Britax Regent, Honda Element, SBP = AGH!

cimberdog · Dec 16, 2007

Hi all,
We picked up two Regents today for our five year old son who is already 46 pounds and 46" tall. We attempted to install it in my 2007 Honda Element and CANNOT get this seat tight. The bar keeps falling out, but I see we can try pounding it in with a rubber mallot. He is quickly outgrowing his Marathon with regard to the straps being long enough - especially with winter coats in Minnesota. Going without a coat isn't an option.

My question is, we must be doing something wrong because the base of the seat comes right out when we pull it. It loosens right up and I have a locking lap\shoulder belt. Are we not understanding the instructions?

I am threading the lap and shoulder belt through the back of the seat, under the foam and out the back on the other side. Buckle. Pull out all slack. And the seat slides all over the place at the base, even when we do get that reclining bar up on the seat back, rather than falling through the gap in the seat.

What are we doing wrong? Even once we tethered, the seat base slides all over the place - WAAAAY more than 1". I've installed a Boulevard and Marathon in my Element, using LATCH though. Never tried a lap\shoulder belt install until now. Am I stuck with only using a booster and my car seatbelt?

sdjeppa · Dec 16, 2007

Hi - we have an Element too...we have only installed our Regent with LATCH in it, so far, but have installed other seats with the seatbelt - the easiest way we have found is to recline the seat in the car slightly, then install the carseat, and get the belt as tight as you can, then "pop" the seat back back up - you may have to get in the back and push the seat back up until it locks. This gets the seats in really tight.

We have had a hard time getting the recline bar to stay in, too, and it does just go thru the seat. The Regent isn't as easy to install as the MA, but its not bad once you figure it out.

HTH!

cimberdog · Dec 16, 2007

sdjeppa said:
Hi - we have an Element too...we have only installed our Regent with LATCH in it, so far, but have installed other seats with the seatbelt - the easiest way we have found is to recline the seat in the car slightly, then install the carseat, and get the belt as tight as you can, then "pop" the seat back back up - you may have to get in the back and push the seat back up until it locks. This gets the seats in really tight.

We have had a hard time getting the recline bar to stay in, too, and it does just go thru the seat. The Regent isn't as easy to install as the MA, but its not bad once you figure it out. HTH!

That does help, but something seems to happen with the seatbelts that prevent them from staying tight. I can literally pull the Regent off my seat, after we have yanked the seatbelt off, clicked it back in (so the locking is engaged) and then the seat still slides all over. We've been trying this over and over and not once gotten a tight install.

Then we tried it in my husband's Subaru B9 Tribeca with the same result. We've watched the videos, read through multiple posts here, and read the manual over and over. I don't see how this seat can be installed tightly?

crunchierthanthou · Dec 16, 2007

Are you getting the lap portion of the belt as tigh as you can before engaging the locking mechanism? I find that helps for a l/s shoulder belt with locking retractor. It's the lap portion that's actually holding the seat tight. Also, you only need to grip with one hand and tug back and forth when checking for a tight install- no extreme force necessary.

You mentioned yanking the seatbelt. Are you pulling it all the way out and letting it back in slowly? Pulling it fast will engage the locking mechanism, but only temporarily (emergency locking mode). You need to do it slowly to switch to automatic locking mode.

I want to address your comment about it not fitting now that winter is here. The coat is too thick if you need to adjust the harness to fit over it. It will compress in a crash and result in the harness being too loose. I know it's cold in Minnesota. I grew up in that area and still live in a snowy climate. We have many Canadian posters as well. You can stay warm safely. You can put the coat on backward after buckling the harness. We prefer dressing ds in fleece and giving him a blanket in the car.

Here's a post about another method from one of our Canadian techs:

http://car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=29772

cimberdog · Dec 16, 2007

crunchierthanthou said:
Are you getting the lap portion of the belt as tigh as you can before engaging the locking mechanism? I find that helps for a l/s shoulder belt with locking retractor. It's the lap portion that's actually holding the seat tight. Also, you only need to grip with one hand and tug back and forth when checking for a tight install- no extreme force necessary.

You mentioned yanking the seatbelt. Are you pulling it all the way out and letting it back in slowly? Pulling it fast will engage the locking mechanism, but only temporarily (emergency locking mode). You need to do it slowly to switch to automatic locking mode.

I want to address your comment about it not fitting now that winter is here. The coat is too thick if you need to adjust the harness to fit over it. It will compress in a crash and result in the harness being too loose. I know it's cold in Minnesota. I grew up in that area and still live in a snowy climate. We have many Canadian posters as well. You can stay warm safely. You can put the coat on backward after buckling the harness. We prefer dressing ds in fleece and giving him a blanket in the car.

Here's a post about another method from one of our Canadian techs:

http://car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=29772

Yep, we are pulling the belt almost parallel to the seat to pull the lap portion tight first, then we slowly tighten the shoulder portion, and let it click back. No quick (emergency) pulling. The seatbelt does stay engaged (locked) but this seat does not seem to tighten with the angle or location of the lap\shoulder belts. DH wants to take them both back and get boosters (the Monarchs) but I really want the 5-point harness on the Regent.

Per the coat - I've always been a very snug harness adjuster, so we loosen and tighten each time the kids get out and ratchet them back in so barely a finger fits under the snuggest part on their shoulder. Their coats are not so thick that it prohibits them being clipped in safely

Thanks for addressing it though - I hesitated even writing that as I knew it may cause concern, but not to worry.

Defrost · Dec 17, 2007

I was having trouble installing with the recline bar, but others said they had been able to do it in my vehicle. I was confused until I realized I was pushing the seat the wrong way to tighten the belt. My usual installation technique is to push the carseat BACK into the vehicle seat, but what was working for others was to push the carseat DOWN into the vehicle seat.

If you could post pics that might help, too!

cimberdog · Dec 17, 2007

Defrost said:
I was having trouble installing with the recline bar, but others said they had been able to do it in my vehicle. I was confused until I realized I was pushing the seat the wrong way to tighten the belt. My usual installation technique is to push the carseat BACK into the vehicle seat, but what was working for others was to push the carseat DOWN into the vehicle seat.

If you could post pics that might help, too!

I am still being moderated, so posting takes awhile.

We tried again a few more times last night. I tilted my rear seat back to get a better angle and view of what's happening. I think the bottom of the Regent is just too wide for my seat. It just does NOT install and stay put. The belts lock, but there is so much wiggle room that it just doesn't stay put AT the belt path. It slips vertically so that recline bar inches down into the open seat crease. Go over a few spped bumps and the seat will be way loose again. The Marathon in contrast has a much smaller footprint and we get a rock solid install. It does not MOVE.

I called Britax this morning and all they could advise was to place a non-skid pad under it. No other option. I don't think that installs the seat tight - I think that masks a loose install and prevents slippage when I pull on it, but in an impact, it will come loose. So it's going back, and I am looking at the Monarch, the Recaro line, or the Compass B510 to see if any will work.

sdjeppa · Dec 17, 2007

Before you return it, if you like, I can try to install ours in our Element with SBP and see what happens. I have to move one of our seats to that car tonight anyway, might as well be the regent

cimberdog · Dec 17, 2007

sdjeppa said:
Before you return it, if you like, I can try to install ours in our Element with SBP and see what happens. I have to move one of our seats to that car tonight anyway, might as well be the regent

I would love that! Thank you!

sdjeppa · Dec 18, 2007

Ok, I installed it tonight. I know exactly what you mean by movement vertically - if you pulled on the front of the seat, it "slipped" down, right?

Here's what I did. If you have help, that would be easier, but I did it by myself.

Twist the seat belt buckle stalk 2-2.5 times. Then the buckle won't rest on the seat itself. Have the seat back of the seat at about a 45 degree angle. Push the Regent back towards the seat, not down. Kneel on the seat, buckle it, pull the seat belt out and lock it, and feed the slack in. Pull on it to the side to tighten the lap part of the belt, then really pull on it to get it to lock tight. On mine, the recline bar is several inches above the crack of the seat. At this point, mine moved less than an inch side to side, but did pull to the front...if you need to, unbuckle the seatbelt, click it shorter a click or two, then rebuckle. THEN, go to the BACK of the Element, release the seatback (don't let it go back) and push it forward, at least 2 locks. You really have to push on the back of the seat to get it to lock the last lock. My seat is in there rock solid. That last push of the seat upright really got it in there tight.

Let me know if that helps!!! It IS possible. You can do it!

Any techs, let me know if I did something wrong

.

cimberdog · Dec 19, 2007

sdjeppa said:
Ok, I installed it tonight. I know exactly what you mean by movement vertically - if you pulled on the front of the seat, it "slipped" down, right?

Here's what I did. If you have help, that would be easier, but I did it by myself.

Twist the seat belt buckle stalk 2-2.5 times. Then the buckle won't rest on the seat itself. Have the seat back of the seat at about a 45 degree angle. Push the Regent back towards the seat, not down. Kneel on the seat, buckle it, pull the seat belt out and lock it, and feed the slack in. Pull on it to the side to tighten the lap part of the belt, then really pull on it to get it to lock tight. On mine, the recline bar is several inches above the crack of the seat. At this point, mine moved less than an inch side to side, but did pull to the front...if you need to, unbuckle the seatbelt, click it shorter a click or two, then rebuckle. THEN, go to the BACK of the Element, release the seatback (don't let it go back) and push it forward, at least 2 locks. You really have to push on the back of the seat to get it to lock the last lock. My seat is in there rock solid. That last push of the seat upright really got it in there tight.

Let me know if that helps!!! It IS possible. You can do it! Any techs, let me know if I did something wrong .

OK, with the exception of the twisting (although I had considered it) of the belt stalk, I tried all of that, so it must be what's needed for a solid install. I returned one of the Regents yesterday and ordered two of the Sunshine Kids Monterey boosters which won't ship until March. So since I've still got a Regent at home that DH hasn't yet returned, I will definately give it a try. You didn't feel like you were going to break your E's seat, did you? I was a bit worried about that when I had reclined it and then pushed it back up again. I really had to work to get it back to the starting point.

But you did NOT get movement from side to side at the belt path? I knew there must be a way. I called a car seat tech the other day and left a message, explaining the trouble. No call back yet

So I will call again if I get this seat installed tonight so I can have it checked for sure.

Thank you SO much!

cimberdog · Dec 19, 2007

sdjeppa said:
Ok, I installed it tonight. I know exactly what you mean by movement vertically - if you pulled on the front of the seat, it "slipped" down, right?

YES, and then it's like it's not even installed because at that point, the seat wiggles all over the place. So once you got it installed, could you still pull on the front and have it slip, or did your method prevent that from happening? I worry about that.

cimberdog · Dec 19, 2007

I think we got it!

WOO! :thumbsup:

After your wonderful advice, we tried the Regent again tonight. What a HUGE difference it made to twist the seat belt buckle (receiver). I twisted it about 2-2.5 times and that little nugget got us a GREAT fit! I am so excited! I think my DH is a tad disappointed as I had just pre-ordered two of the Sunshine Kids Monterey boosters yesterday, but they can be cancelled if we can get the Regent in his B9 Tribeca. But, we got a good fit! And pictures! And we took a video which I will link to as soon as we figure out how to post it.

THANK you from the bottom of my heart. I spent the afternoon reading up at the Web site of that little boy who was killed when his seat belt detached and I felt an overwhelming sense of need to figure this out for the sake of my son.

sdjeppa · Dec 19, 2007

YAY!!! I am so glad I could help

I knew there had to be a way!!! Yes, twisting the belt stalk made a huge difference - that's probably what was keeping it from tightening enough.

jen_nah · Dec 19, 2007

Re: I think we got it!

cimberdog said:
WOO! :thumbsup:

After your wonderful advice, we tried the Regent again tonight. What a HUGE difference it made to twist the seat belt buckle (receiver). I twisted it about 2-2.5 times and that little nugget got us a GREAT fit! I am so excited! I think my DH is a tad disappointed as I had just pre-ordered two of the Sunshine Kids Monterey boosters yesterday, but they can be cancelled if we can get the Regent in his B9 Tribeca. But, we got a good fit! And pictures! And we took a video which I will link to as soon as we figure out how to post it.

THANK you from the bottom of my heart. I spent the afternoon reading up at the Web site of that little boy who was killed when his seat belt detached and I felt an overwhelming sense of need to figure this out for the sake of my son.

I am so glad you got it in. It's always good when some one on the site has the same vehicle & seat another is having issues with. They are always able to give them pointers.

As for the video please know that seatbelt failure is rare. And, Even if he was in a child restraint at his weight he most likely would have had to have his carseat installed with the vehicle seatbelt. The outcome still would have probably been the same. There is still a lot of unknowns/what if's too. Something no one will ever know for sure. You also have to remember his sister was sitting right next to him in the same booster seat and she walked away. He could have unbuckled his seatbelt or had it positioned improperly again just a lot of unknowns to say this is what happened.

But, I am glad to hear your little guy is back in a 5pt harness. We have 2 Regents for our 6 1/2yr old dd and we love them.

As for the coat many of us understand the concern of our children being cold. As long as his jacket is no thicker then a thin fleece jacket then it is acceptable. You might get the harnesses tight with the coat on but in the event of a crash the batting/filler will compress even more and that will leave the harnesses loose on your son.

With my girls they have their coats on to get to the vehicle. Once in the vehicle they slip their jackets off and then buckle up nice and tight. Once in their seats I slip their jackets back on over the top of their arms and on the outside of their harness. They stay warm and can easily pull it off once they get warm if they want.

Here is a picture of how my girls ride in the winter months. As you can see my dd jacket is over the outside of her harnesses and acting pretty much like a blanket keeping her nice and warm.

cimberdog · Dec 19, 2007

Thanks Jen! I know statistics dictate seat belt failure is rare, but gosh I just read and watched enough that I felt like I HAD to get this worked out with the Regent. Plus then we have a tether.

Britax Regent install. NOTE: I was incorrectly referring to ithe Regent as a Marathon, but this is a Regent (we just removed the marathon prior to this video)

The Britax Regent being installed in the Element, part 2 (reclined seat back and then pushing i back up). Starts out blurry but gets better.

Regent tightly installed but not tethered yet (make sure you top tether)

jen_nah · Dec 20, 2007

Great Job!!! There is always a learning curve with the Regent the 1st time. Now you are a pro! I just trained one of my techs actually been a tech for years now on how to install a Regent as she just got one for her 6yr old son. Once she did it and figured it all out she loved it.

Just want to make sure but you did top tether it correct?

cimberdog · Dec 20, 2007

jen_nah said:
Great Job!!! There is always a learning curve with the Regent the 1st time. Now you are a pro! I just trained one of my techs actually been a tech for years now on how to install a Regent as she just got one for her 6yr old son. Once she did it and figured it all out she loved it.

Just want to make sure but you did top tether it correct?

Thanks Jen

Oh yes, it's top tethered!

asantoni · Jan 15, 2008

I just wanted to thank you for making the videos.

They helped me a LOT while I was struggling to install two Regents in my 2005 Honday Ody captain seats using the lap/shoulder belt and the short belt path.

After watching the videos and reading this post, I was able to get a good install on two regents in my van. I would not have been able to do it without this post and video.

So thank you, thank you, thank you

cimberdog · Feb 15, 2008

asantoni said:
I just wanted to thank you for making the videos.

They helped me a LOT while I was struggling to install two Regents in my 2005 Honday Ody captain seats using the lap/shoulder belt and the short belt path.

After watching the videos and reading this post, I was able to get a good install on two regents in my van. I would not have been able to do it without this post and video.

So thank you, thank you, thank you

Oh what wonderful news! You are so welcome! I know I was ready to tear out my hair and received great tips here so I'm so pleased I could help someone else too!

An update: I did go have it inspected by a car seat tech and she was excited because she hadn't seen a Regent yet, so we spent an hour going over all that I learned and could show her, and then she told me I need to be a seat tech

I would if I didn't work FT and could take the class. Anyway, it passed inspection with flying colors and I was able to pass on many tips to her to help her with future installations (esp. pounding in that bar with a rubber mallet, and the twisting of the seat belt stalk).

Britax Regent, Honda Element, SBP = AGH!

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