Ugh Consumer Report

Melizerd

New member
There's a "new" consumer report out. At least it says that all the infant seats they tested perform adequately whether the seatbelt or LATCH was used.

The did also mention that you should rearface to the limits of the seats and have your seat checked, to start with the center position for installation (they didn't mention that you can't usually do LATCH there though :rolleyes: ) Since they

They like the KeyFit for ease of use, followed by the Flex lock and the Snugride.

I'll see if I can find the print ad. I just wish CR would stop with the car seat info though they never get it quite right.
 
ADS

Melizerd

New member
LOL How did I miss that?! And how come I didn't see it on the news til today? That was posted last week already. Apparently my news is slow.
 

safeinthecar

Moderator - CPS Technician
I don't think it was a bad article at all. The chest clip is low in one picture, but otherwise I don't see that they did anything worth taking up arms against them.

Kimberly
 

brightredmtn

Well-known member
Huh? What aspects of the seat did they test? I just logged into my CR account and ease of use and fit to vehicle were the only two...

So I know the tests that were recalled were at speeds that were much too high for the crashes but the Snugride still passed. Does anyone think that still counts for something? I know I'm scare of a crash at a speed higher than 30 MPH.
 

Melizerd

New member
the current one that I just saw today tested them at the appropriate speed, installation, ease of use.

The previous one where lots of seats failed was retracted.
 

brightredmtn

Well-known member
the current one that I just saw today tested them at the appropriate speed, installation, ease of use.

Seems like there should have been more to test. Weight of seat, how comfortable is the handle, padding for newborns, weight limits, harness height, a front harness adjuster among others...

The previous one where lots of seats failed was retracted.

I know it was retracted but the Snugride still passed. Does that count for anything in favor of the SR?
 

Melizerd

New member
CR never tests the things we think are imporant.

I know that most people prefer the SS1 because it has a higher weight limit and a higher shell.
 

skaterbabs

Well-known member
A 35 mph test on a crash sled is the real-life equivalent of a 70+ mph crash. 97% of all crashes are at LESS THAN 30 mph (real-life speed.) A 70 mph crash is unsurvivable no matter what.
 

azgirl71

CPST Instructor
A 35 mph test on a crash sled is the real-life equivalent of a 70+ mph crash. 97% of all crashes are at LESS THAN 30 mph (real-life speed.) A 70 mph crash is unsurvivable no matter what.

I have seen some pretty bad accidents on I-10 where people were going any where from 70-85 mph and they survivesd, so I would not say a 70 mph crash is unsurvivable no matter what. ;)
 

Melizerd

New member
I have seen some pretty bad accidents on I-10 where people were going any where from 70-85 mph and they survivesd, so I would not say a 70 mph crash is unsurvivable no matter what. ;)

according to crash tests they technically are unsurvivable and anyone who does walk away is lucky. But test wise they're not.
 

skaterbabs

Well-known member
They weren't at 70 WHEN THEY STOPPED. The g forces involved in going from 70 mph to 0 mph in just a few seconds is enough that the third phase of the crash is enough to cause (at the very least) severe brain damage.
 

Defrost

Moderator - CPSTI Emeritus
They weren't at 70 WHEN THEY STOPPED. The g forces involved in going from 70 mph to 0 mph in just a few seconds is enough that the third phase of the crash is enough to cause (at the very least) severe brain damage.

Also, just because the car is doing 70mph when the events leading to the crash start doesn't mean it's a 70mph crash. Braking, turning, etc slow the vehicles down - it's pretty uncommon for someone to crash without slowing down first.

We had a wreck here just a few months ago where a girl hit a parked semi while doing 75+mph. There was already a wreck at that location, so there were police as witnesses. She never hit the brakes, and was killed instantly. It was a completely unsurvivable wreck; anyone else in the vehicle with her would have died as well. :(
 

azgirl71

CPST Instructor
They're also very, very, very rare. Like 1/2 of 1% rare.

I agree that it is rare. ;) Just wanted to let you know I have seen it happen. A few years ago we were sitting in stopped traffic on I-10 when a PT Cruiser came out of nowhere and plowed into the rear of a mini van next to us. The driver was fine other than airbag rash. She said she was going 80 mph and was messing with the radio or something and did not realize traffic was stopped. The people in the mini van had minor injuries as did the car in front of them. I think it went 4 cars up.
 

Defrost

Moderator - CPSTI Emeritus
I agree that it is rare. ;) Just wanted to let you know I have seen it happen. A few years ago we were sitting in stopped traffic on I-10 when a PT Cruiser came out of nowhere and plowed into the rear of a mini van next to us. The driver was fine other than airbag rash. She said she was going 80 mph and was messing with the radio or something and did not realize traffic was stopped. The people in the mini van had minor injuries as did the car in front of them. I think it went 4 cars up.

This is hard to describe... That example is still not the same as the CR test - hitting a stopped passenger vehicle does not exert anywhere near the same forces as what they were testing. In the example I gave, the girl hit a semi. A semi is so heavy that it didn't move forward very much (if at all) when she hit it - it was like running into a brick wall. Her seat belt, airbags, and the safety features of her vehicle which caused it to crumple and absorb impact were not enough to absorb that amount of force. From what I understand, the fact that one infant seat survived those crash-tests intact was pointless because the child inside the seat wouuld have died anyway from the forces exerted on his body during that kind of wreck.

In the example you gave, the vehicle may have been doing 80 when she hit the vehicle in front of her, but it moved forward when she hit it, absorbing much of the impact forces. That vehicle did not just stop dead - it stopped more slowly. It may have been a matter of seconds difference in stopping time, but that is a very large difference when it comes to the forces exerted on the people inside the vehicle.

Does that make sense?
 

azgirl71

CPST Instructor
This is hard to describe... That example is still not the same as the CR test - hitting a stopped passenger vehicle does not exert anywhere near the same forces as what they were testing. In the example I gave, the girl hit a semi. A semi is so heavy that it didn't move forward very much (if at all) when she hit it - it was like running into a brick wall. Her seat belt, airbags, and the safety features of her vehicle which caused it to crumple and absorb impact were not enough to absorb that amount of force. From what I understand, the fact that one infant seat survived those crash-tests intact was pointless because the child inside the seat wouuld have died anyway from the forces exerted on his body during that kind of wreck.

In the example you gave, the vehicle may have been doing 80 when she hit the vehicle in front of her, but it moved forward when she hit it, absorbing much of the impact forces. That vehicle did not just stop dead - it stopped more slowly. It may have been a matter of seconds difference in stopping time, but that is a very large difference when it comes to the forces exerted on the people inside the vehicle.

Does that make sense?

Makes perfect sence. Thanks ;)
 

arly1983

New member
They like the KeyFit for ease of use, followed by the Flex lock and the Snugride.

See, for ease of installation, I would have put the Safeseat over the Snugride.

The adjustable base on the snugride pops back up if force is placed on it and so it needs pool noodles to adjust recline. Also, there is no built in lock-off.

The safeseat base has a very nice adjustable foot that is controlled with a knob on top of the base and also has a built in lock-off.

It could be that the snugride preformed significantly better than the safeseat in crash tests but who knows...
 

safeinthecar

Moderator - CPS Technician
Huh? What aspects of the seat did they test? I just logged into my CR account and ease of use and fit to vehicle were the only two...

So I know the tests that were recalled were at speeds that were much too high for the crashes but the Snugride still passed. Does anyone think that still counts for something? I know I'm scare of a crash at a speed higher than 30 MPH.

The thing about the current 30mph test is it is actually a simulation of a very severe crash.There is much more to the crash test than just the speed. The pulse of the crash has a lot to do with it. The current 30mph fixed barrier crash , at the current pulse rate is roughly equivilent to crashing into a car of similar weight at 70 mph. The problem with upping the speed of the crash tests, is if you don't adjust the pulse accordingly, you get a crash that doesn't represent the actual physics of how a real car performs. Sure, some seats may still pass, but you learn nothing about how the seat would perform in a real crash. Or even in a crash that is physically possible.
 

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