My oldest 5 steps...

Baylor

New member
Today I put his booster in my dh's ford explorer and the shoulder belt looked so wonky. Too low for him. Took the booster out, Lap belt low on the hips, Shoulder belt right between his shoulder and neck. It looked good.

He was thrilled. I told him this does not mean he will be able to go without a booster in all cars but in my dh's back seat, He is now boosterless.

My other guy is going to be 6 and he is going to be leaving the FR85 behind in the spring.
How the heck did they get so big??
 
ADS

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
At nine I would seriously consider an Incognito for him, give his skeleton more time to mature.

Wendy
 

Kac

Ambassador - CPS Technician
Ooh, that is a good excuse to get an Incognito! They look so neat!
 

Baylor

New member
At nine I would seriously consider an Incognito for him, give his skeleton more time to mature.

Wendy

I'm good with him in a belt.
If I understand the incognito the clips at the lap are just plastic and not structural. Just to makes sure the belt is in the right position in a crash right?
 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
It still doesn't change the fact that his skeleton is that of a 9yo.

Right. He doesn't have an anterior superior iliac crest. That comes at puberty. That's what holds our lap belts down for us (which is why at 5'1" I'm safe in just the belt, but a 5'1" 10 year old is not).

Our hips go like this: ( His go like this: |. In a crash the lap belt can slide up to his belly causing internal and spinal injuries.

This is where the Incognito is perfect.

Wendy
 

Baylor

New member
It still doesn't change the fact that his skeleton is that of a 9yo.

Yes but until last nov this seat was not even available. 5 stepping is 5 stepping. IS it going to change if the make a booster to hold a 200 lb 14 yr old?

He meets the requirements. He 5 steps. I am not buying a seat that provides NO structural help. the belt fits him good.
 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
Five stepping is the minimum. Five stepping is the 1 and 20 of the seatbelt world. It means you get to say, "Congrats, I did the minimum." We know you too well and know that's not what you want.

The Incognito is designed exactly for kids like him. Kids who need a little help with the belt, but otherwise are ok.

Remember, you want to max him out in a booster, give his skeleton time to mature and gain adult shape and strength and size before you put him in an adult seatbelt.

Here's the 10 year old dummy.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yUl4dCK1GA"]Adult belt is not enough - YouTube[/ame]

See the submarining and how high the lap belt goes on his belly? That's what we're trying to avoid here.

Wendy
 

Baylor

New member
Im sorry I posted this.

HE 5 steps. That is always the goal here and now its not.

The booster makes the seat belt fit him worse. The lap belt is low on his hips. His knees bend at the end of the seat. The shoulder belt is squarely in the middle of his shoulder/neck and his feet are square on the floor.

If the incognito is to make the belt fit him better, He does not need it. The belt fit is great. IT comes from low behind the seat and sits nice at tight across his hips. An incognito is not going to make the fit better.
 

Keeyamah

Active member
I'm kinda with Baylor on this one, it's plastic is that is going to break or deform under crash conditions maybe offering a half-second of additional proper belt fit. Would we have been saying this to her prior to the Incognito coming out, or would you have suggested she find a different NBB that didn't mess with the belt fit as much? And assuming she COULDN'T, wouldn't we have congratulated her on keeping her kiddo boostered long past the minimum and waiting until he did pass the test?
 

carseatcoach

Carseat Crankypants
It's great to have a 9yo boostered, but 9yo and 55" is really NOT long past the minimum. We usually recommend boostering until 57".

An extra half-second of proper belt fit can be crucial, if that half-second is at the moment of impact.
 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
So a year ago I would have recommended a shorter booster like the Harmony or something that didn't offer as much rise, but still offered a benefit to the child. And as we're talking about $12-$20 here (and she has a second who can use either later), it's not a big financial deal for the vast majority of people.

Wendy
 

Keeyamah

Active member
It's great to have a 9yo boostered, but 9yo and 55" is really NOT long past the minimum. We usually recommend boostering until 57". An extra half-second of proper belt fit can be crucial, if that half-second is at the moment of impact.

Well, considering the minimum in my state is 7 yrs of age, no height or weight requirements, IME, it is long past the minimum. Especially considering many parents view the "through the 6th year" to mean 6th birthday, not 7th. I do get where everyone is coming from on both sides, we have the ability to provide this child with more protection for a longer time, but she as a parent is allowed to make that decision of if she has the $$ to spend (I know the incognito is very inexpensive, but I'm not sure I would spend the money on it in her situation with where I am financially, I'd rather spend it on an ERF seat).
 

Keeyamah

Active member
So a year ago I would have recommended a shorter booster like the Harmony or something that didn't offer as much rise, but still offered a benefit to the child. And as we're talking about $12-$20 here (and she has a second who can use either later), it's not a big financial deal for the vast majority of people. Wendy

She owns a literider, and as I said in my earlier post, assuming that that or the Topside didn't offer a proper fit, I.E. As she said, shoulder belt off the shoulder and lap belt wrong as well, without the Incognito, we would have congratulated her on keeping him in a booster until he no longer fit, or am I wrong? Those are the narrowest/thinnest boosters right?
 

Baylor

New member
"Use of proper child car seats is important for your child’s safety. Pennsylvania law requires you to have your child in an appropriate car seat, or you risk a $75 fine.

Follow these guidelines when buying a car seat for your child:

Children under 4 years old: Use a federally approved child car seat, appropriate for the height and weight of your child.
4 to 8 years old: Use a booster seat until your child reaches the height and weight maximum.
Make sure you follow the manufacturer’s instructions for installation and height/weight restrictions for your car seat."
Car seat laws in PA.

I have never been about following the minimum. When I came here I was going to harness said child until college if I could. I have learned a lot here. I have always come and ask if there was even a question of safety.

I don't need another seat and I don't think he does either. As I said he will not be 5 stepping in every car we have or ride in. But in my dh's car the booster causes a worse fit by making him too high. My thread is specific to this car.
 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
We would have said there was no other option. I don't know if I would have congratulated her.

But comparing it to what was here before, that'd be like me congratulating someone who has their 13 month 22 pound child rear facing because 15 years ago there were no options. When we can do better, ideally we take advantage of the resources available. All cars nowadays have seatbelts, whereas most didn't 50 years ago. We don't go into it with the attitude that they're still just kind of ok and optional.

Wendy
 

Baylor

New member
We would have said there was no other option. I don't know if I would have congratulated her.

But comparing it to what was here before, that'd be like me congratulating someone who has their 13 month 22 pound child rear facing because 15 years ago there were no options. When we can do better, ideally we take advantage of the resources available. All cars nowadays have seatbelts, whereas most didn't 50 years ago. We don't go into it with the attitude that they're still just kind of ok and optional.

Wendy

Why not?? Why not congratulate someone who has followed the guidelines and used a booster until it was no longer helping with belt fit. That he has a better belt fit without it? Why not? Should I go by another car to use a booster in? Because in this car he can no longer use a booster and have a proper fit.

IT is not at all the same thing as congratulating someone for rfing a 13 month old. Not at all.

I am flabbergasted.
 

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