News Fed. Law keeps Volvo from offering safer child seats

BookMama

Moderator
SO it could very well be the footprop that caused the denial.

Lena

I'd say that's unlikely, as there was a U.S. infant seat a few years back that had a foot prop, and it was approved according to the FMVSS regulations. (It was the Baby Safe by Britax.)
 
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twinsmom

New member
The parents of The little boy Joel who broke his neck in a frontal crash at city speed at 15 months old and 33 lbs was given permission by NHTSA to legally import and use this seat for Joel. They can be imported legally if you have a child with disabillites that call for RFing past 35 lbs. without regard to a car comp. list.

This is why I'm skeptical about the whole "Swedish seats are incompatible with US cars" argument. If the govt will allow the seats under certain medical conditions, do they really have the fear that the seat is unsafe or incompatible with US cars, or is it more of a political issue.
 

Evolily

New member
This is why I'm skeptical about the whole "Swedish seats are incompatible with US cars" argument. If the govt will allow the seats under certain medical conditions, do they really have the fear that the seat is unsafe or incompatible with US cars, or is it more of a political issue.

When a child gets a waver basically it says the child cannot be safely restrained in any seat on the market. Which allows parents to choose to import seats- but that doesn't mean they are safe in those seats. I believe (although I'm not certain) that the waver also allows the child to be completely unrestrained in the vehicle.
 

UlrikeDG

Admin - CPS Technician Emeritus
I'd say that's unlikely, as there was a U.S. infant seat a few years back that had a foot prop, and it was approved according to the FMVSS regulations. (It was the Baby Safe by Britax.)

Is it possible that the BabySafe passed FMVSS without the foot, but Britax required it anyway?
 

Pixels

New member
The MT does not use LATCH or Isofix. It is a belt installed seat that installs pretty much the same way that you would install a Marathon RF with LATCH. seatbelt route is the same (through the front of the seat)
Not having LATCH is sufficient to fail FMVSS testing. It's required on harnessed American seats.

Is it possible that the BabySafe passed FMVSS without the foot, but Britax required it anyway?

Yes, this.
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
This is why I'm skeptical about the whole "Swedish seats are incompatible with US cars" argument. If the govt will allow the seats under certain medical conditions, do they really have the fear that the seat is unsafe or incompatible with US cars, or is it more of a political issue.

It's no different with certain medications or medical treatments. If someone has no other alternative, they may be able to get an exemption to have a procedure or medication that has not been tested or approved by the FDA. That doesn't mean it is safe or unsafe, it just means they are giving special permission in a case where they may have no other suitable option.

It is political to some extent. Of course the government could basically say that anyone can import any child seat not tested or approved to our standards. Then why not allow domestic models to be sold without passing certification requirements too. Regulations and standards do serve a very important purpose. In some cases they do need an update. In other cases, companies simply choose not to have a model certified because they know it won't pass or feel it would be too expensive based on the projected sales. That's also not the fault of the government.
 

twinsmom

New member
It is political to some extent. Of course the government could basically say that anyone can import any child seat not tested or approved to our standards. Then why not allow domestic models to be sold without passing certification requirements too. Regulations and standards do serve a very important purpose.
Yes, but I think there is a difference between a seat not passing any standards vs. passing another reputable standard. It would be nice if there was some reciprocity between the US and EU standards.

I stand corrected about the medical waiver.:eek:
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
Re: Volvo introduces ERF car seats for their vehicles , up to 6 yrs old

yeah... but volvo has known this longer than this internet forum, and has considerably more clout behind what they say.

I don't think this forum invented the fact that necks and spines take longer to develop and younger children should rearface because of it. Neither did Volvo. They should not be credited with knowing the truths of physiology, rather it would be more credible to say something like 'medical experts' are behind it all, no?
 

southpawboston

New member
Re: Volvo introduces ERF car seats for their vehicles , up to 6 yrs old

I don't think this forum invented the fact that necks and spines take longer to develop and younger children should rearface because of it. Neither did Volvo. They should not be credited with knowing the truths of physiology, rather it would be more credible to say something like 'medical experts' are behind it all, no?

well, medical experts may know mor about developmental physiology, but regarding the safety relationship between RF and children's musculo-skeletal development, i'd actually say volvo is more qualified to comment than medical experts, as they are the ones that did all that research before anyone else.
 

UlrikeDG

Admin - CPS Technician Emeritus
Re: Volvo introduces ERF car seats for their vehicles , up to 6 yrs old

:thumbsdown: What about the new AAP recommendations??

It didn't turn out to be new AAP recommendations. It was just a press release about a study we already knew about that was (understandably) miss interpreted an official policy change.

(Bolding mine.) Yeah... because Volvo is the only one who's ever stated that. :rolleyes:

The article doesn't imply that Volvo is the only one or even that Volvo is the most preeminent expert on child safety. The author is merely citing her source for this article, which was Volvo. If I interviewed Julie for something I was writing, I might say, "Some parents prefer for their children to ride in the trunk, but Joolsplus3 says that's not the safest place for kids." Sure, there may be dozens of other "more credible" sources for the same information, but I got it from Jools, so that's who gets the credit in my article.
 

Pixels

New member
Re: http://www.autoblog.com/2009/04/27/followup-nhtsa-to-allow-vehicle-specific-child-seats-after-all?

The article is implying something that isn't true. NHTSA hasn't said anything that would lead a careful reader (who had read the entire thing of what NHTSA said) to believe that they will allow vehicle-specific carseats. What they said is that they basically want to expand on their current ease-of-use rating system, and have the vehicle manufacturers recommend some seats (at various price points) that work well in their vehicles. They're talking about using the already-available, universal carseats to do this. They didn't say anything about changing the standards to allow vehicle-specific mounting systems.
 

TechnoGranola

Forum Ambassador
Cars used in Sweden are virtually the same as cars used in US, Canada, Germany, Australia etc. In reality, it's very rare to have a Swedish seat not fit in a vehicle. Exceptions might be if trying to install a large seat in a very tiny car or installing a seat in the middle rear where the car has a large "tunnel" (foot prop might not work properly). It's simply very rare for a Swedish seat not to fit into a car of any nationality.
Someone said earlier that the reason certain Swedish seats could never be approved here is because they could only be installed with the seat belt and not with LATCH. And NHTSA requires a seat to install with both. So, it doesn't seem like a fitment issue per say, but rather that the seats (some? all? at least the Volvo ones in question) don't offer LATCH as an additional install method as per the NHTSA.
 

UlrikeDG

Admin - CPS Technician Emeritus
I'm pretty sure the previous generation of Volvo seats could be installed with LATCh/ISOFIX only. They had an ISOFIX base which was installed first, then the seat (infant or convertible) was secured to that. As far as I could tell, there was no seatbelt installation option. The new generation isn't due for release for a few more months. We'll have to wait and see how they are installed.
 

TechnoGranola

Forum Ambassador
I'm pretty sure the previous generation of Volvo seats could be installed with LATCh/ISOFIX only. They had an ISOFIX base which was installed first, then the seat (infant or convertible) was secured to that. As far as I could tell, there was no seatbelt installation option. The new generation isn't due for release for a few more months. We'll have to wait and see how they are installed.
Ah okay. I was thinking of the MultiTech when I posted that as members here have said the MultiTech can only be installed with seat belt.

I guess if something can only be installed with LATCH/ISOFIX, then it also wouldn't meet NHTSA criteria since it needs to be able to be installed with the seat belt as well, correct?
 

Wineaux

New member
And you aren't going to see seats that RF beyond 40 lbs in the US until NHTSA certifies LATCH beyond 40 lbs! Look at the new Graco MyWay65... It has a 40 lb RF weight limit. Why that number? Because that is the max weight allowed by LATCH, and in order to pass FMVSS 213 standards the seat has to be usable in all installation methods per the NHTSA memo. LATCH is the real troublemaker here, and always has been. As a standard it totally sucks. There has been poor implementation and it has not had any substantiative revision since it was introduced. It needs to be certified to 65 lbs soon!
 

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