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Um, wow. (Michigan's new carseat law)
- Thread starter purplemama
- Start date
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joolsplus3
Admin - CPS Technician
Re: Um, wow.
"Children under age 4 who weigh less than 30 pounds would be in rear-facing seats. Those between 30 and 50 pounds would be in a forward-facing safety seat. Children under 4 feet 9 inches would be in booster seats."
Yeah, it really does appear to disadvantage the 30lb under-2 year olds. And really, they probably should have just gone with 2, instead of 4, it might have had a better chance of passing. Also, 50 pounds is a nice harnessing goal, but there are just not enough seats with tall enough harnesses for many kids. (I'm writing this before the vote, assuming it won't pass).
"Children under age 4 who weigh less than 30 pounds would be in rear-facing seats. Those between 30 and 50 pounds would be in a forward-facing safety seat. Children under 4 feet 9 inches would be in booster seats."
Yeah, it really does appear to disadvantage the 30lb under-2 year olds. And really, they probably should have just gone with 2, instead of 4, it might have had a better chance of passing. Also, 50 pounds is a nice harnessing goal, but there are just not enough seats with tall enough harnesses for many kids. (I'm writing this before the vote, assuming it won't pass).
LISmama810
Admin - CPS Technician
There could also be much more detail to the proposed law than what is being reported.
I agree 4 has little chance of passing.
I agree 4 has little chance of passing.
BookMama
Senior Community Member
I applaud the effort to keep kids RF/harnessed/boostered longer, but this is poorly worded (I've seen the actual wording), not based on APP recommendations, and generally not thought through from a CPS perspective. The average kid hits 30 lbs at age 3, 50 lbs around age 7. Do they really expect parents to keep kids RF until 3 or longer, and harnessed until 6-7 or longer?
I'd love to see new laws requiring better bare minimums, but I don't think this law is what we need. I hope either they reword it or it doesn't pass (and this is MY state!). I have to wonder whether they even worked with someone from Safe Kids Michigan on this wording.
ETA: There should be no top weight limits. Per the current wording, kids over 30 lbs MUST be FF and kids over 50 lbs MUST be boostered. That's not necessary, since as we all know there are plenty of seats that accommodate RF above 30 lbs and harnessing above 50 lbs.
I'd love to see new laws requiring better bare minimums, but I don't think this law is what we need. I hope either they reword it or it doesn't pass (and this is MY state!). I have to wonder whether they even worked with someone from Safe Kids Michigan on this wording.
ETA: There should be no top weight limits. Per the current wording, kids over 30 lbs MUST be FF and kids over 50 lbs MUST be boostered. That's not necessary, since as we all know there are plenty of seats that accommodate RF above 30 lbs and harnessing above 50 lbs.
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katymyers
Active member
Um, wow.
Yeah, my friend's daughter hit 40 lbs at 19 months old and is now just turning three and already weighs 50 lbs... She's a smart girl and neurotypical but not ready for a booster by any stretch of the imagination. I'd much rather see age recommendations instead of weight. Of course, the other side of that is how do you tell parents that have a 40 lbs child at less than two that they have to buy a Radian or a Foonf to be following the law. Especially when so many of them are at a Scenera price point.
Yeah, my friend's daughter hit 40 lbs at 19 months old and is now just turning three and already weighs 50 lbs... She's a smart girl and neurotypical but not ready for a booster by any stretch of the imagination. I'd much rather see age recommendations instead of weight. Of course, the other side of that is how do you tell parents that have a 40 lbs child at less than two that they have to buy a Radian or a Foonf to be following the law. Especially when so many of them are at a Scenera price point.
BookMama
Senior Community Member
Re: Um, wow.
They changed the wording today. Not sure exactly what it means - don't have time to look at it closely, and the "not more than" and "not less than" is very confusing. But it looks like kids would have to be in a booster until 57" or their 10th birthday. I like that a lot.
Here's the current wording:
(A) IF THE CHILD WEIGHS NOT MORE THAN 30 POUNDS OR IS LESS THAN 2 YEARS OF AGE, IN A REAR-FACING CHILD SEAT.
(B) IF THE CHILD WEIGHS NOT LESS THAN 30 POUNDS BUT LESS THAN 50 POUNDS, OR IS 2 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER BUT LESS THAN 5 YEARS OF AGE, IN A FORWARD-FACING CHILD SEAT.
(C) IF THE CHILD IS NOT MORE THAN 57 INCHES TALL AND WEIGHS 50 POUNDS OR MORE, OR IS 5 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER BUT LESS THAN 10 YEARS OF AGE, IN A BOOSTER SEAT.
They changed the wording today. Not sure exactly what it means - don't have time to look at it closely, and the "not more than" and "not less than" is very confusing. But it looks like kids would have to be in a booster until 57" or their 10th birthday. I like that a lot.
Here's the current wording:
(A) IF THE CHILD WEIGHS NOT MORE THAN 30 POUNDS OR IS LESS THAN 2 YEARS OF AGE, IN A REAR-FACING CHILD SEAT.
(B) IF THE CHILD WEIGHS NOT LESS THAN 30 POUNDS BUT LESS THAN 50 POUNDS, OR IS 2 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER BUT LESS THAN 5 YEARS OF AGE, IN A FORWARD-FACING CHILD SEAT.
(C) IF THE CHILD IS NOT MORE THAN 57 INCHES TALL AND WEIGHS 50 POUNDS OR MORE, OR IS 5 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER BUT LESS THAN 10 YEARS OF AGE, IN A BOOSTER SEAT.
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BookMama
Senior Community Member
Re: Um, wow.
OK, I looked at this more closely (of course I had to). I believe the new wording, convoluted as it may be, means this:
- RF until 2 AND 30
- FF harness until 5 AND 50
- Booster until 10 AND 57"
I think that would give Michigan the best child passenger safety laws in the country, wouldn't it?
They changed the wording today. Not sure exactly what it means - don't have time to look at it closely, and the "not more than" and "not less than" is very confusing. But it looks like kids would have to be in a booster until 57" or their 10th birthday. I like that a lot.
Here's the current wording:
(A) IF THE CHILD WEIGHS NOT MORE THAN 30 POUNDS OR IS LESS THAN 2 YEARS OF AGE, IN A REAR-FACING CHILD SEAT.
(B) IF THE CHILD WEIGHS NOT LESS THAN 30 POUNDS BUT LESS THAN 50 POUNDS, OR IS 2 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER BUT LESS THAN 5 YEARS OF AGE, IN A FORWARD-FACING CHILD SEAT.
(C) IF THE CHILD IS NOT MORE THAN 57 INCHES TALL AND WEIGHS 50 POUNDS OR MORE, OR IS 5 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER BUT LESS THAN 10 YEARS OF AGE, IN A BOOSTER SEAT.
OK, I looked at this more closely (of course I had to). I believe the new wording, convoluted as it may be, means this:
- RF until 2 AND 30
- FF harness until 5 AND 50
- Booster until 10 AND 57"
I think that would give Michigan the best child passenger safety laws in the country, wouldn't it?
BookMama
Senior Community Member
Re: Um, wow.
Yeah, I'm not a huge fan of the 50 lb. minimum for boostering, but other than that, I think the proposed law is beautiful (though, again, the actual wording is convoluted).
Yeah, I'm not a huge fan of the 50 lb. minimum for boostering, but other than that, I think the proposed law is beautiful (though, again, the actual wording is convoluted).
aept
New member
I think it might still be telling me I have to forward-face my 38lb 3 year old.
But I agree it is better and like the RF until 2 aspect. I'm relieved to see it isn't telling people to automatically FF once they hit 30 lbs.
Of course there are still some children that will max out their 35-40lb RF weight limit seat before 2, and not be able to afford something different, but this version is getting better.
But I agree it is better and like the RF until 2 aspect. I'm relieved to see it isn't telling people to automatically FF once they hit 30 lbs.
Of course there are still some children that will max out their 35-40lb RF weight limit seat before 2, and not be able to afford something different, but this version is getting better.
Carrie_R
Ambassador - CPS Technician
It looks like the 50lb minimum is only for,kids under 5. Once they turn 5, they move into the booster portion.
So ALL under-30lb kids *and* ALL under-2yos must RF.
Then they must FF until they hit 5y or 50lb.
Then booster til 10y or 4ft9.
Agreed that I dislike the fact that there is no allowance for staying in the more restrictive category. Then again, we have that here (it's booster at 4y) and it is interpreted as if it allows harnessing, too.
So ALL under-30lb kids *and* ALL under-2yos must RF.
Then they must FF until they hit 5y or 50lb.
Then booster til 10y or 4ft9.
Agreed that I dislike the fact that there is no allowance for staying in the more restrictive category. Then again, we have that here (it's booster at 4y) and it is interpreted as if it allows harnessing, too.
thekatie
New member
My future DIL
She's 9 and not even 40 pounds yet. My 3 year old is only about 7 pounds behind her.I can't lie. I get really, really, REALLY confused with the "not yet not nor unto wheras" blah blah that is legalese. To the point that the newer wording just doesn't even mean anything to me, and I would have to trust someone to interpret. This is why I took one course of law and said no way. BUT! Rear facing to 2, I like it.
Re: Um, wow.
They could easily fix the rf/ff thing by making the wording on the second part ”a five point harness child seat” rather than ” forward facing.” Although I suppose that excludes the kiddy.
There should also be a medical exemption with doctor's consultation if there isn't already (there are obese children who are over 50 before 2... There are kids with low weights and medical problems who need a ff sn seat...)
They could easily fix the rf/ff thing by making the wording on the second part ”a five point harness child seat” rather than ” forward facing.” Although I suppose that excludes the kiddy.
There should also be a medical exemption with doctor's consultation if there isn't already (there are obese children who are over 50 before 2... There are kids with low weights and medical problems who need a ff sn seat...)
BookMama
Senior Community Member
It says if the child is 30-50 lbs OR is age 2-5, they must be in a harness. So, a child must be 50 lbs AND over 50 lbs for neither of those things to be true.
BookMama
Senior Community Member
The document I linked to earlier has the usual exemptions for medical issues, size, etc. I'd link to it again here but I'm on my phone and it takes me forever to type a post even without including a link.
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