Question Booster seats in center-facing jump seats?? Help?

U

Unregistered

Guest
I am taking myself and my two kids (ages 6 and 4 - both in boosters) in a 2002 Ford Ranger extended cab. I feel OK about putting one in the front passenger seat since there is an air-bag disabler (using key to turn it off).

The only place for my other child is in the center-facing jump seat in the back (driver or passenger side) that is only equipped with a lap-belt.

Question: Should I use a booster in the back seat? I know that the booster manufacturer would say no, but what is ACTUALLY safer, and what does the law say? (I'm in BC, Canada BTW).

Thanks!
 
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QuassEE

Moderator - CPST Instructor
The chances are that there may be no safe way to transport those children in that vehicle. I'll explain, with some questions..

Firstly--you're the driver? Which means there's a centre lapbelt (FF) and an outboard lap-shoulder belt available? {I'm using this assumption, correct me if I'm wrong.} Is there a restriction stating that no carseat can be installed in the centre seat due to it being within the driver's side airbag deployment zone? Some pick-ups have this restriction. If you don't, then you'll need to put the 4yo in a harnessed seat in that centre seating position, with the 6yo in a harnessed seat or appropriate booster in the outboard position. If there's a centre restriction, there's no safe way to transport these two children in that vehicle as no restraints are approved for side-facing seats.

Side-facing seats with lapbelts are functionally useless, since lapbelts are really only good for installing child restraints and no restraints are approved for those side-facing seats. Ideally no human being should ever be transported in those seats, IMO (and likely this opinion is shared by every other technician)...but they're great if you want to hook up a dog restraint to those belts. Because both of these children are legally required to be in a harnessed seat or booster in BC, there's no way you can legally or safely use those side facing seats. Period.

So if you cannot use that centre seating position with a harnessed seat for the 4yo, you'll have to find another vehicle to transport these children in.

-Nicole.
 
U

Unregistered

Guest
"Which means there's a centre lapbelt (FF) and an outboard lap-shoulder belt available? {I'm using this assumption, correct me if I'm wrong.}"

- Thanks for the reply. There are two bucket seats in the front, so using the centre seat is not an option. At this point, neither is using a different vehicle.

Perhaps I'll get flamed for this, but here's my understanding of the law . . . (and I will not quote MVA Regs, just sum-up)

Children are to be bested into the safest seats offered by the manufacturer of the vehicle. If there are belting options, you must choose the best (including the use of boosters etc.) In the case of my Ford Ranger, the jump-seats, though not considered "safe" relatively speaking, are indeed legal seats (since installed in a vehicle equipped in accordance with current Canadian law, 2002).

Another example would be the 1955 Ford Crown Vic that I took my kids in a while back. No belts = not safe, but not illegal.

So, to restate my question, since a kid will be sitting back there, should they be in a booster, or just in the jump-seat sans booster.

THanks again.
 

QuassEE

Moderator - CPST Instructor
Sorry, but there's no safe way to transport those children in that vehicle. It's not about the law, it's about safety.. Furthermore, British Columbia's new booster law does apply. If you cannot trade vehicles with somebody, can you rent a vehicle in order to transport the children safely?

To answer your question--it is actually *more* dangerous to use a booster seat with a lapbelt versus a lapbelt alone. The booster increases the distance that a child's upper body extends in a crash. In a side-facing seat, there are too many unknown variables to say if this also applies (since we only have data on forward-facing booster vs lapbelt vs booster/lapbelt use.)

If you absolutely cannot rent or borrow a more appropriate vehicle, and you're going to put somebody in that side-facing seat regardless of what I've said here, please register and send me a private message. I can make an alternate suggestion that I'd rather not be seen as recommending publicly.

-Nicole.
 

hipmaman

Moderator - CPST Instructor
I just want to add my opinion on legal and safe...

While the laws are recognised and followed, we encourage parents to go beyond the minimum of the laws when it comes to carseat safety. Most often, legal requirements are bare minimums and sometimes, might not at all be a safe option (eventhough it is legal).

For example, lap-only seatbelt (even in the forward facing direction) in a vehicle is legal, but not the safest option for anyone as there is absolutely no upper body restrain. It is however better to use this lap-only position to install a harness carseat which would give a child a safe option and free up the other positions with lap-and-should seatbelt. This is only if the vehicle manufacture allows for carseats to be used in such position.

Another example, many provinces still do not have booster seat law. So a child of 40 lbs (regardless of age in many provinces) can legally ride in a vehicle without a booster or a carseat. If a child is, say 2-3 yrs old, and 41 lbs, his parents can legally schlep him in the seatbelt (and worse if it's lap-only seatbelt) w/o a booster or carseat. Now his parents wouldn't get into trouble with the laws, but in a collision, I don't even want to think what might happen to a child that young in a seatbelt only.

In your case though, what does your vehicle user's manual say about the use of carseat in those centre-facing jump seat? Is it even allowed?

And I'm almost certain that no booster seat can be used with centre-facing vehicle seat. Manufactures usually have warnings in their manual that their seats cannot be used on centre-facing or rear-facing vehicle seats.
 
Last edited:

snowbird25ca

Moderator - CPST Instructor
The only thing I have to add beyond what has been stated, is that in my province, and possibly others as well, children cannot legally be transported in a passenger vehicle that has no seatbelts. There is NO exemption for vehicles that have no seatbelt - babies still must be in a rear facing seat, children under 40lbs or 6yrs old must be in a harnessed seat.

I can't speak for BC, but it very well may be the same there.
 

Barbara Baines

CPST Instructor
One last word. All provinces state that the car seat or booster must comply to the applicable CMVSS - which state that the car seat or booster cannot be used on vehicle seats that are not forward facing and, in the case of boosters, must be used with a 3-point seat belt assembly. If you are pulled over, you can be charged. In addition, speaking from experience, you really don't want to be in a collision with your child in that situation - it's not a pretty sight. Sorry, but you are putting your child at risk - but ultimately, it's your decision.
 

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