Frontier height limit in harness mode

murphydog77

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
I searched and didn't find any discussions on this topic, so if there are, maybe someone can point me to them.

In the Frontier manual on pg. 4, it says the ears must be below the top of the harness shell AND the child must be below 53" AND the shoulders must be below the top harness slots. Fine and good.

My friend is a very experienced tech and owns a baby store. He had a customer come in with a child who was 49" tall and didn't meet the criterion of ears below the top of the seat. I know children are built differently (my ds has a freakishly long torso while my dd has my short torso), but can this be possible? Why do you think Britax would put the "ears below the shell" requirement in the manual?

I've only seen the seat in passing, really, and haven't put a child in it yet to know how one would really fit in it.

Thanks!
 
ADS

azgirl71

CPST Instructor
Maybe they meant to put "tips of ears must be below the shell". The word "tips" can make a huge difference.

I suppose anything is possible with the diffent ways children are built. Not sure if there is a safety issue involved or not.

Sorry not much help.
 

featherhead

Well-known member
I think the tips of the ears below the shell is to make sure there is enough support for the child's head.
 

murphydog77

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
Yeah, maybe so. But even if it is just the tips, it still isn't possible to make this seat work as a harnessed seat in the top harness position unless the child doesn't have a neck. I went and played with the seat today and found a picture of this lovely child with such beautiful eyes (I'm sure you recognize her ;) ):

http://picasaweb.google.com/joolstag/Frontier/photo#5208123788582254786

The headrest is very sturdy, but the manual clearly says "child seat shell," so the child's ears can't go above the shell of the seat. In essence, it turns this seat into a seat with unusable top harness slots unless you're willing to go against manufacturer's instructions.

The same holds for the Boulevard instruction manual re: ears above the "child seat shell." I know on other boards I've seen it recommended that a ff child can use the BV until the tips of the ears reach the top of the headrest on that seat, when the current release of the manual reads that it's only to the top of the shell. Interesting. I wonder what they've found in testing and what Dorel has known all along.
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
So what does that mean for the seat as a booster (hmm...yes, that child IS somewhat familiar...)...how can it only go to 53" harnessed, but 60" as a booster?:confused: (with a 24" top belt guide, no less...)
 

tanyaandallie

Senior Community Member
OK, I totally was NOT following you but now I think I hear what you are saying. The child's ears can't go over the main shell? I am with pp who assumed that the headrest is considered part of the shell. Otherwise the seat is unusable by bigger kids. I need to go check out my dd's seat and see if her head is above the shell.
 

tanyaandallie

Senior Community Member
Well, crap. I just got out my manual.

In harness mode: thetop of the child's ears much be below the top of the child seat shell when seated

In booster mode: the ears must be below the top of the head restraint

So they definitely do differentiate between the top of shell and the top of the head restraint.

I really want to see what my dd looks like in hers when she gets up from her nap. I'm not going to be happy if she can't use the seat. I feel like a moron for making the assumption.
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
Maybe it's a flub... like the usual advice for all their other seats, copied and pasted from their great bank of manual blurbs? (lol, Heather, not so much like Dorel for the headrest issue, but more like when they said how to use the Touriva as a booster?)
 

tanyaandallie

Senior Community Member
I'm going to call this afternoon as soon as dd wakes up. I want to put her in there first. I'm afraid her ears have already passed the top of the shell. I keep thinking it has to be a flub like Jools said.
 

murphydog77

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
I have an email in and am waiting for an answer. My friend called customer service and they just repeated the manual back to him.
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
I'm going to call this afternoon as soon as dd wakes up. I want to put her in there first. I'm afraid her ears have already passed the top of the shell. I keep thinking it has to be a flub like Jools said.

Don't call till monday, they go home at 145 on Fridays :cool:
 

tanyaandallie

Senior Community Member
Thanks, I just realized they are already closed.

OK, as I suspected, dd ears are above the shell. She is only 42ish inches tall. UUUGGHHH. Should I put her back in her MA until I get confirmation on this? She is not even on the top harness setting.
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
I don't think I'd worry about it. The tops of the ears warning is primarily a whiplash prevention thing (imagine the head slamming back and overrotating over say, the marathon's seatback...ouch!), and if they don't have that warning for booster mode, then the headrest is sturdy enough for whiplash protection.
 

fyrfightermomma

New member
Wow...my 2 year old who is 37" tall and a whopping 24 pounds and the tinest little thing I've ever seen and only on the 3rd slots from the bottom only has about an two inches to go?? That can't be right....

So thats like what....6 inches of overall height?? Thats like 43" tall....how is that kid ever gonna make it close to 80 lbs?? or 60...or 50 for that matter...
 

scatterbunny

New member
This is similar (but different, LOL) to an issue I asked Sarah Tilton about at Lifesavers. She said that for rear-facing, the child's head must be an inch or more below the top of the child seat shell, including the Diplomat and Boulevard (top of seat shell, not top of headrest). So essentially, even though the headrest raises up so high, it is to be ignored except as a SIP feature, the top of the actual carseat shell is to be considered the top of the carseat, not the top of the adjustable headrest.

Unfortunately, as others pointed out, this kind of rule severely limits the usability of these seats; how on earth can kids use the top slots of the tips of their ears must be below the top of the carseat shell, not the top of the headrest?
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
Exactly, Jenny...there's no conceivable way to use this seat as a booster if they really mean this apparent 'rule' to be taken seriously. It's just *got* to be a typo (like the last MA manual that said do NOT use this seat RF for babies up to 20 pounds and one year... whoopsie doodle!)

:)
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
Heh...well, the Diplo and BV are different...their headrest isn't supposed to be unscrewed to get taller and fit kids up to 60 inches and 100 pounds. But they way they accidentally put the 'top of ears even with top of shell' the FR is just as insane as saying not to use the MA RF for an infant.
 

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