Graco Nautilus or My Ride 65?

DH's car was in an accident today, so we need to replace the carseats.

DS1 is harnessed in a Graco Nautilus (nearly 8 years old, 48 inches tall, about 50 pounds). I have been happy with it and am planning on getting him another one.

DS2 was in a Graco My Ride 65. (4.75 years old, 40 inches tall, 34 pounds). I turned him forward facing a week ago to accommodate fitting a very large family member in the front seat. His shoulder height was still below the top slot, but as small as he is, we thought he could probably ride rearfacing until he was 6 or 7 by weight, and decided perhaps it was time to turn him forward facing.

Since we will not be using the My Ride 65 rearfacing anymore, is there any advantage to purchasing another one? I was thinking of buying DS2 a Graco Nautilus, since that would last us until DS2 no longer required a carseat (at least I hope he wouldn't need one at 12 - who knows).

I would appreciate any input on this!

If you liked the Nautilus before, one for DS2 seems practical. My DD rear faced in the MR to about the exact same time but she was just under 40# so I needed to flip her.

As for DS1, is there a particular reason you're keeping him harnessed? If there are no special needs, I'd get him a high back booster.

TechnoGranola said:

As for DS1, is there a particular reason you're keeping him harnessed? If there are no special needs, I'd get him a high back booster.

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I thought a 5 point harness was safer than a booster - is that incorrect?

J in the Lou said:

I thought a 5 point harness was safer than a booster - is that incorrect?

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At his age, he is completely fine in a high back booster and has potential to be safer (due to neck loads with older/heavier kids in harnessed seats). I am on my way out the door so I will leave it to other to provide you with more info, but barring special needs, I don't think there are many folks here who would spend the money on a new harnessed seat for an 8 year old. And we are some of the most cautious folks you will meet!

Hi - I saw this and remembered that I just wrote out an answer to this recently so here it is copied from another thread

Just want to address the "harness as long as possible." That phrase is somewhat outdated now that there are many seats that will allow ~larger~ kids to remain harnessed through ages 5-7. Average-to-smaller kids could harness a lot longer, but there is no statistical data to say they are safer, and some that hints they they may not be. Back when seats were shorter and the harness limit was 40lbs, "harness as long as possible" was a mantra to keep 2 and 3 year olds in harnessed seats.

There are no studies that say children past the age of four or five (?) are any safer in a harness. There are small studies that suggest that neck loading may be too much in a crash when older kids are in a harness. In Sweden, where they rear- face until four, they go into a booster after and don't harness forward facing.

About six years ago or so, there was a movement to harness as long as possible where people were harnessing 8-10 year olds in Regents. Techs and advocates have backed way off of that now and you will find very little support in the child passenger safety community for it now.

So with what we know, best practice is to harness to age 5-7 depending on the size of the child and maturity

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The nauti only harnesses to 65lb as far as I know. So he would only have 15lbs to grow.

I would definitely get the nautilus over the MR65 at this point. We have both and the MR is very reclined FF (which is typically a bad thing unless you're driving on an overnighter, then it's a good thing!). Plus, the nautilus will convert to a booster when the time is right, so you'll get more use out of it. Off the top of my head, I'm pretty sure the top harness slots are taller on the nautilus as well.

I'll let one of the techs chime in on the booster, but we don't have any evidence at this time that a harness is better than a booster at that age and size, provided the child is mature enough to sit still all the time. If he's ready, we could recommend nice, comfy boosters!

kam1011 said:

If he's ready, we could recommend nice, comfy boosters!

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I'm still reading about neck loads (brand new info for me) but I'd love your recommendations for boosters!

I wasn't able to find any studies on the neck load issues. The only thing that came up when Googling it were comments on other threads on this site. Everything "official" we were able to find indicated they should be harnessed as long as possible.

We needed to pull the trigger on this, as the kids could only ride in my car until we bought more seats. We went with 2 Graco Nautilus seats.

However, since these can be used as a HBB or a backless booster, I could switch to using the seat belt. I would be still be interested in reading any studies about the neck load issues. If you have a link and could direct me, I would appreciate the information.

J in the Lou said:

I wasn't able to find any studies on the neck load issues. The only thing that came up when Googling it were comments on other threads on this site. Everything "official" we were able to find indicated they should be harnessed as long as possible.

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This isn't a new phenomenon. Increased loads and head excursion are a fact when the body is held back and the head is left to move forward. It's why race car drivers have the HANS device now which holds their head back. Several driver's died of basilar skull fracture (fracture of the base of the skull) due to this before the devices was commonly used (Dale Ernhardt and Adam Petty to name two). Yes, they drive a heck of a lot faster and wear a helmet which adds weight to their head, but it gives you an idea of the problem.

There is a point at which a harness can become less beneficial. They've researched it in Sweden and it's why their kids go from RF to boosters and they skip harnesses all together. Maybe AdventureDad will pipe in with some information. There is also a Transport Canada study that shows harnessing IS likely beneficial (not definitive) in the age 4-6 category I think it is. Now, it maybe be that study didn't go past age 6 which is why they don't have data for older kids. I got a new computer and "filed" my links somewhere so I can't find it quickly...but I've referenced the study here before and maybe someone else has the link.

You do have a small 8 year old, so I'd bet your good either way. But your child wouldn't be unsafe in a high back booster. The main issue with the Nautilus is that your child is likely close to outgrowing it harnessed (if not already, I swear that my newly 7 year old the same size as your 8 year old has outgrown it harnessed). Also, it may or may not work for you as a booster as it doesn't work well as a booster for all kids in all vehicles. It happens to work really great as a booster for us in the vehicle we use it in so I hope the same for you!

TechnoGranola said:

There is a point at which a harness can become less beneficial. They've researched it in Sweden and it's why their kids go from RF to boosters and they skip harnesses all together. Maybe AdventureDad will pipe in with some information. There is also a Transport Canada study that shows harnessing IS likely beneficial (not definitive) in the age 4-6 category I think it is. Now, it maybe be that study didn't go past age 6 which is why they don't have data for older kids. I got a new computer and "filed" my links somewhere so I can't find it quickly...but I've referenced the study here before and maybe someone else has the link.

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Thanks, I'll keep looking for the link and now that you have given me additional direction, I bet I can find those studies. I found a YouTube crash test video that was really frightening - had a harnessed kid next to a booster, and the booster kid was slung all around.

TechnoGranola said:

The main issue with the Nautilus is that your child is likely close to outgrowing it harnessed (if not already, I swear that my newly 7 year old the same size as your 8 year old has outgrown it harnessed).

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His shoulders are right below the 2nd from the top harness slot. I think if he really tried to stretch/sit up straighter he would be at the 2nd slot. I am going to use the top slot, but he has at least an inch of torso growing to do before he hits that top slot. I guess he carries his length more in his legs and has a shorter torso - :shrug-shoulders: He will definitely outgrow it by height before weight. I looked at some other seats, but the top harness slot all seemed about the same. Given that a booster seat is a safe option for a kid his size, I guess most people aren't looking to harness any longer than that. Most of my friends put their kids in the backless boosters the instant they turned 4 - I am guessing there is very little market for a 5 point harness for a kid much bigger than mine.

TechnoGranola said:

Also, it may or may not work for you as a booster as it doesn't work well as a booster for all kids in all vehicles. It happens to work really great as a booster for us in the vehicle we use it in so I hope the same for you!

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You know, I never thought about the Nautilus not working well as a booster. I will have to try it out and make sure it installs well. When it doesn't work well, is that because the seatbelt won't stay in the correct position? The kids can't buckle it themselves? What are some of the failure modes I should be looking for?

I really appreciate the direction you have given. It is hard to weed through all the conflicting information about what is "best" for your kids. Nice to have some guidance!

J in the Lou said:

Thanks, I'll keep looking for the link and now that you have given me additional direction, I bet I can find those studies. I found a YouTube crash test video that was really frightening - had a harnessed kid next to a booster, and the booster kid was slung all around.

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I'm going to dig around to see if I can find the TC study and post it for you. As for the crash tests, be aware, they don't always say WHAT is being tested or what the parameters are. So they might be testing some obscure case where they are going a billion miles an hour or something outrageous like that. Additionally, what you see isn't what you get...meaning that something that looks horrendous, isn't always. Sometimes the extra movement is beneficial to the body. Gives it time to ride down the crash and reduce internal organs slamming into ribs, snapping of the neck, etc.

So unless you know all the details including what they are testing, what the test result numbers are, how those numbers affect real world injury, etc. it's really hard to gauge what those crash tests mean.

J in the Lou said:

His shoulders are right below the 2nd from the top harness slot. I think if he really tried to stretch/sit up straighter he would be at the 2nd slot. I am going to use the top slot, but he has at least an inch of torso growing to do before he hits that top slot. I guess he carries his length more in his legs and has a shorter torso - :shrug-shoulders: He will definitely outgrow it by height before weight. I looked at some other seats, but the top harness slot all seemed about the same. Given that a booster seat is a safe option for a kid his size, I guess most people aren't looking to harness any longer than that. Most of my friends put their kids in the backless boosters the instant they turned 4 - I am guessing there is very little market for a 5 point harness for a kid much bigger than mine.

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Where are you located? The Frontier has a higher harness height than the Nautilus. There are likely other options in the USA (I'm in Canada and don't have any FF harnessed kids right now so haven't kept track of what's available there).

J in the Lou said:

You know, I never thought about the Nautilus not working well as a booster. I will have to try it out and make sure it installs well. When it doesn't work well, is that because the seatbelt won't stay in the correct position? The kids can't buckle it themselves? What are some of the failure modes I should be looking for?

I really appreciate the direction you have given. It is hard to weed through all the conflicting information about what is "best" for your kids. Nice to have some guidance!

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Someone else is going to have to chime in here, because like I said, for us, the Nautilus is actually a super awesome fit for my kid in the vehicle we have it in. But I see lots of folks that are adamant that it is a horrible, horrible booster that will work for no child (not on this board! LOL We typically base comments on situation and don't try and make catch all statements. )

But usually lap belt fit from what I've read. People seem to think it sits too high, on the abdomen. Like I said though, not in our particular case; it sits really low, on the thighs on my kid in the vehicle it's in. Some people also have issues with it pushing the head forward so kids falling out of the belt if napping on trips (I think anyway, please someone chime in on this! ).

Problem is, you won't really know how it works as a booster for you until you're actually using it as a booster. If you're not going to use it for a year or so, your kid will have changed shape and size. So just deal with it when that time comes. Worst case, you sell it and buy something else.