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  1. #61
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanum View Post
    That's the 4 cylinder version. The V6 RAV4 has 269 hp, wowzers. I also concur that a hybrid minivan is long overdue. Our '94 Saturn SL1 had 85 hp and was a gas sipper, with 40 mpg easily attainable for most highway driving and low 30s for mixed driving. And the SL1 was pretty much 1980s technology, lol.

    Yes, but I only needed a 4 so I got a 4. I think that the 6 gets just a bit less gas mileage though, but I can't remember.

    I wonder why there isn't a hybrid minivan yet!

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  3. #62
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeanum View Post
    That's the 4 cylinder version. The V6 RAV4 has 269 hp, wowzers. I also concur that a hybrid minivan is long overdue. Our '94 Saturn SL1 had 85 hp and was a gas sipper, with 40 mpg easily attainable for most highway driving and low 30s for mixed driving. And the SL1 was pretty much 1980s technology, lol.
    this is the essence of my earlier post about my 1980 subaru with 63 hp that got 40mpg, and my 1993 mazda protege with a mere 106 (or was it 112?) hp. that was a speed demon and still got mid-high 30s!

    and the first generation RAV4 had only 120 hp. people loved it.

    i mean, seriously, the automakers are just ramming higher horsepower engines down our throats because they claim that's what we expect and want. however, in my cynical opinion, it's not entirely pure consumer-driven economics at play here. by *telling* us that the consumer wants higher power engines, it becomes a foregone conclusion-- we then believe that that's what we want. so in a way, the industry is influencing what it is we want. am i making sense? also i think the automotive journalists have a role to play in all of this. they are constantly complaining about cars not having enough power, yet they seem to dismiss fuel efficiency as something that only cheapskates worry about. sure, they never have to pay for the gas for the cars they test. it's all paid for as part of their job. but it's an unfair bias, and the industry listens to them since their praise or condemnation of a car has the potential to influence sales.

    and YES to a hybrid minivan. if i could get a six or seven-seater van with sliding doors and >40 mpg, i'd be on it in a heartbeat!
    Two girls, 7 and 6. Trek Mountain, Specialized Hotrock, Soma Buena Vista, Bike Friday tandem, and multiple other bikes. Oh, and a Mazda5.

  4. #63
    Moderator - CPSTI Emeritus Defrost's Avatar
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    Quote Originally Posted by southpawboston View Post
    i mean, seriously, the automakers are just ramming higher horsepower engines down our throats because they claim that's what we expect and want. however, in my cynical opinion, it's not entirely pure consumer-driven economics at play here. by *telling* us that the consumer wants higher power engines, it becomes a foregone conclusion-- we then believe that that's what we want.
    Kinda how if you're female and you walk onto a car lot, the first thing they ask is "What COLOR do you want?" Then they turn around and joke with their buddies and co-workers how women don't know anything about cars beyond what color they want.
    Debbie, CPST-I
    driving my '07 Mazda5 with
    Thomas (18) * Sam (17) * Patrick (15) * Macha (13)
    Safely secured with seat belts - everyone, every ride!

  5. #64
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    Quote Originally Posted by Defrost View Post
    Kinda how if you're female and you walk onto a car lot, the first thing they ask is "What COLOR do you want?" Then they turn around and joke with their buddies and co-workers how women don't know anything about cars beyond what color they want.
    Oh my goodness! Yes! This happens to me every time! I used to be such a girly girl too! Well, not that bad, but close.... I never cared how I looked to other people, I just had fun doing makeup and hair and clothes, etc. Now that I have a toddler, I'm lucky to get out the door with a shower.... Anyway, I always got that thing about the color and then the salesman would show me a car, I'd get in, and he'd say, "You LOOK so GOOOODDD in that car!" Oh my goodness! I was girly, but I never cared how I LOOKED in a car! Sheesh! I wonder what would happen if I test drove a car now... Hehe.

  6. #65
    Moderator - CPSTI Emeritus Defrost's Avatar
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    Quote Originally Posted by MomE View Post
    Anyway, I always got that thing about the color and then the salesman would show me a car, I'd get in, and he'd say, "You LOOK so GOOOODDD in that car!" Oh my goodness! I was girly, but I never cared how I LOOKED in a car! Sheesh! I wonder what would happen if I test drove a car now... Hehe.
    Oh there's no avoiding it. I showed up at the dealership to test-drive a Mazda 5, my brain full of research, and had a fairly long discussion with the salesman about safety ratings, gas mileage, manual transmission, tether anchors, etc, and his only response was "Okay, but what COLOR do you want?" As if I'd only mentioned that other stuff to try to prove that I really didn't care what the stupid thing looked like. Then he spent the entire trip going on about how cool the moonroof was and didn't I really want one with leather, too? (No.)

    I didn't end up buying from that dealership.
    Debbie, CPST-I
    driving my '07 Mazda5 with
    Thomas (18) * Sam (17) * Patrick (15) * Macha (13)
    Safely secured with seat belts - everyone, every ride!

  7. #66
    Carseat Crazy
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    Quote Originally Posted by Defrost View Post
    Oh there's no avoiding it. I showed up at the dealership to test-drive a Mazda 5, my brain full of research, and had a fairly long discussion with the salesman about safety ratings, gas mileage, manual transmission, tether anchors, etc, and his only response was "Okay, but what COLOR do you want?" As if I'd only mentioned that other stuff to try to prove that I really didn't care what the stupid thing looked like. Then he spent the entire trip going on about how cool the moonroof was and didn't I really want one with leather, too? (No.)

    I didn't end up buying from that dealership.
    I've never bought from a dealership because of these issues. I go to dealerships to test drive, roll my eyes at the salespeople when they make ridiculous comments (mostly I just ignore them altogether), then go to my credit union's car buying service and say find me this car. It's great! And it's really funny watching them try to make their ridiculous sales "pitch" and get frustrated when I just ignore them and give the car a thorough once over! Hehe!

    I did have a really good experience at the Toyota dealership when my mom test drove the RAV though. It was great! But I still bought through the credit union at a different dealership. That one was good too. So the two Toyota dealerships I've ever dealt with were good....

  8. #67
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    My worst experiences were at Toyota dealerships.

    I hate going on the lot and dealing with regular sales people. Even Lexus, which is supposed to have fabulous sales staff, often bugs me. I love the internet. I much prefer workign everything out beforehand through e-mail. Then, I just show up to test drive my exact car to make sure nothing funny is going on with it.

  9. #68
    Admin - CPS Technician Emeritus Jeanum's Avatar
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    We've taken a similar approach of checking the dealership's inventory online and sometimes even going on an "advance scouting mission" to see the actual vehicle(s) of interest on the dealership's lot when the dealership was closed on a Sunday to avoid being hustled by sales staff while we were still in the research stage of the buying process. Imagine the look of disbelief and shock on the sales rep's face when I or we would go back to the dealership with a specific list of the cars of interest by dealers stock number or VIN number, and even direct the sales rep to the precise location of specific cars on the lot. I also agree about the color thing. I have almost always made a point of saying upfront that the color is very low on my list of features that are going to make or break the deal to try to ward off any "what color?" queries in advance. Except for wanting to avoid an orange paint color offered on the Saturn Vue at the time I was shopping for one back in 2003, lol, I generally haven't car shopped by color or had a sales rep assume I was.
    Regards,
    Jean

    DD1 Age 16, 66" Driver's Ed
    DD2 Age 12, 64" 5 steps

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  10. #69
    Carseat Crazy
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    I hate to admit it, but I do care about the color. I mean, I don't go car shopping/testing based on color. But, after I've decided on the other features and specs, I do narrow my color choices to two, maybe three.

  11. #70
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    Re: Mazda 5, Honda Fit, Toyota Matrix?

    Wife is very much into color. But I am too (her moreso, but it's not like I don't care). Dealer doesn't have to know she cares how a car looks though. Again, that's why I love doing all the research before you go talk to a sales person.

    I don't see anything wrong with dealers assuming a woman is concerned with color or looks. Just when that's they assume it's the primary or only thing they care about. Luckily, in CA, most dealers aren't that stone age. They know women often have different priorities then men, but it's just a rule of thumb and they're much better at training staff to ferret out these priorities through more innocuous questions without just assuming them.

    Still, a sexist salesperson is the least of my worries. They're usually just consumed by the monthly payment amount. I'm lucky if they even know what colors they have, let alone things like gas mileage, options, etc. In the past 10 yrs or so, I'd say 80% of the sales people I've talked to had to look on the window sticker or what was around them on the lot in order to answer a question I had. If they couldn't see it, they didn't know. That's why I just do all my research online ahead of time now.

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