Field trip protocol and BCAA info (Canada)

I started a thread several months ago about field trip protocol after seeing screw-less TBs and a coverless booster. http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=232603

More recently I took a document that Quassee created and put up on FB which was a letter to parents regarding their responsibility to provide a proper seat for their child to ride in another parent's vehicle for field trips. I modified the letter and submitted to my principal. She asked the Vancouver School Board and they said she could not issue such a letter. The parent driver forms have a section stating the law (under 40 lbs must be harnessed, over 40lb in boosters until age 9 or 4'9) that must be followed by the driver. She also was told that the VSB defers to BCAA for their carseat guidelines, and could offer the web links to parents or straight copying from the site, but we could not modify any of their content or interpret, etc. She did say, however, that the modified Quassee document could be sent out from the PAC, but just not from the principal.

I said I would see about creating a one pager created from copying content from the BCAA page, but have just come across the below paragraph, which concerns me for a few reasons: 1-this paragraph makes it sound like a 40+lb child can't use a 5pt harness 2-it condones children in the front seat 3- it condones children in lap belts!

Thoughts?

Children over 18 kg (40 lb) and under 145 cm (4’9″)
If your child is over 18 kg (40 lb) and under 145 cm (4’9”) they must use a booster seat when traveling in a car, van or truck, it’s the law. Booster seats must be used with a lap/shoulder seat belt, even if that means the child must sit in the front passenger seat. Children take priority over adults in using a lap/shoulder seat belt. If your child needs to sit in the front passenger seat, move the vehicle seat as far back as it will go so the child is more than 30 cm (12″) away from the dash.
If your vehicle only has lap belts available, the booster seat cannot be used. In this case your child must be secured in the lap only seat belt without a booster seat. Using a booster seat with a lap belt is more dangerous than the lap belt alone.

No help here, just a general, "ugh, VSB!" sentiment. I'm even meeting with Patti Bacchus tomorrow about an issue with my son's school.

:banginghead:

BC is a proper use province; I don't know that any boosters allow their use in front of an air bag. No air bag and I would put a boostered child in the front seat versus in the back with a lap belt only.

It's true about the lap belt only without a booster. Sucky, but true.

I wonder if you feel energetic enough to pursue, either through your PAC, principal, or straight to the VSB, why they only require the bare minimum for your kids -- and not really properly represented either -- instead of a broader approach that encompasses the law AND allows room for best practice (which is also written into the law, but BCTSF chooses not to promote).

For example re the over 40lbs must be in a booster - not true:

(2) A child who has attained age one and weighs 18 kg or more may continue to be fastened in a restraint system referred to in subsection (1) until, according to the manufacturer's specifications, the restraint system is no longer appropriate for the child's height and weight.

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Parents must PROPERLY USE the restraint (the proper use part of the law), and also if they are wearing the seat belt they must wear it PROPERLY (bolding mine):

(2) A child referred to in subsection (1) must be securely fastened as follows:

(a) in a restraint system or booster seat referred to in subsection (1) (a) (i), (ii) (A) or (iii) (A) or (b) in accordance with the device manufacturer's instructions for that restraint system or booster seat;

(b) in a restraint system referred to in subsection (1) (a) (ii) (B) or (iii) (B) in accordance with the vehicle manufacturer's instructions;

(c) in a seat belt assembly, in accordance with the vehicle manufacturer's instructions,

(i) with the pelvic restraint placed firmly across the hips of the child, and

(ii) with the upper torso restraint, if there is one, placed over the shoulder and across the chest of the child and closely against the child's body.

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Ugh. This is just gross.

Not sure if it's our school, or a RSB thing, but children are not allowed in the front seat. Personally, I'd remove that part, allowed or not b/c you don't want to suggest they do it, if something happens, some crazy person might try to sue you b/c you suggested it!

While it's true, and my dh would sit in the lap only belt in my Vanagon before I'd let my kids (less protected), I wouldn't put it in writing for someone else either.

I hate field trips, just got PAC to buy new boosters after months of trying...

tam

Thanks all. I was wondering why I didn't get replies then realized I forgot to subscribe!

On the VSB form/contract that the parent drivers fill out, in addition to 'under 40lbs in car seat, over 40 in booster until 4'9 or 9yrs', it says something along the lines of 'I will not put children under 13yr in the front seat'.

You're right about proper use, Jen, but it complicates it to say to each parent 'read your manual to ensure you're using the seat properly', and we can't expect each parent driver to read the manuals belonging to the seats of the children they will be driving. It's easier to have a few hard and fast rules, plus some strongly recommended guidelines.

The part they have in the parent driver contract (the bare minimums) could just be forwarded to non-driving parents, the ones who will be providing seats for their own children to use in someone else's car, which might be a step better than the one line at the bottom of field trip forms "parents are responsible for providing a proper car seat or booster seat for their child' or something like that.

I wanted to add stuff about seats not being expired, screws in TBs, headrests for NBB, top tethers for forward facing seats, though. The BCAA site at least recommends rear facing to the limit of your convertible seat, but the part I attached in my OP about lap belt and front seat

What about a line somewhere too for the parent drivers about "I acknowledge that BC law puts the legal obligation on the driver to ensure each child passenger is in an appropriate seat, harnessed correctly, and installed correctly."

Would that at least make those drivers pay attention to the bare minimums?

Yes, good point Jen. I think that is already in the contract for parent drivers, but it doesn't make it easier for them to ensure another kid's parent provides a proper booster. . . some of the parents don't know each other, and if they are presented with an inproper booster by another kid, most wouldn't notice. The non driving parents are just told they need to provide a booster for their own kid, but I feel they need more guidance on what they are to provide, but I'm now very hesitant to have the school refer anyone to the BCAA site.

It sounds like a very lousy situation all around. My kids aren't old enough yet to deal with this.

Pixelated said:

BC is a proper use province; I don't know that any boosters allow their use in front of an air bag.

.

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The PW and Monterey both allow use in the front seat if the air bag is deactivated/off.

I must be missing what the big deal is. If you want to make sure *your* kid is transported to your liking, you need to drive. If you drive your kid, provide your own boosters for any children you are also driving.

I've driven on lots of field trips. I provide boosters and it works well. When my kids ride with others, I provide an easy to use LBB (lite rider) that my kids know how to use properly.

I would NOT make this a hill I would die on. You will not win against the District on an issue like this. Period.

bubbaray said:

The PW and Monterey both allow use in the front seat if the air bag is deactivated/off.

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Right. The Parkway specifically says deactivated (don't have a Monterey to check). An air bag with a sensor is not deactivated officially - is it?

Pixelated said:

Right. The Parkway specifically says deactivated (don't have a Monterey to check). An air bag with a sensor is not deactivated officially - is it?

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I personally am a-OK with using a booster in front of a sensor-off airbag. And you're welcome to "check" me on the Monterey.

bubbaray said:

I must be missing what the big deal is. If you want to make sure *your* kid is transported to your liking, you need to drive. If you drive your kid, provide your own boosters for any children you are also driving.

I've driven on lots of field trips. I provide boosters and it works well. When my kids ride with others, I provide an easy to use LBB (lite rider) that my kids know how to use properly.

I would NOT make this a hill I would die on. You will not win against the District on an issue like this. Period.

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:yeahthatsad: unfortunately that is reality. My school has been pretty good about working with me but you have to realize there is a very fine line between getting kids back and forth safely and pushing best practice to the point that it becomes more than teachers, parents and administration are willing to deal with.

I do exactly what Melissa described above. Drive when I can, send easy to use safe seats when I can't, and provide extra boosters if needed. Our school now has a no harnessed seats unless you're driving your own kid policy, and we do not allow kids to go in the front seat that I am aware of (my oldest is in grade 5 so I don't know what grade 6/7 parent drivers are doing). The PAC funds buses for all kindy fieldtrips and any other teachers who request it we will pay for 2 buses per year per class (we only have 7 classes). The k/1 teachers we're having 10-12 harnessed seats dropped off the morning of he fieldtrips by parents for kids who were under 40lbs, leaving them trying to figure out how to install and use them, then running into problems with lack of tether anchors, expired seats, outgrown seats, etc.

I will see if I can get a copy of our permission slip format on Monday and post it. As far as the lap belt situation, it is technically true that they're safer in a laptop belt only than in a booster with a lapbelt, so that is why that blurb is in there. So that parents don't put kids in boosters in lap belt only spots, because many people actually don't know they shouldn't do that. We don't allow kids to be transported in lap belts on fieldtrips at our school at all.

bubbaray said:

I personally am a-OK with using a booster in front of a sensor-off airbag. And you're welcome to "check" me on the Monterey.

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I was after the specific wording. What is the wording for the Monterey?

I don't know if the TC definition of 'deactivated' includes weight-sensored air bags. From some reading it sounds like it means either off with a switch or manually disconnected, so where does that leave drivers from a legal standpoint?

What's wrong with trying to enact positive change? I agree - you want to have your child transported to your standards chances are you will have to drive them yourselves, but that doesn't mean that there's no room for improvement in current policy.

Thanks for the thoughts and insights.

Yes, I do drive my own children, and check the seats of other children that I'm driving. I am more concerned about the other children whose parents send improper seats, then get driven by parents who don't know they are improper seats. Sure, it's not my responsibility, but given that I'm a tech, I would feel somewhat guilty that I didn't do more to institute better guidelines at our school if something were to happen. And if we hammer out a set of guidelines to provide to parents, and parents don't follow it, then at least we tried.