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  1. #1
    CPS Technician skipspin's Avatar
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    Feb 2006
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    3-04-2008 Sunshine Kids Chat Transcript

    2008-03-04 12:57:03 [Message] skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: This chat is moderated. We will be discussing the new Sunshine Kids Monterey and answering the previously submitted questions on that topic. Then, time permitting we will open up the chat to the previously submitted questions about other Sunshine Kids safety products. We hope to have time for some live questions at the end of chat. These questions will be moderated by the moderator staff as well.

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: We will be officially starting the chat in 3 minutes.

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: All technicians will need to introduce themselves, even with just a "hi" when the chat begins to be eligible for CUE credit. You will also need to make sure that your tech ID number and email address in your car-seat.org profile is up to date. Moderators and group leaders: Please remember to submit your questions via PM to the moderators that are actively moderating.

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: We'd like to welcome our guest speaker, Dave Clement to our chat today. Dave is the Director of Engineering at Sunshine Kids. He is directly responsible for all design, manufacturing, quality control, crash testing for SSK CRS products. He has 25 yrs engineering experience, BSME and 12 yrs experience with Child Restraint Design, XSCI and SSK. Dave very much enjoys the challenges of designing safe, innovative, affordable child restraints

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Techs, go ahead and intoduce yourselves! (Just a "hi" is okay.)

    monzogary -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hello, i'm Mary, cpst

    Judi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: hi

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi, I'm Darren from Illinois

    skaterbabscpst -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hello

    Judi's DH -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi all and Glad to have you here Dave Clement !

    Gypsy -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi, I am Lisa in Idaho!

    kchausmer -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hello, everyone! Kerry

    rachel3612 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hello, I am Rachel, cpst

    Jeanum -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi, Jean here, CPST in Michigan.

    mom2acrew -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi, Jodi CPST in Maine

    chloespurple -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi, I am Michelle CPST from VA

    Jewels -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Julie from Canada

    crunchierthanthou -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: welcome dave

    LISmama810 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi, I'm Jennie, Southern California

    jmmatlock -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Jennifer from Indiana

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes glad I can join to answer questions

    skaterbabscpst -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Rebekah from VA

    bensmom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi, Ilana from Michigan

    snowbird25ca -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Trudy from Canada

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Joy from Florida

    nisi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi, Denise in WI - T046213

    starlightCPST -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Starlight! from AZ

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: If you are a certified technician or instructor and would like CEU credit, please say hello now for verification.

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Moderators and group leaders: Please remember to submit your questions via PM to the moderators that are actively moderating.

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: You must also have the relevant information in your user profile and request Technical Professional access to obtain CEU credit. Please see http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=26521 for details

    rachel3612 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: I need the CEU

    Judi's DH -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hi CPST Gabe from Oregon

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Dave, to start out can you till us a little bit about Sunshine Kids new booster seat, the Monterey?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Ok, the Monterey is designed to really adjust for the growing child. It is approved in the ECE markets and will soon be launched in the US and CN

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: I'm going to start with some of the questions that members here have submitted this past week. What kind of testing was done to ensure the Monterey will position the seat belt properly and be comfortable for a variety of children? Particularly children toward the higher end of the stated limits?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: We test the Monterey with H-III 3 yr, H-III 6 yr and the 5th percentile female adult (approx 110 lbs) ATD. We designed the base such that the belt lay across the pelvic area is as low as possible, given the fixed location of the lap belt on the 213 Test Bench. Our test results show the Monterey to perform very nicely under 213 requirements.

    jlvetock -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Laura from Maryland

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Regarding non-standard LATCH spacing, is a LATCH installation of the Monterey allowed in these situations if the vehicle manufacturer specifically allows it?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The soft anchors on the Monterey are to be used to prevent the booster from becoming a dangerous object when not occupied. They can be used in the middle location where the lower anchor spacing is nonstandard.

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Sorry to interrupt one last time, Joy. Last call for introductions if you need CEU credit. Please also see http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=26521 for details on tech access.

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: No problem, Darren.

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Was there a specific engineering reason for making the booster LATCHable?

    kchausmer -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Is that LA use described in their manual?

    scarrow -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Hello, I need the CEU..

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes it is described in the manual

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The specific reason for LA on the booster is to prevent injury when it is not occupied in the event of an accident and the booster becomes a flying object

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Is the Monterey usable in vehicles without LATCH?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The LA hooks store in the base

    starlightCPST -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Because the LATCH is not securing the child, does it matter if the vehicle does not allow middle/non-standard spacing usage?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Middle seating positions may be used with the LA - using the nonstandard spacing

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Does it provide better protection when LATCHed, or is the LATCH primarly providing a protection that prevents it from becoming a projectile when not in use?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The lower anchors provide little difference in occupant protection

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Will the Monterey be offered backless... sold without the back?[

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Initially no. Longer term yes it will be sold as a backless booster. But I would anticipate that situation to be a long way away.

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: At this time if anyone has any questions about the design, performance and testing of the Monterey please feel free to ask them now.

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Have you considered designing the base to adjust for width, too?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Sorry we did not - but we did design the base to fit the large occupant

    kchausmer -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: I've seen the seat and it is really nice. What is the MSRP for the Monterey?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Approx 130

    Judi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: With the width being only 11", compared to the turbo booster at 12". Will you consider making one with a larger seat?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The width actually tapers up to 14" and we have fit the 5th percentile female ATD in the base with no problems so I think it will work well
    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: If the LATCH is there simply to hold the seat in when unoccupied, it won't affect the seat's performance in a lateral collision?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: It will change the test results slightly in side impact

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: For the better?

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: About adjusting the base for width... while large children are always a concern, I was thinking more of small cars where one sometimes has trouble fitting 3 in a row. Being able to narrow the booster to fit a smaller vehicle seat (such as the middle placement of a 2-door car between two Radians) would be wonderful

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes we would like to do that - what prevents that is the width of the side wings

    o_mom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: What will be the recommendation for situations where the LA are offset from the seatbelt position? For example in my 2006 Accord, the inner LA is positioned to the inside of the female buckle stalk.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re Wendy on side impact - Yes

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: How much is the offset?

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Is SK considering increasing the hip-to-shoulder height for older children in vehicles without adequate head support?

    Jewels -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: how much does the booster itself weigh?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Sorry is this with regard to a harnessed seat or booster?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The booster weighs 16 lbs

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re: the Monterey

    monzogary -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: With the Monterey weighing 16 lbs, is there not a concern with it adding stress to a child in a crash if it is not LATCHed?

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: What will the lifespan be?? We love the 8yr allowance of the Radian and are hoping for a nice long one with the Monterey, as well.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The Monterey like any booster has to rely to some degree on the auto seat back for support for rebound, so given the current capacity of the Monterey we really can't go much taller otherwise we run out of adequate head neck support

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re - on additional loads - no additional loads are shown in extensive crash testing given the weight of the Monterey

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re lifespan - 7 yrs

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: In regards to seatback support, will using the Monterey in an older vehicle with very low seat backs be a risk to children on the higher end of the seat limits?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The owners of older cars shall have to simply follow our instruction manual with that application. I don't mean to give you a bland response here but the variation in seat height can be considerable. And the safety of the child is the real concern, so some older vehicles may not work given their low seat back height

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: If there are any more questions about the Monterey please submit them now, as we will be inishing them up shortly. We do still have some in moderation, so if you asked one please be patient.

    crunchierthanthou -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: what is the tallest belt guide position?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Approx 23" plus - minus

    Morganthe -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: What is the depth of the seat when it's expanded vs in most compact position?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Sorry do you mean width

    Morganthe -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: no, depth -- front to back-- or thigh room.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: approx 14.5"

    o_mom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: RE offest anchors, this would be for the booster. Basically, the seating postion for LATCh is a few inches to the inside compared to the seatbelt. Would the Monterey be allowed to use the LA if they overlap the seatbelt?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: If the anchors in the vehicle are on the inside of the lap/shoulder belt anchorage locations all should be OK

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: will the covers for the Monterey be machine washable or will they still be hand-wash only like the ones on the Radian?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Same as the Radian

    Judi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: I feel this seat gives great shoulder room, but doesn't give room for the behind of the child, at only 11". The leg room is great. Why is the room for the behind so small?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: My son (11) and daughter (7) and the ATD's we test with fit very well in the seat base width wise. The side walls taper up and outward given some side impact security as the hip width tpaers outward

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Dave, there were a lot of questions submitted about cover colors and designs for the Monterey and the
    Radian- especially "boy" designs. I realize that you are in engineering and not marketing, but can you tell us what colors will be available on the Monterey and what SK uses to determine the colors offered on a seat or how they are chosen?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Colors are a constant consideration for us. Really we operate under the "squeaky wheel gets the grease" policy with colors. If there is enough demand for a color then we shall supply it. Changes to mass production are rather expensive as well. If we have a big enough demand, that will force us to buy the MOQ (minimum order quantity) for that color of fabric. MOQ's are very large, so we have to be absolutely sure all of it shall be used. So a color change is not a simple process. But if you talk to the retailers enough and we hear the requests from them we will make the change.

    skipspin-> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: We are going to now move on to general questions about SK products, especially the Radian.
    2008-03-04 13:43:54 [Message] skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Regarding the Radian: Why does SK allow the shoulders to go over the top slots when FF, when no other manufacturer allows it?[

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The critical consideration is the angle of the shoulder belt relative to the spine. in the case of the Radian, given the occupant height limits, this angle will never become an issue. So in order to accommodate the very small percentage of occupants that fall into this limited category (shoulder slightly above the 5th harness slot yet not exceeding our height limit) we allow this belting configuration.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Also FYI we test with the H-III 10 yr old ATD weighted to 85 lbs using the NCAP sled pulse and see no adverse spinal loading

    bensmom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: When you say shoulder belt, are you talking about the harness as it goes over the child's shoulders?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes

    crunchierthanthou -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: is there a maximum amount over the top harness slot- more than just top of ears even with the top of the shell?

    Carseatengr-> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: No maximum so long as the ears are not over the seat back height

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: What angle is important when looking at the harness and the spine? The Radian's straps are very close to the neck with the SKJP chest clip. Is this changed if a different clip is used? Is the angle important enough that even a small change could matter?

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: And does it matter for broad or narrow framed children?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The exact angle is in the range of 25 degrees or more off of horizontal (perpendicular to the seat back) - I want to stress this is an approximation - we base our allowance upon test results using an ATD that is too large for the Radian

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re the Chest clip - it is used for the positioning of the harness straps - a wider one most likely would not affect the test results

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: In regards to the Radian:How exact does the weight for using/removing the safestop need to be? If a child is hovering around 39lbs, is it better to remove it, or to wait until the child is hovering closer to 41lbs?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: If the parent is not sure of the child's exact weight, it is better to install with Safe Stop.

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Are you guys aware that when unfolding the seat with the Safe Stop attached it can easily pinch between the base and the back, causing the harness to not be tightenable?

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Since the harness needs to be nearly all the way out for the seat to fold in the first place.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes we have had some comments to that end. We try to advise that while unfolding the seat that care should be taken to visually lay the webbing out way - loosen the harness and avoid any problems

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: [skaterbabscpst] The low beltpath of the Radian is incompatible with many vehicles. Will SK test a "reverse" belt path? (Over the front of the CR, then under the main body of the CR and out the other side to go over the other side before buckling into the female beltstalk.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Possibly - but that would require significant structural additions to the seat back side walls

    Holly -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Why does the Radian have the non removable harness? It would be nice to be able to get a new harness for our sseat at least 1/2 way through the lifespan. Will that design be changed in the future?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes we will be adding that to the newer version - it will be at ABC

    Gypsy -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Will SK be testing the Radian rear facing to 40 pounds?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: That is a little complicated as the H-III 3 yr olda atd is 35 lbs with full instrumentation. The next sized ATD is the 50 lb 6 yr old - so it is very hard to test just to 40 lbs. I will say the Radian is very very stable rear facing - using the 3 yr old atd our rear facing angles are very low

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Can the Radian use non standard LATCH spacing?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Up to what widths?

    Jewels -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: How is the rear-facing height limit determined for Canadian seats and is it acceptable to exceed it provided a child has adequate head space above them. 32" seems like a low limit when looking at the height of the seat shell overall.

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Greater than 11".

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Wendy - re LA nonstandard spacing - we only allow the Radian to be installed with LA or LATCH using only standard spacing..

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: re CA rear facing We are looking into revising this soon.

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you.

    Morganthe -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re: the removable Harness -- what about for older models already owned by us consumers? Is there going to be some sort adaptation kit?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Not at this time

    ] Jeanum -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Besides a removable harness, will there be other changes with the newer version of the Radian?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes some very nice ones - later in the Summer we shall announce them in a formal manner

    bensmom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Back to the Safe Stop - I have one of the original Radians, from before the Safestop was included. Do I need to get one for my 38 pound son?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes please call our office and we will send you one. Your seat should be registered

    bensmom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Also, follow up on that. I believe some people have SafeStops with instructions to 48 pounds. Is the 48 incorrect.

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: I think we also saw 35 pounds listed for the Safe Stop as well, though I can't remember where right now.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The Safe Stop may be used to 48 lbs

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Why is the adjuster for the top tether so close to the seat itself? I've noticed when installing this in my husband's 2-door car, this makes it difficult to adjust and especially to release the tether because it is hard to keep it where you can see it or reach it. In fact, I have to attach and tighten the tether most of the way prior to install because of this... then tighten the rest of the way after I install it. If the adjuster were closer to the tether clip (not by a lot, but maybe 3"), this problem would not exist.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you for your feed back - we are in the middle of a major redesign and we will consider this. FYI I have experienced this as well installing my Radian

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: In regards to the splitter plate... it makes it hard for raising and lowering the height of the straps. Why has Sunshine Kids not put a splitter plate with an opening on one side for one strap and one on the other side for the other straps, as we see on most other new seats that came out at the same time?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: That design would be too wide for the seat back - we are looking into easier to handle designs

    Judi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Are you planning on making a booster or combo seat for the growing overweight population?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Not at this time

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: What is the minimum weight that the Safe Stop may be removed? 40 pounds? But when in doubt leave it on with a maximum of 48 pounds?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Forward facing Safe Stop should be used to 40 lbs. Our 1st introduction of this device allowed use to 48 lbs. There are no performance issues with this 8 lbs difference. Please follow the instructions associated with the particular Radian you own

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: [skaterbabscpst] will SK consider allowing the Radian to be used without the RF foot in the future?

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Can all slots be used for rf'ing or just the bottom 3?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: No not at this time

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re slots rear facing - if one follows our weight limitations regarding rear facing any slot may be used.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: And I might add our instructions regarding the harnesses must be followed as well - so if the rear facing child is tall and is 32 lbs it is possible the 4th position could be used.

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Buckle tongs - a lot of people are requesting they be replaced. Do they plan to redesign that in the future?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: We are using different IMMI tongs, slightly wider than the originals

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Are there any new products in development that you can tell us about?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Sorry not at this time - please stay tuned for some very nice changes to the Radian.

    Holly -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Are there going to be any changes made to the chest clip? For older children it makes the straps pretty close to the neck and can be uncomfortable. But the original skjp clip is great for little babies. Is it possible to have 2 different chest slips for the seat, one for babies and one for older children?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: We will be adjusting the chest clip to be wider .....

    Mommyto2 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: When is the newer version of the Radian expected to be available?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: August 08

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Will Sunshine Kids come out with an infant seat at some point? - for newborns (and especially preemies) who don't fit the Radian yet?

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: [lovinwaves] Will the retail price of the newer version be about the same?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: We are looking into that but it is hard to say exactly what that product will cover

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re retail price - please let us finish the design 1st !

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: :-)

    Judi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Are there benifits to using the safestop to 48 lbs?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: SafeStop should be used in accordance with our instructions. It reduces combined neck loading - a number not required by NHTSA, ECE or any other regulatory body.

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: It seems we had a minor software glitch with "live" questions not going to the right moderator. If you asked one and haven't seen it, please ask again now!

    kchausmer -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: With some of the recent recalls, manufacturers are providing videos on their Web sites to walk customers through fixes. Should a SK seat be recalled, would you consider this extra effort?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes of course

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Why was the Radian not made taller for the 80lb model? I found both of my boys outgrew the Radians (65 AND 80lb models, even with the shoulders allowed past the top slots) at 65 and 60lbs respectively We'd love to see the Radian 80 come out with 20" top slots... maybe 2-3" more in shoulder room (my boys are pretty average and would have needed at least 1-2" more for shoulder room if it went taller) and truly get these kids who are not leggy to 80lbs.

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: There seems to be more of an interest in side impact protection features throughout the industry lately, perhaps in part due to European standards. Is Sunshine Kids testing and marketing anything new in this regard for current product improvements or new products?

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Sorry Kat, didn't mean to submit mine until yours was finished!

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes I really understand your point. It is very difficult to accommodate all sizes. I designed the Radian around the "anthropometric tables for an 80 child down to the 5 lbs newborn. Even so I run into a lot of variety in the size of children. There is no easy answer here. Raising the harness slots greatly increases stresses on the frame so there has to be a balance between the size of the restraint and structural loading.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re side impact - First the efforts in EU and US are running nealry parallel. Much has to be determined here. Specifically the use of the ATD that is designed for side impact testing. The current H-III family is not designed for side impact dynamics.

    Jewels -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Will the chest clip on the new Radians be available to purchase on the older Radians?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: SSK has completed side impact testing with all of our products and we will continue to complete research in that area.

    skaterbabscpst -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: what, if anything, can be done to increase the heights of boosters (hip-to-shoulder) for the older children in vehicles without head support? Can reinforcing bars (steel maybe?) address the concern with lack of support from the vehicle seat?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Re chest clip - most likely

    bensmom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Similar to the new chest clips, will any of the other changes (other than harness - which you already said no) be retroactive.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: To early to comment there - please stay tuned

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Last call for questions, please. We intend to end this session promptly at 3pm eastern time at the latest.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: re booster height - The structure required is rather substantial - I would have to look into that design issue further to comment further

    Holly -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Is it possible in the future to test the radian or any other seat installed "forward facing" on a vehicle seat that is rear facing since some van's now have the option of turning the captains chairs to rear face. If the testing was done that way, technically people could have their children rearfacing until they outgrow the Radian, and the children would have more leg room as well.

    skaterbabscpst -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: would adding a top tether compensate for the increased weight that would be necessary for such a design?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Yes that is possible - however many of the "Captains Chairs" in large conversion vans are not tested in such a manner. In some cases they are installed aftermarket - and in my view have suspect anchorages. I would not recommend this.
    Judi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The new Town and country has rear facing non after market seat, also the eurovan, what about those?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: I would have to crash test this seat arrangement to really comment in an intelligent manner.

    Judi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: There has been issues with the bottom of the Radian bowing outward. Is this an issue that will affect its usefullness?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: No - and we are working on a solution to this limited occurance....

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: While we are waiting for final questions, another reminder that technicians who introduced themselves will receive confirmation of your CEU credit by email within a week or so, to the address in your forum profile. To receive credit, you must also have followed the instructions here http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=26521 , including your name and technician number. If you need confirmation right away for an impending recertification deadline, please send me a private message.

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: One more question maybe two then we need to wrap it up!

    o_mom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: I know that the IIHS did studies around load limiters on vehicle seatbelts and found that the overall protection was decreased. While injuries from seatbelt loads was decreased, there were more injuries from occupants striking the car interior. How does this apply to CRS design and load limiting devices? Given that the 28 in limit from FMVSS213 can be close to the seat distance in smaller cars is that considered when looking at crash test results?

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Does SSK allow the use of all their own SSK brand "accessories" with the Radian? Mats, dry-seat, comfy-soft, cuddle-soft, mighty- tite, etc?

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: That will be the last question.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Very good question! We carefully considered the increased excursion vs decreased neck loading data. Because the Radian sits low and close to the bight of the auto bench seat, our excursions in general are very low. The Safe Stop is limited in how much it can give during the load event. So, the increase in excursion is still well under the NHTSA 213 limits The load elongation curve for Safe Stop is nonlinear so that actually works to the advantage of the occupant.

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: re accessories - Yes

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Dave, thank you so much for taking your time to be with us today!

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you Dave for being our esteemed guest speaker! Thank you also to Joy (skipspin) for organizing this event and to Ilana (bensmom) for helping to moderate. Thank you all for joining us and stay tuned to the announcement forum for future sessions!

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: It was great! Thanks as well.

    Gypsy -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thanks Dave!

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thanks to the mods for doing this chat! It has been very informative.

    joolsplus3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thanks for spending the time to talk to us! You were very helpful and informative!

    skaterbabscpst -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you!

    lovinwaves -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank You Dave!

    Kat_Momof3 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: And thank you to Dave for taking the time to talk to us!

    Judi -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: thanks

    starlightCPST -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you!

    ] Kecia -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you Dave! And a big thank you to Darren, Joy and Ilana as well!

    crunchierthanthou -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: thanks

    Mommyto2 -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you Dave, Joy and Ilana

    wendytthomas -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: And thanks mods, this was a great couple of hours.

    kchausmer -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Please remind folks to enter their CEUs in their online profile as soon as the get that email and to print it and keep it in case they are selected to be audtied.

    chloespurple -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thanks for your time Dave!

    Holly -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thanks!!

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thank you for the reminder, the category will be #4 and a confirmation ID will be included in the email as well!

    bensmom -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Thanks for your time, Dave. That was really informative.

    CPSDarren -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: Over 40 people attended, a bit more than I expected!


    9 yr old in a pink zebra NBB and 5-stepping
    6 yr DS1 old in a Harmony
    4 yr old DS2 in a Nautilus and Radian
    18 mo DS3 rfing in a MyRide65

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  3. #2
    CPS Technician Stretchy Glue's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Thanks. Insightful.
    Joni
    Sunshine, 11, 5'3", 100 lbs in a 15.5" saddle

  4. #3
    Forum Ambassador TechnoGranola's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    I was waiting for this, thanks!

    Re: the Town & Country RF seats question, I thought that the seat in the van had to be FF when driving? They could only be RF when stopped?

  5. #4
    CPS Technician crunchierthanthou's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    it has to be locked into place and can't swivel when you're driving, but it can be rf. However, it can only have a carseat or booster when ff (other than the optional integrated booster).

    Thanks for getting that up, Joy. there's lots of great info there.

  6. #5
    Forum Ambassador TechnoGranola's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Quote Originally Posted by crunchierthanthou View Post
    it has to be locked into place and can't swivel when you're driving, but it can be rf.
    Thank you for the clarification.

  7. #6
    CPST Instructor azgirl71's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Thanks for posting this. I hope to make the next one.
    Lisa - CPSTI
    Mom to Tucker, 5 years old, 29.2 lbs, 39.25 inches tall who has a variety of different carseats to ride in.
    My new grandson is my signature photo

  8. #7
    Moderator - CPSTI Emeritus Defrost's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Thanks for posting this! I've been waiting!
    Debbie, CPST-I
    driving my '07 Mazda5 with
    Thomas (18) * Sam (17) * Patrick (15) * Macha (13)
    Safely secured with seat belts - everyone, every ride!

  9. #8
    Moderator - CPS Technician BookMama's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Quote Originally Posted by Defrost View Post
    Thanks for posting this! I've been waiting!
    Andrea, CPST, Tech proxy, special Needs trained
    DS 4/01 - Seatbelt * DD1 11/05 - Oobr, PWSGL, Performance Booster
    DD2 10/09 - GN SS/Argos
    Plus a plethora of "spare" seats for everyone.

  10. #9
    Carseat Crazy
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    I just noticed that the transcript has been posted. Thank you...very interesting.
    DD (10y&68lbs&132cm) - Harmony LB booster
    DS (8y&50lbs&117cm) - Britax Parkway SG and Compass B505C

  11. #10
    CPS Technician Sweet Mercies's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Did I miss this, or has anyone asked, with the new increases in height and RF weight limits, is this going to be with the new DOM or will this increase be for older DOM as well?

    Great transcript! TY!
    Melissa, CPST-I/SC
    DD-8y SK Monterey and ParkwaySG
    DS-5y Regent-Onyx and Frontier85
    DS2-1y RF Britax Marathon x 2
    Another surprise due 2/2012

  12. #11
    CPS Technician crunchierthanthou's Avatar
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    Re: MArch 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    No, the change in rf weight limit is not retroactive. You have to follow the stickers on your seat. The height limit did not change. SSK has always said the shoulders can go above the top harness position.

  13. #12
    Senior Community Member mommyto4's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: In regards to seatback support, will using the Monterey in an older vehicle with very low seat backs be a risk to children on the higher end of the seat limits?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The owners of older cars shall have to simply follow our instruction manual with that application. I don't mean to give you a bland response here but the variation in seat height can be considerable. And the safety of the child is the real concern, so some older vehicles may not work given their low seat back height

    Does this mean that the Monterey will require headrests or tall seat backs???
    Melinda-mom to 4 rugrats

  14. #13
    Moderator - CPSTI Emeritus Defrost's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Quote Originally Posted by mommyto4 View Post
    skipspin -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: In regards to seatback support, will using the Monterey in an older vehicle with very low seat backs be a risk to children on the higher end of the seat limits?

    Carseatengr -> Special Events - CEU Chat Session: The owners of older cars shall have to simply follow our instruction manual with that application. I don't mean to give you a bland response here but the variation in seat height can be considerable. And the safety of the child is the real concern, so some older vehicles may not work given their low seat back height

    Does this mean that the Monterey will require headrests or tall seat backs???
    I'm going to guess that it's not going to be the same situation as Cosco boosters. I just can't imagine SK not reinforcing the back; it's not like it takes a whole lot. My interpretation was that due to the height, even with reinforcement certain older vehicles with very low seat backs may be incompatible at the upper ranges of the booster's use.
    Debbie, CPST-I
    driving my '07 Mazda5 with
    Thomas (18) * Sam (17) * Patrick (15) * Macha (13)
    Safely secured with seat belts - everyone, every ride!

  15. #14
    Admin - CPS Technician joolsplus3's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Quote Originally Posted by Defrost View Post
    I'm going to guess that it's not going to be the same situation as Cosco boosters. I just can't imagine SK not reinforcing the back; it's not like it takes a whole lot. My interpretation was that due to the height, even with reinforcement certain older vehicles with very low seat backs may be incompatible at the upper ranges of the booster's use.


    I think maybe he didn't want to give a solid thumbs up to this because the test bench has a relatively tall seatback... I'm sure if they put the small adult female dummy in the seat the head support is fine, but he wouldn't want to make a big guess about support being fine in every car on the road with every sized kid.
    Julie
    CPST since 2003, pu"R"ple since 2008, three kids growing too fast since 1997, 1999 and 2006

    Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good

  16. #15
    Senior Community Member katiesmommy's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Here's the situation, my mother's van has low seatback and no headrests. If I'm sitting in the backseat the back support hits me somewhere around the bottoms of my shoulder blades, and I'm only 5'1" and height wise would still fit in a Regent. So, I think what she's meaning is because her seatbacks are so low, does this mean that she won't be able to use the Monterey for my siblings. K is 4'10" and 90lbs, J is 4'9 and 70lbs, D 4'4" and 93lbs. K has outgrown almost all other boosters by height, and is using a start over the weight limit until another option can be found.

    ETA: Headrests are $400 each, so buying them new is not an option.
    Last edited by katiesmommy; 03-31-2008 at 11:34 PM. Reason: ETA



  17. #16
    CPST/Firefighter Judi's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    So, did her van have headrests at one time?

  18. #17
    Senior Community Member katiesmommy's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    No, there are holes for headrests to go in, but they have plugs put in them, and since they've owned it, it has not had headrests. It may have had headrests at some point, but not since they bought it.



  19. #18
    CPST/Firefighter Judi's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Just wondering if they could get some used, carefully of course.

  20. #19
    Senior Community Member katiesmommy's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Possibly, it's a matter of where to find them, and potentially scouting junk yards.



  21. #20
    CPST/Firefighter Judi's Avatar
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    Re: March 4th Sunshine Kids live chat *TRANSCRIPT*

    Yeah, but worth it!

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