Question vehicle head support in LBBs?

Athena

Well-known member
New car shopping requires me to try to figure out our needs for the years to come. Right now the kids are in a HBB and HWH seat, but I got to thinking how in just 2 years DD2 will be in a HBB and DD1 might have moved to a LBB and noticed that those rear seat headrests aren't all that tall. This got me wondering if they'll be high enough to safely use a LBB. It seems that all modern cars would have high enough headrests for that and maybe they are. It just doesn't make sense that they wouldn't, right? Yet, when I sat in the seat, it seemed that it was just tall enough for my average height torso, so would it work for a tall older kid in a LBB? Or, moving forward in time, will they be tall enough when my almost 8yo is tall teen?

Thanks for your help with this!


(I wasn't sure if this went here or in car safety because my question is about LBB use, but also vehicle head rest safety. If I was wrong, please move. Thank you.)
 
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SnoGurl

New member
My mom's car, a 2013 Sentra just has little bumps on the two outboard positions for headrest, which are barely tall enough for me, at 5'0. Too short for my brother who is only about 5'6". On the other hand, the rear headrests in my 2012 RAV are quite tall. So it's definitely something to watch for. I'm not in the booster stage yet, so not sure how thick most boosters are, but an older booster child would definitely be close in the Sentra. I guess that might be an incognito situation? We don't have it here, but seems like it might help with shorter headrests.
 

Athena

Well-known member
Thanks! I'm looking at small SUVs (e.g. Forester) with real head rests back there, so I was surprised to see they weren't taller. We've had car seats back there for so many years, I guess I hadn't noticed.
 

tiggercat

New member
My 8yo is now too tall to sit in the 3rd row of my van in a backless, but her parkway back is too tall (hits the cieling) :( Definitely try them out and try to estimate. It is a definite issue.
 

Athena

Well-known member
My 8yo is now too tall to sit in the 3rd row of my van in a backless, but her parkway back is too tall (hits the cieling) :( Definitely try them out and try to estimate. It is a definite issue.

Good to know! That's the other thing I've been checking for is ceiling height to accommodate their FRs. Then I got to thinking, how long will they be in their FRs, that got me to thinking about LBB and here I am! ;) It's completely freaking me out to think about them being big and in LBB or, one day, nothing but a seatbelt. :eek:
 

tiggercat

New member
Good to know! That's the other thing I've been checking for is ceiling height to accommodate their FRs. Then I got to thinking, how long will they be in their FRs, that got me to thinking about LBB and here I am! ;) It's completely freaking me out to think about them being big and in LBB or, one day, nothing but a seatbelt. :eek:

Yeah, my teenager sits in the front occasionally. Eek!
 

Athena

Well-known member
The head rest only needs to be as tall as the tops of the ears? Is that right? Is that really tall enough to be safe?
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
The head rest only needs to be as tall as the tops of the ears? Is that right? Is that really tall enough to be safe?

Yeah, midpoint of the head is where the magic height is to prevent whiplash.

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/ratings-info/rear-head-restraints-test

"a government standard in effect since September 2010 requires a minimum of 29.5 inches from an occupant's hip to the top of a head restraint and a backset of 2.2. inches or less. This guarantees that nearly all new head restraints would be rated good for geometry by IIHS."
 

Athena

Well-known member
Yeah, midpoint of the head is where the magic height is to prevent whiplash.

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/ratings-info/rear-head-restraints-test

"a government standard in effect since September 2010 requires a minimum of 29.5 inches from an occupant's hip to the top of a head restraint and a backset of 2.2. inches or less. This guarantees that nearly all new head restraints would be rated good for geometry by IIHS."

Do they think that 29.5" is really tall enough for most adults? It doesn't seem that tall.
 

Athena

Well-known member
If I try her in the car I'm thinking of buying in a LBB, how many inches of growth does she need between eye level and top of vehicle head rest? And would the bottom of a Turbo be okay for this test?

She's almost 54" now and nowhere near 5 stepping. Although she rides in a HBB now, I'm sure she'll need to convert to LBB before she 5 steps, so I need that to be an option. I don't think any of us want to spend money on a new car that wouldn't work for LBB use.
 

Athena

Well-known member
She has at least 3.5" (when she's stretched up all straight and tall) and probably more like 4.5" (sitting normal) between her current eye level and top of head rest sitting in backless SGL. Of course, I have no idea how much her torso and head will grow before she doesn't need a booster, but to my untrained eye, it looks like she has some decent growing room. Anyone have any thoughts? I'd really like to hear from those of you with some experience before I spend thousands on this car. Thank you!!!

P.S. Of course, this may not matter because she loathed sitting in the backless, but when she's 9 yo, she might change her mind, right? And isn't there a time between HBB and 5 stepping when that's the only option? Or will our FR85 really take her to 5 stepping?
 

abigaylebelle

Active member
Which model year forester are you looking at? I have a 2011 forester and even though the headrests don't look terribly tall I have not yet encountered an adult who didn't have headrest to their ears. Even my 6'5" brother had enough headrest.

Also I would expect that a frontier 85 would likely take the girls to 5-stepping and if it didn't there is the incognito.
 

Athena

Well-known member
Which model year forester are you looking at? I have a 2011 forester and even though the headrests don't look terribly tall I have not yet encountered an adult who didn't have headrest to their ears. Even my 6'5" brother had enough headrest.

Also I would expect that a frontier 85 would likely take the girls to 5-stepping and if it didn't there is the incognito.

Thank you so much for the feedback! I'm looking at 2015, so probably one model newer than 2011. As far as I could tell from looking and sitting in both, the head rests appear to be about the same height in those two models. Is your tall brother long legged? As long as my tall girls will fit, we're probably okay. They might be longer in the torso, a definite disadvantage. I was amazed to see a LBB would actually be an option in this car in shoulder belt fit too because it's not even close on my current car and I'm not sure it would ever be an option it's so far out.
 

gigi

New member
Do they think that 29.5" is really tall enough for most adults? It doesn't seem that tall.

Our Impreza has low headrests like this. It is *just* at my ear tops when I sit in the back center seat. I am 5'2"ish. I can see putting my son in the front as soon as he hits the puberty growth spurt, as I anticipate him being taller than me by 5th grade. He has a parkway for that car that will fit him until 8 I hope. As soon as he hits 60lbs (about to turn 7 and weighs in the low 50s now) I likely will get him the Incognito because it is so low profile and just hope that gets him to a safe front seat age.

That was my long way of saying, yes I anticipate this will be a problem in the future unfortunately.
 

Athena

Well-known member
Our Impreza has low headrests like this. It is *just* at my ear tops when I sit in the back center seat. I am 5'2"ish. I can see putting my son in the front as soon as he hits the puberty growth spurt, as I anticipate him being taller than me by 5th grade. He has a parkway for that car that will fit him until 8 I hope. As soon as he hits 60lbs (about to turn 7 and weighs in the low 50s now) I likely will get him the Incognito because it is so low profile and just hope that gets him to a safe front seat age.

That was my long way of saying, yes I anticipate this will be a problem in the future unfortunately.

Are they shorter? The Forester's work for me and I'm taller than that, but I wish I knew if they'd work for our needs for the next several years. Your son is tall! I was going to say he sounded similar in size to my 7yo, but if he'll be over 62" by 5th grade, wow, that's tall.
 

safeinthecar

Moderator - CPS Technician
Do they think that 29.5" is really tall enough for most adults? It doesn't seem that tall.

I'm 5'5" with a very long torso...longer than my oldest children who are both over 5'10. I sat criss cross applesauce against the wall and from floor to the top of my ears is 30 inches, so I'd say 29" will be enough for lots of adults but probably falls short of qualifying for *most*
 

Athena

Well-known member
I'm 5'5" with a very long torso...longer than my oldest children who are both over 5'10. I sat criss cross applesauce against the wall and from floor to the top of my ears is 30 inches, so I'd say 29" will be enough for lots of adults but probably falls short of qualifying for *most*

This is very helpful! Thanks! The car we're looking at buying is about 31.5", so maybe that is good enough?

Maybe I should stop stressing over whether it will work for the rest of our days and buy it. On the other hand, I can't believe more people don't test out their car seats and think about these things when buying cars. At least I get the feeling these salesmen think I'm a little odd, so others probably aren't.
 

gigi

New member
Are they shorter? The Forester's work for me and I'm taller than that, but I wish I knew if they'd work for our needs for the next several years. Your son is tall! I was going to say he sounded similar in size to my 7yo, but if he'll be over 62" by 5th grade, wow, that's tall.

He is about 50" now in 1st grade. Maybe I have my math wrong and I have some extra time but I was about 60" in 5th grade so I assume he will be too. I was never tall though...always short.
 

Athena

Well-known member
He is about 50" now in 1st grade. Maybe I have my math wrong and I have some extra time but I was about 60" in 5th grade so I assume he will be too. I was never tall though...always short.

I go by the height percentile growth charts to project how tall my kids will be. http://www.cdc.gov/growthcharts/data/set1clinical/cj41l021.pdf If at turning 7yo he's 50", he's between the 50th and 75th % and won't be 62" until almost 13yo. I hope that eases your mind. :) Of course, that's assuming he follows the curve consistently like my kids. Do some kids vary a lot? Mine have been consistent from the day they were born in height %, so it makes it easy to project. If only I knew how to project that onto what height head rest they need.

Even my over 53", possibly 54" tall 7yo shouldn't be 62" until 11, according to her girls' chart. Of course, I'm more worried about her height with a booster and assuming she'll need one until about then. At 62", do you 5 step in most cars? I wonder when she'll be able to go without, not that I'm in any hurry, as safety comes first.
 

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