Considering Mazda 5 to replace Dodge Grand Caravan

Looking for input and pros/cons on trading in our 2010 Dodge Grand Caravan for a 2013 Mazda 5.

Reason for trading in the current van is that we feel it is unreliable already, and only likely to get worse as it ages. Lots of little things have gone wrong already. Maybe this wouldn't bother other people, but it annoys us...

Other cons for the van: wonky belt geometry for booster riders especially in the third row outboard. Only 3 tether anchors which limits where the FR85 can go.

Pros for the van: Roomy. Good cargo space while still fitting the whole family. Some seating flexibility with the stow and go. Has a built in DVD player and power doors. (We have the SXT model.)

We think we would be fine with the cargo room reduction. We rarely have extra riders along with us and don't do much carpooling with other kids. We already own a Thule rooftop cargo thingy. Plus we are getting to the point of being done with strollers and other bulky baby gear. I want to still have sliding doors and would prefer to avoid all three boys three across. We do this in the Prius sometimes and it is not something I prefer to deal with all the time all three of them need to go somewhere. I wouldn't mind driving a smaller vehicle. I am a little worried about third row passengers being closer to the back of the vehicle though, in the Mazda 5 compared to in the grand caravan where it seems like there is a bit more of a "crumple zone."

We have three boys. Oldest is 7 and full-time boostered, he uses HBBs like the parkway and vivo although is on the highest height on both of these. He also uses a NBB when needed (in our Prius 3-across, in grandma's car, or to ride with a friend.)
Middle son is 5.5 and rides in a Frontier 85 harnessed in the primary vehicle and a HBB otherwise.
Youngest son is 2.5 and RF in a Radian RXT in the primary vehicle (the minivan). (No more children are planned.)

So, I would love thoughts from Mazda 5 owners, especially those who use it as their primary vehicle with 3 kids, especially kids who are older than mine currently are, and are therefore forward facing or booster riders. We probably only have about a year left with a RF kiddo before he flips. Thanks so much in advance!

I have a 2010 Mazda 5 and 3 kids. Are you planning to put your booster rider in the third row? I've only found 2 hbb that work back there...Evenflo Amp and Nautilus in hbb mode. The Parkway does not work.
I have an Amp in my third row and a Frontier 90 and Peg bucket in the captain's chairs.

Hi AEPT -

We were in a similar position evaluating a Mazda 5 to replace a Dodge Grand Caravan ("DGC"). We've got 2 boys (3 and 9 mo) and ended up with a 2011 DGC after test driving, subjectively evaluating, and objectively analyzing data on the mini-van (and for the Mazda5, mini-mini van) market (yes I'm a bit of a car nut).

While we liked the Mazda5, it is small. We found a dealer willing to let us test drive over night and installed 2 car seats in it. We found that we ran out of space packing the Mazda5 as if we were going on a weekend trip. Also, the Mazda5's fuel economy is not much better than a DGC, Honda Odyssey, or Nissan Quest, especially for the size trade off. The Mazda5 also costs roughly the same (when similarly equipped) as a full-size minivan.

As far as fuel economy, it is important to keep in mind a 'regular' minivan gets around 21-23 mpg while a Mazda5 gets 24-25 mpg (according to Fuelly.com that tracks real world MPG, not occasionally misleading EPA numbers). This is about a 10-15% difference in gas costs, or $200-300 a year depending on how much you drive. We did not make our decision on gas savings. It would be different if you were jumping out of an SUV getting 11mpg to make a massive leap to 25 mpg and would cut your fuel bill in half.


The DGC (and its identical twin the Chrysler Town and Country) underwent a significant revision in 2011. They received new interiors, completely new powertrains, and revised suspensions. We ended up with a DGC after testing all the competition. It is completely different than your 2010 DGC, and Consumer Reports recognized a reliability increase in post-2011 vans.

We found all minivans have some reliability issues due to their nature as large, heavy, front drive vehicles. I checked consumer reports and none have outstanding reliability (e.g. Honda Odysseys like to eat their transmissions - http://www.edmunds.com/autoobserver...roubles-inconsistent-response-from-maker.html).

Crash test scores are equal among vans, as are IIHS real-world injury rates. As a result (and keeping in mind that anything would be completely trashed by 2 kids at the end of its service life), we looked for the van that gave us the most features for the least amount of money in a package that would be cheap to fix. The 2011+ DGCs best answered that for us at a price equivalent to a Mazda5.

If you haven't already, it may be worth test-driving an updated DGC or Town and Country in addition to the competition. Bad egg vehicles come from any manufacturer, and the reliability differences between modern cars of any make is almost too small to measure.

That being said, the 5 is a great vehicle if you can handle the permanent reduction in space. A good dealer will let you take one home for the day (these things are not Ferraris) so you can see how it fits YOUR life and YOUR family, which is the most important thing.

amyd said:

I have a 2010 Mazda 5 and 3 kids. Are you planning to put your booster rider in the third row? I've only found 2 hbb that work back there...Evenflo Amp and Nautilus in hbb mode. The Parkway does not work. I have an Amp in my third row and a Frontier 90 and Peg bucket in the captain's chairs.

Click to expand...

Hi Amy,
I would be very likely to be putting a hbb in the third row for a good number of years to come.
I will probably keep my two year old in a second row seat for convenience in loading since he is the one who is riding with me almost 100% of the time. (My 5 and 7 year old take the bus to school and are probably only with me on 1/3 of my errands as a result.)
I don't have a huge preference for whether the 5 or 7 year old get the back row for now, but pretty soon we will have two booster riders and then eventually three booster riders (unless my oldest 5-steps before the youngest is out of a harness.)
So anyways, I am very likely to have to use hbb's and nbb's in the third row.
Is the problem with HBB fit in the third row of the Mazda5 similar to the problem in my DGC where the shoulder belts are coming out of the "side wall" from a spot kinda in front of the rider's shoulder? That is what makes belt for tricky in the DGC third row outboard seats and I'm hoping to have *less* of a problem with that if/when we switch to a different vehicle! I think my oldest might already be too tall for an AMP? I can't remember. We don't have a nautilus. I have a recaro vivo that would probably be my first "try" back there. It's what I'll try at a dealership, probably.

A few specific questions for you:
Do you think an FR85 will fit in the third row? (It's pretty similar to a 90, right?)
Do all the second and third row seating positions have top tether anchors? How about lower anchors? (in thinking about latchable boosters.)
Is the second row fairly carseat-friendly and booster-friendly, at least?

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CarSeat Dad said:

Hi AEPT - We were in a similar position evaluating a Mazda 5 to replace a Dodge Grand Caravan ("DGC"). We've got 2 boys (3 and 9 mo) and ended up with a 2011 DGC after test driving, subjectively evaluating, and objectively analyzing data on the mini-van (and for the Mazda5, mini-mini van) market (yes I'm a bit of a car nut). While we liked the Mazda5, it is small. We found a dealer willing to let us test drive over night and installed 2 car seats in it. We found that we ran out of space packing the Mazda5 as if we were going on a weekend trip. Also, the Mazda5's fuel economy is not much better than a DGC, Honda Odyssey, or Nissan Quest, especially for the size trade off. The Mazda5 also costs roughly the same (when similarly equipped) as a full-size minivan. As far as fuel economy, it is important to keep in mind a 'regular' minivan gets around 21-23 mpg while a Mazda5 gets 24-25 mpg (according to Fuelly.com that tracks real world MPG, not occasionally misleading EPA numbers). This is about a 10-15% difference in gas costs, or $200-300 a year depending on how much you drive. We did not make our decision on gas savings. It would be different if you were jumping out of an SUV getting 11mpg to make a massive leap to 25 mpg and would cut your fuel bill in half. The DGC (and its identical twin the Chrysler Town and Country) underwent a significant revision in 2011. They received new interiors, completely new powertrains, and revised suspensions. We ended up with a DGC after testing all the competition. It is completely different than your 2010 DGC, and Consumer Reports recognized a reliability increase in post-2011 vans. We found all minivans have some reliability issues due to their nature as large, heavy, front drive vehicles. I checked consumer reports and none have outstanding reliability (e.g. Honda Odysseys like to eat their transmissions - http://www.edmunds.com/autoobserver-archive/2010/03/honda-odyssey-owners-report-transmission-troubles-inconsistent-response-from-maker.html). Crash test scores are equal among vans, as are IIHS real-world injury rates. As a result (and keeping in mind that anything would be completely trashed by 2 kids at the end of its service life), we looked for the van that gave us the most features for the least amount of money in a package that would be cheap to fix. The 2011+ DGCs best answered that for us at a price equivalent to a Mazda5. If you haven't already, it may be worth test-driving an updated DGC or Town and Country in addition to the competition. Bad egg vehicles come from any manufacturer, and the reliability differences between modern cars of any make is almost too small to measure. That being said, the 5 is a great vehicle if you can handle the permanent reduction in space. A good dealer will let you take one home for the day (these things are not Ferraris) so you can see how it fits YOUR life and YOUR family, which is the most important thing.

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An amazing response! Thank you car seat dad!
I had no idea how different the 2011's are supposed to be compared to our 2010 DGC.
I forgot about the "overnight test drive". Great idea. We did that with a Prius before we got one. I played "three across" car seats with it for a couple of hours that evening in the comfort of my own driveway/garage. (I say "comfort" sarcastically as it was February in NY state so not the most fun time to rearrange seats.) We wanted to make sure a three-9across was at least possible before we bought one!

I am also trying to convince my husband to look at some regular size minivans as well. I think we can do without the space almost all the time, but If we end up with a smaller vehicle such as the 5, we would miss the space occasionally, I'm sure.

A note on mileage: I do almost all "around town" driving with my DGC and am lucky if I get 17 mpg average on a tank. Let's face it. It's a grocery-getter. (Long highway trips are a bit better at about 21-22 mpg.)

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aept said:

I think we can do without the space almost all the time, but If we end up with a smaller vehicle such as the 5, we would miss the space occasionally, I'm sure.

A note on mileage: I do almost all "around town" driving with my DGC and am lucky if I get 17 mpg average on a tank. Let's face it. It's a grocery-getter. (Long highway trips are a bit better at about 21-22 mpg.)

Click to expand...

Hi AEPT - more than happy to help! When we bought our DGC, we lived about 2 hours away from both sets of grandparents and frequently made trips home, so the need for more room (and a good highway ride) was somewhat acute. We could have done weekend trips with a 5, but any longer trip or add'l luggage would have pushed us to the roof rack or into a rental van for the trip. Now that we've moved, we take grandparents/friends around somewhat often and the bigger 3rd row is good for grandparents and our current situation.

My wife averages about 19-21 in mostly city driving in our 2011. The 2011+ powertrain comes with a 6 speed automatic (2006-2013 Odysseys come with a 5-speed except on the top, top end model) that does better than my brother-in-law's 2009 Town & Country.

Carmax (nationwide, reputable, no-haggle new and used car dealer) has some phenomenal deals on DGCs and Town and Countries - loaded, leather lined ones with 30k miles can be had for <$22k. Carmax offers a great 6-year extended warranty as well. (e.g. http://www.carmax.com/enus/view-car...1-58842fe75cad&Ep=search:results:results page)

I'm slightly biased towards the car we own, so please keep that in mind.

However, you can also tell your husband the DGC has the most powerful engine on the market. Which for me was almost as important as interior room

Also I forgot to add, you're not going to make a bad or "wrong" choice buying any kind of current mini-van or a Mazda5. Some of the pre-2005 vans had rust issues (Ford Freestar) or sub-standard crash scores (early Pontiac Montana), but it doesn't sound like you're looking at those.

All current vans are great vehicles that have a lot of common strengths and the differences lie in the relatively minor subjective details and price. All current vans are very safe, comfortable and reliable, so don't worry too much!

aept said:

Hi Amy, I would be very likely to be putting a hbb in the third row for a good number of years to come. I will probably keep my two year old in a second row seat for convenience in loading since he is the one who is riding with me almost 100% of the time. (My 5 and 7 year old take the bus to school and are probably only with me on 1/3 of my errands as a result.) I don't have a huge preference for whether the 5 or 7 year old get the back row for now, but pretty soon we will have two booster riders and then eventually three booster riders (unless my oldest 5-steps before the youngest is out of a harness.) So anyways, I am very likely to have to use hbb's and nbb's in the third row. Is the problem with HBB fit in the third row of the Mazda5 similar to the problem in my DGC where the shoulder belts are coming out of the "side wall" from a spot kinda in front of the rider's shoulder? That is what makes belt for tricky in the DGC third row outboard seats and I'm hoping to have *less* of a problem with that if/when we switch to a different vehicle! I think my oldest might already be too tall for an AMP? I can't remember. We don't have a nautilus. I have a recaro vivo that would probably be my first "try" back there. It's what I'll try at a dealership, probably. A few specific questions for you: Do you think an FR85 will fit in the third row? (It's pretty similar to a 90, right?) Do all the second and third row seating positions have top tether anchors? How about lower anchors? (in thinking about latchable boosters.) Is the second row fairly carseat-friendly and booster-friendly, at least? Sent from my iPhone using Car-Seat.Org

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The issue with the boosters is that because of where the shoulder belt is anchored, the belt doesn't retract which in the belt guide. So if the rider leans ahead and then sits back, they now have slack in their belt. The way the belt guide is positioned on the boosters that work do allow the belt to retract.

Yes, a FR85 will fit in the third row. All rear seating positions have tether anchors. The captain's chairs have LATCH. The second row is extremely car seat and booster friendly.

We are going to go look at a new 2013 Mazda5 tomorrow night. I haven't been inside one in years, so I'm looking forward to seeing how it looks and feels inside.
We were initially thinking we would be most interested in a '12-'13 used but this new '13 is close to home to check out. Plus if they can get us a great deal since the '14s are out maybe it's worth looking at anyways!

Any questions I should ask or other things to look out for? I for sure will be having my 7-year-old sit in the third row in one or more of our HBB or NBB boosters.

How about a RF RXT in the second row? Already known to be ok? I think I have read on here that the frontier is fine in either row.

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I'm not sure if this was mentioned but I have a 2012 Mazda and I have 4 top tether anchors, one on every seat in the rear.

aept said:

We are going to go look at a new 2013 Mazda5 tomorrow night. I haven't been inside one in years, so I'm looking forward to seeing how it looks and feels inside. We were initially thinking we would be most interested in a '12-'13 used but this new '13 is close to home to check out. Plus if they can get us a great deal since the '14s are out maybe it's worth looking at anyways! Any questions I should ask or other things to look out for? I for sure will be having my 7-year-old sit in the third row in one or more of our HBB or NBB boosters. How about a RF RXT in the second row? Already known to be ok? I think I have read on here that the frontier is fine in either row. Sent from my iPhone using Car-Seat.Org

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I have a 2012 mazda5, which should be the same body style. I have a radian 65, sunshine kids, and use it rearfacing in the 3rd row with the ane adjuster and I love it. Super easy to load through the hatch and super easy install.

Dillipop said:

I have a 2012 mazda5, which should be the same body style. I have a radian 65, sunshine kids, and use it rearfacing in the 3rd row with the ane adjuster and I love it. Super easy to load through the hatch and super easy install.

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Thanks! We have SK Radian 65 seats as well but DS3 is about to outgrow them by weight RF. Those will (not yet, but when they HAVE to) end up FF for him in my DH's car and my MIL's car. I have one RXT which is his seat in my car where he rides a vast majority of the time. I plan to keep him RF for a while yet in my car (and the Mazda5, if we get one, would be "mine".)

Speaking of which, the Radian FF (seatbelt install) can be a tricky install sometimes. Have you ever put your Radian in FF in the second and/or third rows?

I am pretty sure I have an angle adjuster in the trunk of my van. I have one for each of our three radians but am not currently using it for the RXT in the minivan. There is enough room in there that we don't need it and he seems less crunched leg-room wise with the RXT a bit more reclined. (It's still more upright than a newborn angle due the significantly sloped seats in the van.) Anyhow it sounds like I will want the AA if I decide to play with the radian in the Mazda.
I'm not too worried about it now though. It sounds like the capt chairs are very versatile for any of the kids/seats, and that I most likely just need to worry about boosters in the third row.

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Well we saw it and I drove it, too. I liked the way it drove, parked, etc.
If we had two kids I think I would be in love. The capt. chairs in the second row seemed quote good (although I didn't love their forward headrests, but those are in so many new cars now!)
But, I am not sure about the third row and seatbelts and boosters, or about how it would really be to have the dramatic reduction in cargo space / space for big kids and grownups in the back.
I definitely feel like it *could* work, but that there were still a lot of compromises compared to the can we have now.
I think we are just going to keep our DGC.

Regarding the boosters:
From my quick look, I did not care for how my seven-year-old fit in the third row in a backless turbo. The shoulder belt was over an inch out in front of his shoulder/upper torso and not touching him until somewhere mid belly.
My five year old looked ok in the vivo back there. I turned the third row headrest around backwards to still have it behind the vivo but allow the back of the vivo to lie flat against the vehicle seat back.
I think it was retracting ok but he only leaned forward twice for me to check. The belt seemed a little twisted in the belt guide when I went to take it out, though, so it would need a longer test run, I think.

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I've seen that you must have the second row seat pushed all the way back when a carseat is installed on them? How does that work for leg room in the 3rd row? We would have a RF Radian installed. Do you follow the seat all the way back rule?

SPJ&E said:

I've seen that you must have the second row seat pushed all the way back when a carseat is installed on them? How does that work for leg room in the 3rd row? We would have a RF Radian installed. Do you follow the seat all the way back rule?

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Well, all I did is try a couple of booster seats out in it briefly.
I'm not sure what I would actually do if I owned one.
But with the second row seats all the way back I climbed into the third row myself. I am 5'6" and my knees were very tightly pushed into the seat back in front of me.
Seems like it would be awesome if you had two kids all the time and just sometimes needed to fit more.

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SPJ&E said:

I've seen that you must have the second row seat pushed all the way back when a carseat is installed on them? How does that work for leg room in the 3rd row? We would have a RF Radian installed. Do you follow the seat all the way back rule?

Click to expand...

I put the fringe radian in the 3rd row and put the boostersi in the second row. Since they aren't installed child seats, they get moved up as needed to allow the radian to fit.

SPJ&E said:

I've seen that you must have the second row seat pushed all the way back when a carseat is installed on them? How does that work for leg room in the 3rd row? We would have a RF Radian installed. Do you follow the seat all the way back rule?

Click to expand...

When contacted Mazda has clarified that this is to ensure an install isn't accidentally loosened by a seat being moved. They have said that it's find to have the seat up with LATCH install or even seatbelt as long as you don't move the seat after the restraint is installed. I have one seat in with the seatbelt and don't put anyone behind that seat. My other captain's chair has a LATCH install and that one I move up to allow my booster rider in the third row some leg room.