Another wwyd? Monet TF vs. Flair MR (pic heavy)

I can't decide what to do and need your professional help. DD will be 4 in December, is nearly 42" tall, and around 35lbs. My original plan was to rf her till 40lbs in a Malibu XT, but sadly (very, very sadly) it will not install in our van (with room for a front passenger), so that is out. She ff from around 2 to around 3, then went back when I discovered this board, and just turned ff again. In our primary van she rides in a ff BV and my ds rides in in a rf in a BV. I figure she has about 1" of torso/1 year of growth ff in the BV. We both love it and thought about getting one of the discounted Meghans from albee, but I'd rather have a seat that I can use for extended rf (either for her or as a pass down to ds) or that can ff for a longer time.

She's been riding ff in the MA, but I'm wanting a new seat since dd is starting to look huge in her MA and it doesn't look like it is offering much head protection as she gets bigger. She has at least an 1" of harness height left. Lots of people here love the TF, so we bought one and fell in love, too. It installs well in our van, has tons of harness room and headwings (although they are about 12" apart vs. the 8" apart BV).

However, this past weekend we took a road trip and the TF is so wide that dd's hips kept shifting to the side in the seat (it was as tight as the harness would go) and she flopped forward with the worst head slump that I've seen in any of my seats. I kept needing to push her head back (I was the passenger). The seat was fairly reclined, but the headwings are so far and the seat so wide that she was a mess.

So, I immediately started to fall out of love with the TF and started to re-consider extending her rf. Enter the Flair MR! We bought it today at Targe, and it installs well in my van and she fits, barely, rf. I think she may fit rf till she reaches 40lbs - perhaps by 5 yrs. This would time perfectly to when ds will outgrow the FPSVD rf and need the MR (I ultimately will need 2 40lb rf seats for ds). But, she doesn't want to rf. She wants to ff.

Here is how she fits in all the seats.

MA. The MA is about 10.5" wide inside.




BV. The BV is about 11-11.5" wide inside, with 8-9" at the headwings.


TF. She would be centered if she would have let me put the harness on, but you can see how wide it is. I measured between 11.5" and 12.5" throughout the seat.


MR ff. The MR is about 11.5 inches wide, fairly consistency from top to bottom.


MR rf. She was not happy that I had installed it rf.


So, here are my options (that I can think of). Please let me know what you think. I'm totally open to new ideas.

Return the MR & TF and go back to using the MA ff until 1) the Frontier finally comes out in Cowmoo, Cougar, or some other plush fabric, or 2) buy a CA and see if that works out rf.

Return the TF, keep the MR and use it ff if she insists, and use it to rf ds till 40lbs (trading in the cover for a Bartlett when the time comes and buying another 40lb seat for ds for the secondary car).

Return the MR, keep the TF and use it ff. Somehow deal with the slump by?? When ds reaches the rf limits of his BV & FPSVD, buy him two US approved MTs which are sure to be on the market by then.

ETA: added the XT. I loved this seat for the few days that I had it. I couldn't justify keeping a convertible that could only ff.



Thank you for all your input!

If you want her rf, keep her rf. Kids in my car ride the way I say they do because I say so. And if I had the option to rf a kid under 4 (or even under 6) I probably would because I would want them rf until the spine had matured.

Honestly, with older kids I talk to them about safety and have them tell me if something specific is bothering them about a particular seat or seating position and then try to fix the problem. But in the end its my responsibility (morally and legally) to keep them safe so what I say goes.

I would write/call/harass/stalk russ everyday in order to get a 30degree boot for the radian!!! Really, I so have radian love, and your DD would look ravishing in a malibu XT!!

Other than that, I would return the TF if you are having issues with it and keep the MR. It is so pretty!!! Plus, you can RF her for as long as she (and you) tolerates it (her) and then use it FF. Due to the deep sides and recline, I bet you won't have the same head slump issues with the MR. At her age and the fact that you don't really have a good seat option to RF her in, I wouldn't fight her screaming everyday for an extra few months of RF. :twocents:

I just really don't have any love for the CA, not even any desire to play with the CA.

She is a doll Imo, she's old enough to forward face. I had the same prob w/ the tf at first, but A filled out and fills the seat now (although he is rf, don't know if he'd have headslump ff). Did you try the XT ff?? I know a lot of people here don't like how reclined the MR is ff. Do hate the nauti?

Your dd is just too cute

Honestly if you aren't happy with the tf I'd return it. There are too many seats on the market to get stuck with one you aren't crazy about. I agree with the pp about the mr head slump issues. I think if I were you and the radian was def out I'd just keep using the bv/ma you are both happy with and give it a bit and see what else comes out or keep holding out for a frontier in a cover you like :twocents:

FYI: I was recently told by Britax that they will have "different" Frontier seat covers coming out in October. The mesh covers that are getting so many complaints will be replaced with covers that have the side type material in the seating area. Still mesh on the back though if you really hate any mesh.

Are the pics gone....? Cuz I don't see any...

I would use the MA and wait on the Frontier to have better covers. I also was told this should be happening next month. You have done great with having her rearfacing, but she is so close to 4, with her not wanting to I would not push it. I am certainly not saying if you have a baby that fights the car seat to turn them around...that is a fight worth fighting! But at almost 4 and barely fitting in the MR, would just go forward. I did get a MR for my DD, who is really close in age...will be 4 in Dec. But she WANTS to rear face. The seat didn't work out for us and she is still asking to rear face
I would prefer if she were but I am ok with her being forward. I am not a fan of having a seat you are not happy with, so if you are not feeling the love for the Truefit and/or the MR, I sure wouldn't keep them. They are used too often and are too important IMO to be fussing with one you are not happy with.

babyherder said:

If you want her rf, keep her rf. Kids in my car ride the way I say they do because I say so. And if I had the option to rf a kid under 4 (or even under 6) I probably would because I would want them rf until the spine had matured.

Honestly, with older kids I talk to them about safety and have them tell me if something specific is bothering them about a particular seat or seating position and then try to fix the problem. But in the end its my responsibility (morally and legally) to keep them safe so what I say goes.

Click to expand...

This is all easy to say, but when a child is older, the benefit from rf'ing is greatly decreased. The spine fusing can be completed anywhere between ages 3 and 6, so there is nothing saying that a kid is at huge risk until the age of 6. Additionally, the spine doesn't instantly fuse in 1 day. It's a process. And as the process happens, the risk of ff'ing gets lower and lower.

A child who is approaching 4 is certainly IMO old enough to have her opinion taken in to account about certain things. Rf'ing vs. ff'ing is absolutely one of them and I have absolutely no problem stating that there is a point where I will let my children choose in what manner they are restrained - with me providing 2 options that are safe for their age that is...

OP - I like the look of the MR ff'ing and it does give you the option to hand it down to your ds. I am not a fan of the MA for kids when they start to get squished in the shoulders. I know that they also find it uncomfortable - especially if they ride in a wider seat for awhile and then get put back in to it... my dd really didn't like the MA after riding in the radian.

So far as the head slump, is it waking her up, or is it just bothering you? Does your dd sleep in the car a lot? I'd probably use those factors to decide if it's worth keeping the TF or not. My dd's head went to the side when she was using the TF, and because it's wide in the interior it went quite a ways to the side.. but she slept just fine in it. My ds' head also goes to the side just due to the width, but he sleeps fine too. My policy is if it's not bothering the kid, I try to not worry about it. (On the flip side, the kind of head slump dd had in the radian did bother her... she'd start to fall asleep and wake up as soon as her head fell forward, and it would happen over and over. It was enough to make me not want to use the seat full time.)

Keeping a kid rf is just what I would do. I would understand if someone else decided to ff (at almost 4). I was suggesting rf because it seemed to be what the OP wanted. I don't think ff at 4 is dangerous.

I'm stubborn. When I want something I generally will not give in. I don't insist on much but when I do I mean it. Not all people are like that. Its just who I am and its not always a good thing.

AustinsMommy said:

She is a doll Imo, she's old enough to forward face. I had the same prob w/ the tf at first, but A filled out and fills the seat now (although he is rf, don't know if he'd have headslump ff). Did you try the XT ff?? I know a lot of people here don't like how reclined the MR is ff. Do hate the nauti?

Click to expand...

Thank you! I love the XT, and it can work in my DH's van ff, but in neither van rf. I'm not thrilled with the ff recline on the MR, but it is actually not that much different than an MA (with serious compressing). You know, I forgot about the GN. I'll need to give that some thought. I wasn't initially interested due the fear of head slump.

Heather86 said:

Your dd is just too cute

Honestly if you aren't happy with the tf I'd return it. There are too many seats on the market to get stuck with one you aren't crazy about. I agree with the pp about the mr head slump issues. I think if I were you and the radian was def out I'd just keep using the bv/ma you are both happy with and give it a bit and see what else comes out or keep holding out for a frontier in a cover you like :twocents:

Click to expand...

Thank you! I think I will return the TF. Part of my problem with the MA is where the seat has been located in my DH's van (2nd row outboard). We watched the side impact crash videos for our 2000 & 2003 MPVs on YouTube and were horrified. I could, though, put the MA in the 3rd row of my van which has more car frame around it, not just window (as shown in the pics) and put the BV in the 2nd row of his van for the extra head coverage till a better covered Frontier comes out. Hmm.....

romanoma said:

I would write/call/harass/stalk russ everyday in order to get a 30degree boot for the radian!!! Really, I so have radian love, and your DD would look ravishing in a malibu XT!!

Other than that, I would return the TF if you are having issues with it and keep the MR. It is so pretty!!! Plus, you can RF her for as long as she (and you) tolerates it (her) and then use it FF. Due to the deep sides and recline, I bet you won't have the same head slump issues with the MR. At her age and the fact that you don't really have a good seat option to RF her in, I wouldn't fight her screaming everyday for an extra few months of RF. :twocents:

I just really don't have any love for the CA, not even any desire to play with the CA.

Click to expand...

Thanks! DD and DH totally didn't like the look or feel of the CAs. DH didn't like the construction and DD hated the cover. I liked the head pillows, but don't like the absurd 40" number on the box (even if we can ignore it). Of the TF & MR, it looks like the TF is going to be out, and the MR is still pending....

snowbird25ca said:

OP - I like the look of the MR ff'ing and it does give you the option to hand it down to your ds. I am not a fan of the MA for kids when they start to get squished in the shoulders. I know that they also find it uncomfortable - especially if they ride in a wider seat for awhile and then get put back in to it... my dd really didn't like the MA after riding in the radian.

So far as the head slump, is it waking her up, or is it just bothering you? Does your dd sleep in the car a lot? I'd probably use those factors to decide if it's worth keeping the TF or not. My dd's head went to the side when she was using the TF, and because it's wide in the interior it went quite a ways to the side.. but she slept just fine in it. My ds' head also goes to the side just due to the width, but he sleeps fine too. My policy is if it's not bothering the kid, I try to not worry about it. (On the flip side, the kind of head slump dd had in the radian did bother her... she'd start to fall asleep and wake up as soon as her head fell forward, and it would happen over and over. It was enough to make me not want to use the seat full time.)

Click to expand...

The huge bonus factor that comes with the MR for me is the 'pass down factor'. If I keep the MR, 18 months from now DS can use it for ERF, and I won't be faced with the same situation of having a 3 and a half year old out growing his seats rf and having to decide whether or not I should buy a new seat. Then again, who knows what will be on the market by then?

About DD's slump, DH's van is the secondary van (the TF won't fit in mine ff) and we take a 2+ hour trip in his van every other Friday and Sunday. She usually falls a sleep. The slump wasn't just her head - it was like her whole body was shifted and flopping. Her head kept snapping back when she would awake. I think I put rolled towels on either side of her in the seat, she would have been held more upright. That doesn't seem like it would be allowed though. Do you know?

Melanie said:

FYI: I was recently told by Britax that they will have "different" Frontier seat covers coming out in October. The mesh covers that are getting so many complaints will be replaced with covers that have the side type material in the seating area. Still mesh on the back though if you really hate any mesh.

Click to expand...

2BunniesMommy said:

I would use the MA and wait on the Frontier to have better covers. I also was told this should be happening next month.

Click to expand...

Be still my heart!! We would love a non-mesh or barely mesh Frontier. Ideally in Madison, Cowmoo, or Lauren, but any colors/fabrics would be better than mesh. This throws in a wrench.

New frontier covers? I need one NOW!! So if it has issues, Britax should replace with one of the new ones, right?

And I think your dd looks fine in the marathon and boulevard. I would use those ffing for awhile. I think she fits the XT really well too. She's a cutie

After debating all day, I decided to return the TF for sure. I almost was going to keep the MR - dd loves the seat ff. She calls it her 'Purple Princess' seat, as opposed to her 'Pink Princess' BV. However, since it was so easy to pick up at Target and since the new Frontier covers are coming out next month or so, I'm returning it. I can always pick up another one if the Frontier covers don't work out. Both are packed up and ready to go.

For now, I put the Cowmoo cover on DD's MA (at her request for a non-princess seat ) and put that in the 3rd row of my van, which has more vehicle frame around the seat. I put the BV in the 2nd row of my DH's van.

I'm also thinking of trying out a CA before the BRU trade in event ends. Even if it doesn't work out, I'll be able to get a bunch of comparison pics to add to my collection.

Thank you all, again!

Now, lets just hope they really do bring out some new covers and that they are good. I am hoping for a nice plush girly one!

I think you're making a wise decision to stick with what you've got for now. I hope the new covers for the Frontier come out soon and are TDF Also re DS I'm sure in 18 months there will be quite a few new or variations of these HW-ERF seats and you will have fun choosing and getting his opinion as you have gotten DDs.

Please ignore me if this is stupid or wrong-- but I am not sure why you are returning a seat you've used. I thought that was a no-no.

Yes, you shouldn't keep a seat you don't LOVE which is why I've sold a Regent, a Radian65 and a Scenera...

OMG my 4 yo does that same "smile".

She has ages left in the TF, and I love my TF, so I would vote keep the TF and keep her FF in that. I wouldn't keep her RF; obviously she's not a huge fan and she's old enough that she's not getting a huge increase of safety being RF.

I do like how she fits in the MR, though.