Misrouted belt in ADAC crash test?

AK Dad

New member
So, my Deutsch is nicht sehr gut - anyone speak it well enough to see what they're doing in this video:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OlNWJHTwr0"]Kindersitze im Test - YouTube[/ame]

Looks like an Aton 2, but it looks to me like they're misrouting the belt when the do the baseless install, right? Are the demo-ing that on purpose to show how bad an easy misuse could end up? Trying to show the advantage of the ISOfix base?
 
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safeinthecar

Moderator - CPS Technician
They are definitely misrouting the belts. Why, IDK, but it doesn't make any sense that the seat could have any reasonable chance of working with the lap belt behind the shell like that.
 

AK Dad

New member
Yeah, I'm guessing they're doing it intentionally to show potential mistake a parent could easily make?
 

LISmama810

Admin - CPS Technician
I'm not sure how "easily" that could be done--that's pretty creative. I, too, wonder WTF they were doing there.
 

ketchupqueen

CPST and ketchup snob
Staff member
They are notorious for mis-installing rear-facing seats. Then they give them bad scores. They don't bother to read the instructions I guess, and are prejudiced against RF seats.
 

ketchupqueen

CPST and ketchup snob
Staff member
From the videos I've watched of them doing rear-facing seats that I'm familiar with? Yeah, I'm sure they're bad at putting in rear-facing seats, as in, I can look at the installation and see multiple problems.

The prejudice against RF seats is not technically confirmed, but the way they write them up comes across pretty bad for people who didn't bother to install them correctly to me.
 

ketchupqueen

CPST and ketchup snob
Staff member
They're kind of like Consmer Reports- they have their own weighted criteria, and some of them are just weird. Like, "high probability of misuse", most rear-facing seats get that- even ones I've done and found pretty simple to install- because they seem against reading instructions?

They rate harnessed seats "hard to harness child" all the time (because they're not shield boosters); they rate seats with large headwings "difficult for child to see out." Etc.
 

AK Dad

New member
The prejudice against RF seats is not technically confirmed, but the way they write them up comes across pretty bad for people who didn't bother to install them correctly to me.

My understanding is that the Germans are worse than us by a long shot on keeping kids RF'd, which is surprising based on their engineering prowess ...

They rate harnessed seats "hard to harness child" all the time (because they're not shield boosters); they rate seats with large headwings "difficult for child to see out." Etc.

I did see recently that those shield boosters are starting to get some (deserved) bad press over there - can't remember where I saw the video, but they were showing the dummies flying out of the seats in pretty benign roll-overs. They were advertising "5-point harness" like it was a new invention! :p
 

LISmama810

Admin - CPS Technician
I guess maybe it would be a more common mistake in countries that are used to around-the-back routing...
 

mom of six

Active member
Yeah, I'm guessing they're doing it intentionally to show potential mistake a parent could easily make?

My husband translated it for me and I wrote it down. I will try and make a transcript, kid permitting, later tonight.

ADAC is Germany's national insurance carrier.

The jist...Yes, they are *intentionally* installing car seats incorrectly to show what happens during common misuse. Apparently, when using Eurpopean routing it is a common misuse to switch the lap belt and shoulder belt. They are are also showing how much easier isofix is and that it decreases the probability of misuse.

During the crash tests they are giving their ratings...Gut=good, mangelhaft= deficient

A big reason for a deficient rating is side impact. Towards the end of the video he makes the recommendation that all car seats have "side bolsters" even for the older children.

There was no reference made to the speed at which these tests were being done.



I am kind of surprised at the conclusions that have been drawn based on seeing the video without understanding the audio.:(
 

InternationalMama

New member
:yeahthat:

The first part of the video discusses a common error in the routing of the shoulder belt in real life European infant carrier installs, saying that it doesn't matter how well seats perform in tests if they aren't installed correctly by parents and then perform poorly in actual crashes. Then they discuss how in their opinion the isofix (European LATCH) is much easier to install and results in fewer errors in installation and thus better real life crash performance. The last part of the video goes through the ratings for some common seats and ends by discussing the lack of side impact protection provided by LBBs and how even older kids should have the benefit of seats with side impact protection.

ETA: I don't think the ADAC doesn't bother to read instructions. They do take into consideration how a seat might be incorrectly installed by parents who, as we know, may or may not read/understand the instructions. They weight ease of use heavily in their ratings, which can make it look as if they are biased against ERF seats.
 

InternationalMama

New member
One thing that really hit home for me that he said was that the (rigid) isofix used for European infant seats prevents them from being incorrectly installed forward-facing. I've seen firsthand that this benefit is lost with the flexible latch used for most US infant seats, which can be misrouted to create a forward-facing installation.
 

katymyers

Active member
One thing that really hit home for me that he said was that the (rigid) isofix used for European infant seats prevents them from being incorrectly installed forward-facing. I've seen firsthand that this benefit is lost with the flexible latch used for most US infant seats, which can be misrouted to create a forward-facing installation.

:yeahthat: I've actually seen this type of misuse on a seat before. It was a NICU parent I walked to their car and they had tried to do a baseless install on a Graco Snugride 22 this way. Dad's exact words were "I just couldn't understand what the hooks on the back of the seat were for and not using the whole seat belt just didn't make any sense".
 

katymyers

Active member
Oh, and I've seen LOADS of infant seats installed forward facing. And a couple bases installed upside down lol.
 

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