitly states to remove the vehicle head rest when the tether is being used for this very reason that they might interfere with each other.

 

[tl01]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

Late yesterday, Britax wrote back and they want me to send pics of my seat with the headrest holding the tether to contrast the photo I sent of it without the headrest. I'll send them on Monday.

 

[tl01]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

I sent the new pics today. I'll update when I hear back.

 

[tl01]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

Okay... Finally talked to Britax again this morning.

They said not to route the tether through the headrest posts. She also said to remove the headrests because I sent pics showing how the headrest does push the frontier headrest out of its natural position by about 3/4 of an inch. She said to just tighten the tether as normal over the seat back of the car. She said it shouldn't slip off... But clearly it does and I told her it does. I told her I think they should consider this in their next seat design. This seat back is wider than the one on my sienna and I'm still having issues even with no one riding in back to knock it off.

I'm just going to be diligent about making sure the tether is in place.

 

[ketchupqueen]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

It absolutely does slip off with many vehicle seats. I think we should all send in pics when it does.

 

[tl01]

Re: Frontier 90 tether issues....

It absolutely does slip off with many vehicle seats. I think we should all send in pics when it does.

I think that is a great plan.