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  1. #1
    CPS Technician
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    DH and BIL want data

    regarding rf tethering vs. not tethering.
    Neither of them believe that rebound/cocooning can possibly be as safe as a tethered seat.
    Dh is coming from a "logic" aspect ("How can allowing the seat to move be better than keeping the seat and therefore the occupant stationary? I wear my seat belt to hold me into my seat. It doesn't move.") and BIL is coming from the viewpoint of having worked on race teams and race seat safety.
    Can anyone link me to studies with hard data? Front impact, rear impact, side impact....Are most of the crash tests done at 38 mph? Are there any "real life" statistics?
    Jessi, CPST: 2003 Honda Pilot, 2010 Toyota Corolla
    T 12/12/06 49" 55 lbs D 1/8/09 44" 50 lbs
    In Use:2 PKWY SGLs, FR80, GN, HB TB Teaching seats: Titan 65, Lite Rider Retired: Wizard, 2 33 lb MA's, 2 50 lb CAs, 3 XTSLs, Regent
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  3. #2
    Admin - CPS Technician joolsplus3's Avatar
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    http://carseat.org/Technical/tech_up...tm#toptetherRF
    That's a good start, the 'Top Tether, rear-facing' entry...it gives some commentary on the whole situation. I'm afraid there are not enough rf tethered seats for them to have a body of injury data to draw from (except Sweden which has an extraordinarily low rate of injury and RF-tethers their seats, but they may have just as good results without tethering, just by virtue of kids sitting RF through the preschool years there...)
    Julie
    CPST since 2003, pu"R"ple since 2008, three kids growing too fast since 1997, 1999 and 2006

    Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good

  4. #3
    CPS Technician
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    And don't the Swedish also have the foot prop? Aren't their cars equipped from the manufacturer with rf tether anchors also?
    Jessi, CPST: 2003 Honda Pilot, 2010 Toyota Corolla
    T 12/12/06 49" 55 lbs D 1/8/09 44" 50 lbs
    In Use:2 PKWY SGLs, FR80, GN, HB TB Teaching seats: Titan 65, Lite Rider Retired: Wizard, 2 33 lb MA's, 2 50 lb CAs, 3 XTSLs, Regent
    PetBuckle Review Here

  5. #4
    Carseat Crazy barnmama25's Avatar
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    Here is a study The U Of VA conducted, very interesting that they are testing seats that do not allow rf tethering and yet they still performed well.
    [/SIGPIC]Amy mom to Caleb and Evelynn.

  6. #5
    Carseat Crazy barnmama25's Avatar
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    Quote Originally Posted by rodentranger View Post
    And don't the Swedish also have the foot prop? Aren't their cars equipped from the manufacturer with rf tether anchors also?
    Yes they do have the foot prop's, but these are necessary since they rear face to higher weights. I do not believe they have rf tether anchors per say like we have for forward facing. The rf tethers are two tether straps coming out of the back of the car seat and then two d-rings that you weave through the vehicle seat bite and out through the back, and then the steel in the front seat becomes it's anchor point. At least that's how it appears from pictures, please correct me if I am wrong.
    [/SIGPIC]Amy mom to Caleb and Evelynn.

  7. #6
    CPS Technician canadiangie's Avatar
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    Quote Originally Posted by barnmama25 View Post
    Here is a study The U Of VA conducted, very interesting that they are testing seats that do not allow rf tethering and yet they still performed well.
    Amy,

    I love this study. I remember reading it over and over many years ago, it fascinated me then, and it still does today.

    Thanks for posting it.
    dd1 - 8y6m, hbb PWSGL
    dd2 - 7y3m, hbb PWSGL
    dd3 - 4y3m, ff advocate/frontier xt

  8. #7
    Senior Community Member
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    Not all of the Swedish car seats have a foot prop. But they do have two tether straps instead of just one. They are also certified to be used in cars without designated RF tether anchors, and the manual explains how to tether to the front seat, like a PP mentioned.
    I don't think there's anything about Sweden that would make tethering there safer than tethering here.

    On the tether vs no tether debate, a lot of ppl say dont tether for a newborn because of increased neck load on rebound but tether for a child a bit older. I think we all kind of agree that there will be slightly more force on the child's neck during the rebound in a frontal crash but that the tether offers a big advantage in side impact crashes. At least that's what I took from that article.
    DD 5.5yo, 38lbs, 43" - FF in a Radian XT and Frontier85 SICT
    DS 3yo, 33lbs, 38" - RF in Radian XT and Britax MT

  9. #8
    Senior Community Member Adventuredad's Avatar
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    Swedish seats can be used with or without foot prop. If no foot prop is used seats are leaned against dashboard or seat in front. The foot prop is a relatively new feature with manyseats. My Britax Nordic Freeway didn't have one when purchased in 2005. Not all cars have dedicated tether anchors. It's very easy to tether seats without dedicated anchors.

    There is nothing special with Swedish cars etc. Using tethering the way we do would work equally well anywhere in the world. There are no seats which are tethered forward facing. But we also move directly from rear facing to hbb at age 4-5 so it's not applicable for us.
    Last edited by Adventuredad; 11-27-2008 at 05:50 AM.
    Annika: 8 • Britax Adventure
    Daniel: 11 • Britax Adventure
    I will only post ONE comment in each thread. If you have further questions send a PM or email
    Imported child seats may not conform to applicable safety standards, laws or customs regulations in some countries.

  10. #9
    CPST and ketchup snob ketchupqueen's Avatar
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    Quote Originally Posted by barnmama25 View Post
    Here is a study The U Of VA conducted, very interesting that they are testing seats that do not allow rf tethering and yet they still performed well.
    That is really, really fascinating reading. (Um, how much of a geek does that make me? LOL!)
    CPST and Mom to Emma, 15, Bridget, 13, Maggie, 11, Katie Sue, 6, Jimmy, born May 2019,
    and Becky, waiting for us as part of our eternal family.
    Our '02 Odyssey, car seats, and seatbelts saved our lives. Now riding in a '13 Odyssey!

  11. #10
    Senior Community Member Adventuredad's Avatar
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    That study is real car seat porn. Thanks!
    Annika: 8 • Britax Adventure
    Daniel: 11 • Britax Adventure
    I will only post ONE comment in each thread. If you have further questions send a PM or email
    Imported child seats may not conform to applicable safety standards, laws or customs regulations in some countries.

  12. #11
    Moderator - CPSTI Emeritus Defrost's Avatar
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    Re: DH and BIL want data

    You've got some great answers, but I wanted to address your dh's specific comments.

    Quote Originally Posted by rodentranger View Post
    Dh is coming from a "logic" aspect ("How can allowing the seat to move be better than keeping the seat and therefore the occupant stationary? I wear my seat belt to hold me into my seat. It doesn't move.")
    Actually, it does move. It stretches to help absorb crash forces. Ask him to think about this - if he's jumping off a 30-story building, what will protect him better; a stiff rope wrapped around his waste, or a bungee cord attached to a harness? Why does the bungee cord work better? (Because it distributes the forces.)

    That's not to say that RF tethering isn't safer - we really don't know. But his argument that "no movement at all is safer" is flawed.
    Debbie, CPST-I
    driving my '07 Mazda5 with
    Thomas (18) * Sam (17) * Patrick (15) * Macha (13)
    Safely secured with seat belts - everyone, every ride!

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