Subaru...who knew?!

nataliem257

New member
Calling all gearheads. :D After the recent crash testing results on the Mazda 5, I've started researching/shopping my next car. I started out with a long list, and I've narrowed it down to a short list, all of which have positives and negatives. They all are similar in price, fuel economy, and are IIHS top safety picks +, and 5 star overall NHTSA. Hopefully someone will have some personal experience with some of the options that will help me off the fence. Here's my top 4:

2014 Mazda CX-5. I love, love, love this car. Aesthetically, this car wins by a mile. It was super fun to drive too. This is the car I "want", for all of the unpractical reasons. The big strike against is the stupid split in the backseat, rendering the middle seat completely useless. I only have 2 kids, so a lack of three across options isn't a total deal breaker, but with my oldest starting Kindergarten I wouldn't say a friend tag along occasionally wouldn't happen. If anyone has any experience with a three across, of any seats, that involved a HBB, that would be really helpful, because I can't see how it would be possible. My only option would be to get the lowest trim level that has a normal 60/40 split, which means no safety technology that I really really want. (Smart Brake and Frontal Obstruction Warning)

2014 Mazda 6. This is my 2nd favorite car stylistically. Fun to drive, sporty, nice and roomy cabin/backseat. The strike against it is the same as the CX-5, in order to get the nice safety tech I have to get the top of the line trim, which puts it in the upper portion of my budget. I think this is ridiculous. Why can't more manufacturers make options for people who like safety but are indifferent to butt warmers?

2014 Honda Accord. The biggest plus in the Accord's column is, well, it’s a Honda. I trust the brand, I drove a civic for 7 years before my 5 and loved it, traded it in with 140,000 and never did anything but an oil change. It’s a nice looking car, I liked the test drive, also plenty of room in the cabin and the backseat looked very carseat friendly. Their tech features are less fancy (frontal crash warning only, no braking), but are available on mid grade trims so I could get one for pretty reasonable.

2015 Subaru Legacy (hence the title). This car is a game changer. It would have never occurred to me to consider a Subaru, but I stumbled across it researching and was kinda blown away. The far and away most advanced safety technology in the class, G's across the board in the IIHS, and the bonus point for being the only car I'm considering to completely ace the NHTSA with 5 stars across the board. And all of that available for around $25,000. I test drove it and I really liked it, it felt very luxurious in the cabin, and although that wonky seat bight in the back left me scratching my head for a moment, I had a boulevard installed outboard in less than 3 minutes. I didn't install it but I did sit it in the middle, and I think a seatbelt install there would work, so lots of 3 across potential. And although it's a bonus that wasn't even on my radar, I could definitely see AWD being a safety feature. I don't LOVE the look of the car, but it’s very very nice, so I would definitely say I "like" it. The only real strike against it is I'm completely unfamiliar with the brand, I have never even known someone who drove one. So here are my options as I see it now --

Get a CX-5 in the lower trim, and compromise the safety tech. Does anyone have any statistics on how much the crash prevention features actually affect real world crash occurrence? Get a Mazda 6 in the highest trim and break the bank. Go with the old tried and true Honda, or get the Subaru that all signs are pointing to as the smartest play. Anyone that has any real life experience with problems, advantages, or incompatibilities with any of these cars but especially the Subaru as I'm completely clueless, would be greatly appreciated. I'm so undecided!
 
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Lemonade

New member
DH recently got rid of his 11 yr old subaru forester. He cheaped out when he got it and got a basic package so the seat wasn't terribly comfortable for road trips, but other than that, it was a work horse. My FIL is on his second Subaru. It's an outback - the SUV. He's had it 3-4 years and loves it. Before this he had a legacy wagon for a few years - maybe on a lease?
We loved the safety and reliability ratings. Their only vehicle that didn't have the same caliber ratings as the others is the Tribeca (their only 7 passenger offering) and it is no longer being made after there 2014 model year. I REALLY hope they come out with a good 7 passenger vehicle in the next couple of years so I can get it when we retire my 06 Toyota minivan. Otherwise I'll get a Highlander I think. Sounds like you are looking at the regular legacy sedan but the majority of the subaru vehicles have similarly awesome ratings.

So yeah, I'm a big subaru fan. They used to be a niche car and seem to be more mainstream now, though still I think more popular among the crunchy or slightly crunchy. I definitely see more of them at Whole Foods, Trader Joe's, and our co-op than in the regular grocery store parking lot:eek::D
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
The 2015 Legacy (and Outback) is a refreshed model and the crash tests will not carry over. You'll have to wait for new ones:-( Subaru has modified the structure with more advanced high strength alloys, presumably to improve a couple of the crash test results (IIHS small overlap and NHTSA side pole crash for the a female driver). Eyesight also gets an update, adding better sensors for faster response and increased range for earlier warnings. It will also add blind spot, lane change and cross traffic warnings plus adaptive cruise control. All that for $1200!

Here is a nice preview:

http://www.autoblog.com/2014/05/21/2015-subaru-legacy-first-drive-review/

I'll be getting one in a few months for review, perhaps not soon enough for you though. I'm going to a Subaru presentation on the Legacy/Outback in 2 weeks, I might have some more technical info at that time. I'll ask if they know if/when it will be crash tested!

I had the Accord a few weeks ago. Very nice overall, but not particularly exciting in any regard. Beware the outboard vehicle seat back bolsters. They can make 3-across problematic, especially if you have a wider forward facing seat in one of those spots.
 

jjordan

Moderator
I love our Subaru's AWD. Unfortunately the car is 17+ years old and probably won't be with us much longer... I don't know where you live, but if you don't know anyone who drives a Subaru, I'm assuming you don't have snow. They are very popular up here! But without snow/ice, AWD seems (to my snow-centric mind) sort of unnecessary.
 

nataliem257

New member
The 2015 Legacy (and Outback) is a refreshed model and the crash tests will not carry over. You'll have to wait for new ones:-( Subaru has modified the structure with more advanced high strength alloys, presumably to improve a couple of the crash test results (IIHS small overlap and NHTSA side pole crash for the a female driver). Eyesight also gets an update, adding better sensors for faster response and increased range for earlier warnings. It will also add blind spot, lane change and cross traffic warnings plus adaptive cruise control. All that for $1200!

Here is a nice preview:

http://www.autoblog.com/2014/05/21/2015-subaru-legacy-first-drive-review/

I'll be getting one in a few months for review, perhaps not soon enough for you though. I'm going to a Subaru presentation next week, I might have some more technical info at that time. I'll ask if they know if/when it will be crash tested!

I feel pretty good that they wouldn't take a step backwards, I'm comfortable going off of the 2014 testing and assuming that the new model will perform as well, unless someone had a good reason to think otherwise? Or should I be looking at the 2014? I wanted 2015 because I like the look of the refresh.
 

nataliem257

New member
I love our Subaru's AWD. Unfortunately the car is 17+ years old and probably won't be with us much longer... I don't know where you live, but if you don't know anyone who drives a Subaru, I'm assuming you don't have snow. They are very popular up here! But without snow/ice, AWD seems (to my snow-centric mind) sort of unnecessary.

We have small amounts of snow and ice, at least once a year (Arkansas), coupled with a city who doesn't know how to get rid of it and 250,000 people who don't know how to drive in it, couple that with a job that wants me to come in regardless of weather and it's definitely a perk!
 

DawgDad

New member
Wow...good list!

I have driven all of these...so I am going to respond based on my personal opinion and some facts. :)

CX 5 - Love the design of the car...definitely the best looking compact SUV on the market. Great acceleration and great safety scores (especially the overlap). My gripes are with the backseat. Just like you, the split is absolutely stupid. And, you have to control the fold down from the trunk...but we all know you can't do it all from there as it requires the headrest being out of the way and some pushing and nudging from the back seat side. Lastly, riding in the back is one of the worst...comparable to the Rav 4. The seats are comfortable, yes, but I can't hear a word anyone is saying up front from all the wind & tire noise in the back.

The 6 - great looking car. This and the Fusion have been some of the most striking affordable sedans on the market...even better looking than some luxury. I am not really sold on the safety tech that brakes FOR you. It is a great concept that I still think needs some tweaking. Some early complaints is that it doesn't do it at certain speeds and it has done it before you needed it which has caused a rear collision when you could have avoided a collision on the front or back all together (you had time to swerve onto the shoulder avoiding a possible fender bender). Either way, you might could live without the tech, but I understand your reasoning because that's how you are justifying trading in the Mazda 5...it's all about the safety! :)

Accord - Uhm...what can I really say here except I LOVE it? It's a Honda...it's old reliable...it's got tasteful styling like not too much and not too little. It comes standard with more as Honda tends not to nickle and dime you to death over options. It's bigger, if I am not mistaken, in the back than both the 6 and the Legacy, which will give you more options for carseat installs. I like it a lot.

Legacy - Great addition to your list. Many years ago, I was one of the first reviewers of this new car when it hit the market. You know who they were targeting when they came to the US? BMW & Volvo. Weird, huh? Either way, I rated it higher than the BMW & Volvo in many categories and one was handling. That AWD Subaru coupled with the appropriate power makes this a car driver's best friend. They have obviously improved over the years (but to be fair, so has most other cars) and still make a quality car. They are a little more niche than VW across the country, meaning that not every state sells a Subaru (which translates into servicing issues). However, they combat that with superior quality than VW, so it's stayed relatively quiet with them on major issues over the years. I personally have not liked the styling of the Legacy up until the new 2015s where they copied a lot of the Ford Fusion and Infiniti G37. They really stepped it up on the interior as well, so because you are considering a 2015, I fully support this as a VERY competitive offering to your list. IF you can keep the nickel and diming of their add-ons to a minimum, I think you can get yourself a great car here.

Ultimately, you have to drive these cars...with the seats installed...and preferably with the family in tow. Why? Because, why simulate something that isn't your daily life to buy something so important to protecting & serving it?

I am jealous you are getting to do this as I wish I had endless gobs of money to just buy cars all the time. If it really came down to it, my top picks would be the Legacy or the Accord.
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
I've purchased cars before crash test results were available. If I recall correctly, that was the case when we bought our 2000 Outback that was all-new that year. It ended up doing well, but there can always be surprises. For example, I was told that Hyundai had an emphasis on the small overlap rating for the new 2015 Sonata. They improved it, but it didn't get a Good rating. So you never know!

You definitely need to check out your carseats in one. Extreme side bolsters are becoming more common in the back seat. It's a great feature for the driver as they tend to be very supportive, but not-so-great for installing wide front-facing carseats. They can even make it incompatible with some. These seem more common in sedans than SUVs. I wish the trend would stop, at least in the family vehicle demographic.
 

T4K

Well-known member
My husbands Passat sorta has bolsters which look spiffy but make the three across potential difficult.
 

nataliem257

New member
I love the styling of the fusion, it was the last one to get cut from the list, only because the cost seems to run a 1,000 or 2 more for comparable features, and I like the Mazda 6 just slightly better for styling. A compelling argument could get them back in the running though!
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
I feel pretty good that they wouldn't take a step backwards, I'm comfortable going off of the 2014 testing and assuming that the new model will perform as well, unless someone had a good reason to think otherwise? Or should I be looking at the 2014? I wanted 2015 because I like the look of the refresh.

I forgot to mention that the 2015 model may well improve on those two tests where it didn't get a top rating in 2014;-)

We have small amounts of snow and ice, at least once a year (Arkansas), coupled with a city who doesn't know how to get rid of it and 250,000 people who don't know how to drive in it, couple that with a job that wants me to come in regardless of weather and it's definitely a perk!

AWD is nice, but marginally useful unless you have hills or unplowed/untreated roads. I liked our Outback, but to be honest, AWD just isn't a big deal around Chicago. Here, it's more likely to get you into trouble thinking you magically have better braking or can drive at higher speeds. It's almost always pickups and SUVs on the side of the road when the snow is coming down fast! My Highlander Hybrid has AWD, but I often take the Prius to save gas, even in the winter.

Of course, it's standard on the Subarus, but on other vehicles I'd save the money if you haven't had any issue with a 2WD car. It's cheaper up front, cheaper to maintain and saves fuel too.

I love the styling of the fusion, it was the last one to get cut from the list, only because the cost seems to run a 1,000 or 2 more for comparable features, and I like the Mazda 6 just slightly better for styling. A compelling argument could get them back in the running though!

Ford often has better dealer and consumer incentives than Honda or Toyota. The only way to compare is to negotiate on a similarly equipped vehicle or check out "street prices" at a buying service like Carsdirect or Truecar or one of those. And if you don't mind a 1-2 year old model, they tend to be better deals as Fords depreciate a bit more right away. A lot of that is because their sticker prices are inflated more because of those incentives.

I'd love to have a Fusion Energi!
 

nataliem257

New member
Dawgs comment has me rethinking the Subaru. Basically eyesight is the selling point for me, and the capability to get it with lower trims therefore less money. It never really occured to me that it could be buggy and cause problems in some instances. Eyesight seems to be rated better than most (according to IIHS it was the only one able to stop a collision at the higher speed threshold, excluding luxury cars), but if we're not loving it's practical use the Subaru likely goes out and the Honda moves up.
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
I think it's a good feature. I've had a number of review models with autobrake and have had it kick in a couple times. I don't know that it prevented a crash, but it certainly has the potential. If you drive in a lot of stop and go traffic, it definitely could. I'd say it's also likely a bigger benefit for inattentive or less experienced drivers. For example, something I might want for my teen driver, but wouldn't necessarily need for myself.

In another few years, we should have more data and studies with the proliferation of these systems on mainstream vehicles.

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/sr/statusreport/article/49/4/2

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/sr/statusreport/article/47/5/1

I've never once had a buggy system from any manufacturer cause me a problem. The worst I've encountered are lane departure warnings that are too sensitive. In almost all cases, you can override these warnings and systems when needed. Some are adjustable in sensitivity as well.
 

DawgDad

New member
I think it's a good feature. I've had a number of review models with autobrake and have had it kick in a couple times. I don't know that it prevented a crash, but it certainly has the potential. If you drive in a lot of stop and go traffic, it definitely could. I'd say it's also likely a bigger benefit for inattentive or less experienced drivers. For example, something I might want for my teen driver, but wouldn't necessarily need for myself.


http://www.iihs.org/iihs/sr/statusreport/article/49/4/2

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/sr/statusreport/article/47/5/1

I've never once had a buggy system from any manufacturer cause me a problem. The worst I've encountered are lane departure warnings that are too sensitive. In almost all cases, you can override these warnings and systems when needed. Some are adjustable in sensitivity as well.

Yep. Warnings have been around a while, it's the auto-braking stuff that is still relatively new. Some do it better than others now, but again...it's really intended for "urban" speeds and the inexperienced driver. I believe the Subaru has a better system, but I personally wouldn't put that on my list of "must haves". It can be fully disabled in the car if I remember correctly and the 2015s have an improved version of it over what they had in the previous generation (I think they upped the speed differential between moving and non-moving substantially).

To add to the other points so I can save from multiple responses...I would caution in buying any first year model release on ANY car. I would say there is a 95% track record of the second year of a new model release being the best version of that model series when they iron out bugs, defects, and any number of things to make it the better car after a year under their belt with reviews from consumers. With the Subaru getting a lot of changes to the car, it's worth taking that into consideration...even though I think stylistically they vastly improved over the previous generation.

The Ford, while stickered higher, will be lower when you deal than probably any other car here. I have NEVER purchased a Ford for more than Invoice...ever (well down in the dealer holdback). I currently have the 2014 Fusion SE and like it a lot. I wish I could get the hybrid versions of the car as I think it would be awesome, but it's a company car for me...so I can't complain too much. I would put them on the list if you like it.

Again, still have to say as much a pain as it is, you have to try your seats in all of them for more than anything, the new side bolsters. It is pretty nice to have for a backless booster as it provides some side head support if you have a sleepy child as your oldest continues to age up in seats.
 

BananaBoat

Well-known member
While I have driven MANY cars, I have only ever owned Subaru. I :love: them. For as long as I have a ski-slope driveway or live where it snows with any regularity, I will be a loyal Subaru driver.
 

cantabdad

New member
I agree with the previous posters that there really is no substitute for loading up the kids and their carseats and going on a solid test drive. But you can't really go too far astray with any of the 4 on your short list. In addition to their safety scores, they are all recommended by Consumer Reports and score above-average on key metrics like reliability, owner satisfaction, and overall cost to own.

We have an Outback, which is the wagon version of the Legacy, and carseat compatibility is pretty good: the backseat is an almost completely flat bench and the LATCH lower anchors are easily accessible behind velcro covers. The middle seat is narrow -- but unlike the CX-5, it is still usable for a narrow carseat like a Radian or Bubble Bum. For us, it's adequate for the occasional 3-across when we have a friend along. The 2015 model apparently adds an inch or so to the backseat width.

One thing that occurs to me is that Subaru dealers are pretty scarce in Arkansas -- I think only 2 or 3 in the state. That means pretty limited options if you have any issues with sales or service. (By contrast, here in New England, Subarus are among the most common vehicles on the road.)
 

nataliem257

New member
I agree with the previous posters that there really is no substitute for loading up the kids and their carseats and going on a solid test drive. But you can't really go too far astray with any of the 4 on your short list. In addition to their safety scores, they are all recommended by Consumer Reports and score above-average on key metrics like reliability, owner satisfaction, and overall cost to own.

We have an Outback, which is the wagon version of the Legacy, and carseat compatibility is pretty good: the backseat is an almost completely flat bench and the LATCH lower anchors are easily accessible behind velcro covers. The middle seat is narrow -- but unlike the CX-5, it is still usable for a narrow carseat like a Radian or Bubble Bum. For us, it's adequate for the occasional 3-across when we have a friend along. The 2015 model apparently adds an inch or so to the backseat width.

One thing that occurs to me is that Subaru dealers are pretty scarce in Arkansas -- I think only 2 or 3 in the state. That means pretty limited options if you have any issues with sales or service. (By contrast, here in New England, Subarus are among the most common vehicles on the road.)

There's only one in my area, but that 1 happens to be less than a mile from my work. Another key thing to mention is I'm seriously considering leasing this time so likely I wouldn't have the car long enough to get out of the factory warranty. I plan on taking seats and driving it again this weekend. I have a Boulevard, a radian, an 85 and a 90 for optional seats so as long as there is some 3 across possible with a combo of those seats and some booster, for the rare occurrence it's needed, I think I'll be good. In all honesty I am feeling pretty certain that's what I'm getting. I can get all the features I want without paying for anything that I dont. Eyesight models won't be out for a while but the dealership is going to build one for me so by the time it's ready I'll be ready to go. :D

Man I still love that cx5 though :crying:
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
If a compact SUV is in the running, I bet you can get a great deal on a 2014 Forester with Eyesight. This is a top contender if I consider a vehicle for my kids to drive in a year or two.
 

nataliem257

New member
If a compact SUV is in the running, I bet you can get a great deal on a 2014 Forester with Eyesight. This is a top contender if I consider a vehicle for my kids to drive in a year or two.

Interesting. I knocked out the outback because of price, didn't look at the Forester. How's the backseat? It's slightly more expensive than the Legacy, with slightly less fuel economy, is there a benefit I'm unaware of?
 

Athena

Well-known member
I have a new 2015 Forester and I like it so much more than I expected. I mostly looked at small SUVs (Honda CRV, Hyundai Sante Fe sport, Toyota Rav4, Ford Escape, and a few others), but it easily won in our important criteria of head and leg room and visibility, along with some of the best crash testing and I think the best MPG too. And did I mention the rear view camera is now standard on all models? I was looking for safety, but what I hadn't expected was how luxurious it feels, something I could not say about the old Subarus. I know nothing about the Legacy (only tried the Forester and Outback), but if you have any questions about it or any I tried, feel free to ask! HTH! Good luck!
 

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