Talk to me about car beds

dragonfly8

New member
Someone is selling one on a local group, and although it's most likely not 2012 complaint...........can anyone just buy a car bed?
 
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Pixelated

Moderator - CPST Instructor
Someone is selling one on a local group, and although it's most likely not 2012 complaint...........can anyone just buy a car bed?

They're available by prescription from a hospital or possibly an OT/PT, and as I understand it are on loan and to be returned after use. I suppose there might be circumstances where that is not the case. I don't know for sure about car beds, but special needs seats are currently not available in 2012 compliant versions (production models anyway), so I suspect car beds aren't either.

How much are they asking? I'd be inclined to buy it for the novelty and to keep it away from people who are almost certainly going to misuse it. They only go to 10lbs anyway. Wonder where they got it from...
 
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VanIsleMommy

Guest
I'm pretty sure I have seen them for sale on US websites, not sure if you need a doctors note for those, but it would be illegally imported if that's where they got it.
 

snowbird25ca

Moderator - CPST Instructor
Additionally - car beds are less safe than a semi-upright rear-facing seat. They have a purpose - kids who can't sit semi-upright and still get enough oxygen need to be able to be transported in a manner that allows them to breath while still restraining them - but they are not as safe as a semi-upright rear-facing seat.

As someone else mentioned, they also only go to 10lbs, so really have very limited use for a full term baby and are just full of different ways to misuse them since even the method of adjusting the harness is different on them.

As Nicole said, it's definitely not something that should be in circulation for the general public.
 

ketchupqueen

CPST and ketchup snob
Staff member
(Your car beds only go up to 10 lbs. up there? Interesting. What do they do for medical conditions that require flat transport after that? Ambulance transport?)
 

snowbird25ca

Moderator - CPST Instructor
(Your car beds only go up to 10 lbs. up there? Interesting. What do they do for medical conditions that require flat transport after that? Ambulance transport?)

Carbeds haven't actually been made for the Canadian market in quite awhile. Truthfully, special needs seats are in a crisis up here and no manufacturer is actually making car beds anymore for our market because it's not profitable due to the small number of sales they see.

Our special needs production restraints are in the exact same situation as well, and I believe that at least locally to me, most if not all of the carbeds being rented out are over 10 yrs old now. (I think there's only one business in the city that even rents them out, and I know it's a very steep cost.)

I'm not involved enough with OT staff or hospital staff to know what they do for conditions requiring flat transport. I suppose a vest could be an option - one of those is approved as a custom restraint up here. It's obviously better than nothing, but has some serious positional limitations...

The situation regarding special needs restraints in Canada hasn't hit the media yet and in fact this thread is probably the first time that I've publicly stated this this clearly.

But it's a problem. Potentially a giant problem, it's just the actual number of kids affected is small enough that when you combine that with there still being some seats out there in circulation, no parent has run in to a case of "they don't make the kind of seat I need to transport my child safely" and gone to the media with it yet.

My understanding is that it's a combined manufacturer/government problem, but I have never fact-checked that particular statement for myself. From what I've been told though, I don't think the manufacturer's are solely responsible though.

(Sorry for the slight threadjack here.)
 

ketchupqueen

CPST and ketchup snob
Staff member
That's very interesting, thanks.

As far as I know, the modified lying-flat vest in the US is only approved for kids over age 1. So there would be a problem with kids under 1 using it (and it probably wouldn't fit anyway, even the smallest size.) There was actually that issue here too until the Hope car bed was released.

I hope they work something out as far as SN seats up there soon. Maybe they could approve US approved SN restraints with a prescription only or something to get around having to write new regulations all the way from scratch, reduce costs for the manufacturers, etc.?

(I sometimes forget that your population is so small because you're such a big country. My mom sees about 4 kids a year in her practice- and that's just ONE network of hospitals in half the state- who need to be transported flat until surgeries can be done and they grow some.)
 

jacqui276

New member
We have car beds at work that we loan to kids that need to be transported flat. I'm curious now of the DOM of them. I will have to peak next time that I am digging through the storage room.
 

snowbird25ca

Moderator - CPST Instructor
We have car beds at work that we loan to kids that need to be transported flat. I'm curious now of the DOM of them. I will have to peak next time that I am digging through the storage room.

I would be very curious to hear what dates you have.

Ketchupqueen - I think that would be ideal - that some sort of exemption was made by the government for something like carbeds.
 

jacqui276

New member
I would be very curious to hear what dates you have.

I will peak on both of my units next time I am at work and update with the dates. I am really curious as well. The car beds look ancient but I have never actually checked and haven't seen any new car beds to compare them to.
 

Pixelated

Moderator - CPST Instructor
I will peak on both of my units next time I am at work and update with the dates. I am really curious as well. The car beds look ancient but I have never actually checked and haven't seen any new car beds to compare them to.

If there happen to be manuals with them - and I would sure hope so - can you take a look to see what the expiration is on them?
 

safeinthecar

Moderator - CPS Technician
Are there ways to get an exemption from the restraint laws altogether due to medical condition? For example, here in California, your doctor can fill out a form that can be filed with DMV confirming that legal vehicle restraint systems can make your medical condition worse through regular use, or cause injury in a crash. This form gives you the right to disable certain passive restraint systems (airbags) or to transport a person without a legal restraint. This loophole can be used to allow the use of foreign seats as well, and a prescription for a particular seat as a medical positioning device circumvents problems that might come up with customs.
 

snowbird25ca

Moderator - CPST Instructor
Are there ways to get an exemption from the restraint laws altogether due to medical condition? For example, here in California, your doctor can fill out a form that can be filed with DMV confirming that legal vehicle restraint systems can make your medical condition worse through regular use, or cause injury in a crash. This form gives you the right to disable certain passive restraint systems (airbags) or to transport a person without a legal restraint. This loophole can be used to allow the use of foreign seats as well, and a prescription for a particular seat as a medical positioning device circumvents problems that might come up with customs.

That would vary by province - airbag deactivation is done through Transport Canada, but the actual laws governing restraint use are in the provincial highway traffic safety acts.

Alberta does have exemptions available from seatbelts if the risk of using a seatbelt is greater than the risk of not wearing a seatbelt, and there are then a whole bunch of technical requirements for it. (Letterhead, effective date, how long it's good for, maximum period of one year allowed, etc.)

There is not any exemption for children with special needs under the AB HTSA. There are exemptions for rental vehicles when rented or leased for periods of less than 14 days, antique cars in parades, taxi cabs, and a few other circumstances, but nothing in a general or longer term way is available for exemptions. I do not know all the other provincial exemptions in detail off the top of my head, but there are enough agencies involved in the actual legislation surrounding the importation and use of seats that it would be a challenge to put the pieces together if it could even be done.

In reality, if a parent crossed the border and purchased a US seat, they could face having it confiscated at the border - it's happened to people before, so not something I'd risk when we're talking a very expensive seat. I suppose someone could try and smuggle it across, but if they got caught, then that could cause them long term problems crossing the border...

So it's really kind of a complex problem.
 

jacqui276

New member
If there happen to be manuals with them - and I would sure hope so - can you take a look to see what the expiration is on them?

I will take a peak for a manual. It unfortunately wouldn't surprise me if there isn't one... My next shift is in a week and a half (only working occasionally right now due to mat leave) but I will dig up this thread and update after I look.
 

HONEYhas3

CPST Instructor
So if SN seats are not up to current standards, what are suppose to do with SN children?

I am beginning to work with more SN children, is there anyone that I can talk to/work with to help my large client base (I am starting in Sept at the largest rehab facility in Canada for children)?
 

tiggercat

New member
HONEYhas3 said:
So if SN seats are not up to current standards, what are suppose to do with SN children?

I am beginning to work with more SN children, is there anyone that I can talk to/work with to help my large client base (I am starting in Sept at the largest rehab facility in Canada for children)?

That is exactly the problem, and no one seems to have an answer.
You can not loan/give non-compliant seats, but there are no compliant seats on the market, so...
ETA, for seats with a "walking unassisted" wording you also have an issue with kids too big to RF that cannot or may never walk unassisted but don't have the trunk strength for a booster...
Edited again to ask, what does the rehab center do currently?
Sent from my iPod touch using Car-Seat.Org
 
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tiggercat

New member
Thanks Trudy for talking about this. I've heard discussions about it, but nothing "out in the open". I agree that it is a huge problem.

Sent from my iPod touch using Car-Seat.Org
 

HONEYhas3

CPST Instructor
Currently, SN seats are being lent out. Or kids are going home in whatever the parents happen to have. The current situation there is very scary, and I have lots of work ahead of me.
 

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