thrillhouse
New member
exactly, which he is, in either seat. I'm just asking whether it's better to use an illegal seat that fits, or a legal seat that also fits.
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wwyd, illegal 5pt seat or booster...
- Thread starter thrillhouse
- Start date
exactly, which he is, in either seat. I'm just asking whether it's better to use an illegal seat that fits, or a legal seat that also fits.
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CDNTech
Senior Community Member
how does a crash test dummy demonstrate maturity? I said before that he sits well and does not move at all in his seat. he may point to things out the window, but he is not changing positions, or shifting at all. he is mature in his seat, I promisemy point is that crash tests are based on weight and height which he exceeds the minimums for this seat. law in my province states that children under 5 must be in an approved seat for their height and weight. it says nothing about 4yo and 40 lbs, although I do understand why that is standard everywhere else. our laws are old, but it's not like I'm putting a tiny child in a booster. I have the headrest on his parkway up on the 4th setting. he's not a small kid.
I stated in an earlier post, he is illegal to be in the Parkway. The Parkway states he must be 4 yrs old AND 40lbs and he is not 4 yrs old yet. It is a ticketable offense under the proper use law... standard throughout Canada.
thrillhouse
New member
actually....the manual for our parkway says nothing about age. only height and weight. http://www.britaxusa.net/pdf/guide_parkway.pdf
I can see that you are suffering from tech-itis, common among techs. I'm so thankful that my local tech is level headed
good night
CDNTech
Senior Community Member
That's a US manual, not a Canadian one. I have a Parkway and I'm 99% positive that it states 4 yrs AND 40lbs.
Regardless, all the data has been provided to you showing that your son is safer in the 5pt harness... especially given his age. You really sound like you do not want to take the advice of experienced technicians here. We are definitely not going above and beyond in our advice... we are stating that your 3 YR OLD is safer in his Husky. We can't do anything about Physics, they do not change. You came for advice asking what would truly protect his one remaining kidney, the answer is to stay in the Husky. It's up to you what you want to do with that advice now.
CDNTech
Senior Community Member
tech-itis, common among techs. I'm so thankful that my local tech is level headed
good night
Slightly uncalled for, but back to the point of your original question...
Please remember he is only 3 and has only one kidney... if you really want to keep him safe, you'll seriously consider the advice that has been given you.
Your local tech should be telling you the same thing.
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Simplysomething
New member
You asked in another post how a crash test dummy demonstrates maturity... Well, It STAYS in position. lol
Connor's Mom
New member
Well, now I don't care about tone.
Like I said before you already have your mind made up on what you are ganna do whether it is unsafe or illegal, which it is both in the case of a 3 year old in a booster.
What even is your point of coming here and asking for our opinion if you are ganna argue (with a poor defense) everything we say and then be rude?
snowbird25ca
Moderator - CPST Instructor
Working for me.
But just in case here it is:
http://www.oeamtc.at/netautor/html_seiten/kisitest_2002/videos/test2002/frontcrash/maxicosirodi.mpg
Plus, I am still asking if it is even legal for a 3 year to be in a booster in Canada?
No, it's not legal for a 3yr old to be in a booster in Canada. Most provinces have 4 and 40lb laws, and those that don't have the requirement of using a seat properly - and the boosters are rated as 4 and 40lbs minimum.
As to the OP, you're asking us which kind of law breaking is better to do... since you already have the Husky and have been ok with using it up until now, given your ds's age, I'd continue to use it or look into a legal option of keeping your ds harnessed.
This has nothing to do with being a die hard keep my kid harnessed to 9 or 10 thing.
We're talking about a 3yr old, not a 6 yr old. Even a 5yr old I'd have no problems saying a booster would be appropriate if they fit well and could sit properly. But I don't care how mature your 3yr old is, I cannot imagine a 3yr old who at some point in time in a car ride wouldn't move out of position. 3yr olds do not belong in boosters. My dd is 3, and she sits "maturely" in her car seat - but she's harnessed. Might she sit still in a booster, I dunno and I'm not going to find out... but my prediction is she probably would the first few trips because it was new and she wanted to prove she was ok to ride in it. 3yr olds get antsy, they get mad and frustrated - and you can't always pick the time and location that these things are going to happen.Your ds is best protected in a 5pt harness. I won't tell you to use an illegal seat, but I will tell you a booster for a 3yr old just isn't appropriate. And it's something I would tell any parent regardless of the situation. And really, even if you want to argue that it's legal for him to be in a booster, legal does not equal safe!
I have to agree that I'm not sure why you asked given that it sounds like you've already made up your mind.
But that's my :twocents: for what it's worth.
snowbird25ca
Moderator - CPST Instructor
One other question I have, is why all the sudden are you wanting to quit using the Husky? What's changed?
If you have a seat that you've had installed properly and been using properly and it fits your ds well, then why trade the safer illegal option for the less safe illegal option?
If you have a seat that you've had installed properly and been using properly and it fits your ds well, then why trade the safer illegal option for the less safe illegal option?
Lea_Ontario
Well-known member
Answering as a Canadian non-tech :
For a 3-yr old (I have a dd who is almost 3 myself) child with increased need of physical protection (due to having only 1 kidney), I would either continue to use the Husky (risking a fine because it is not approved for use in Canada), or I would invest the funds in a Radian.
Most likely, I would continue to use the Husky until I had saved the $300 for the Radian (Radian Premier $269 + tax).
Maturity aside, I would want to minimize crash forces upon his body - and a 5-point harness will spread the force out significantly more than a 3-point seatbelt would. Beyond age, beyond maturity, beyond finances - the increased physical protection would be my driving factor.
And the Radian would "hug" his body more than the Husky will - it's a fairly slim seat, and has the energy-absorbing foam in it.
For a 3-yr old (I have a dd who is almost 3 myself) child with increased need of physical protection (due to having only 1 kidney), I would either continue to use the Husky (risking a fine because it is not approved for use in Canada), or I would invest the funds in a Radian.
Most likely, I would continue to use the Husky until I had saved the $300 for the Radian (Radian Premier $269 + tax).
Maturity aside, I would want to minimize crash forces upon his body - and a 5-point harness will spread the force out significantly more than a 3-point seatbelt would. Beyond age, beyond maturity, beyond finances - the increased physical protection would be my driving factor.
And the Radian would "hug" his body more than the Husky will - it's a fairly slim seat, and has the energy-absorbing foam in it.
thrillhouse
New member
oy vey ladies...in a few short weeks, he will be 4. it's not like he has just barely turned 3. I don't like the thought of a tiny 3 yo in a booster either. He is not tiny and trust me, he sits well. Otherwise I would not have tried him in it, I am not a moron. As I have said several times now, we still have the husky and IF he proves to have difficulty sitting in the parkway we will pull over and put the husky back in since we are keeping it in the trunk. My manual is Canadian and I am quite sure it does not state 4 years, I just read it yesterday.
What changed was, yesterday, by a series of fortunate events, we got a brand new parkway for free from a boutique store. We thought we'd give him a try in it and he loves it.
I am not buying a Radian. please stop suggesting it, I can't stand that seat. (sorry April, I love it for you, but it's not practical for us) There have been so many issues with the seats, installs, narrow, uncomfortable, and the fact that sunshine kids makes the mighty tight and other non advisable add-ons, I just can't go that route. Plus, as I said before, ds hasn't got much room at all in it. I'm not buying another $$$$ seat to get a couple months out of it. I could go on, but I will spare you
What changed was, yesterday, by a series of fortunate events, we got a brand new parkway for free from a boutique store. We thought we'd give him a try in it and he loves it.
I am not buying a Radian. please stop suggesting it, I can't stand that seat. (sorry April, I love it for you, but it's not practical for us) There have been so many issues with the seats, installs, narrow, uncomfortable, and the fact that sunshine kids makes the mighty tight and other non advisable add-ons, I just can't go that route. Plus, as I said before, ds hasn't got much room at all in it. I'm not buying another $$$$ seat to get a couple months out of it. I could go on, but I will spare you
Lea_Ontario
Well-known member
Okay - so you have already made up your mind. I fully understand not wanting to spend extra $$.
Why are you asking for advice then ?
And why are you dismissing the suggestion that a 5-point harness would be better at protecting your sons remaining kidney ? You have yet to respond to that at all.
Why are you asking for advice then ?
And why are you dismissing the suggestion that a 5-point harness would be better at protecting your sons remaining kidney ? You have yet to respond to that at all.
thrillhouse
New member
My new question is "how much safer is a 5pt" is it a little bit safer? a whole lot safer? I've yet to see any evidence (that link posted a little while didn't work for me, either time) I understand that rfing for as long as possible is a whole lot safer. But This seat has been proven safe and approved for his height and weight. he is essentially 4 years old, I don't understand why so many are insisting that they know for a fact that my son cannot possibly sit still in the car. You've never met him or been in the car with him! good lawd.. get a grip ladies :thumbsdown:
here is how I see it. he IS good in the car so your maturity argument is a moot point. he is essentially 4 years old. my manual does not state 4 years, my province does not require 4 years (which he basically is anyway)
husky parkway
5 point, no TSIP 3 pt with with TSIP
head tilt when sleeping great head support for sleep
hard for grandparents to get right easy for grandparents
illegal seat legal seat
I think for safety it's a draw or very very close. I should add that we only drive about 2x a week.
Jewels
Senior Community Member
I did a little searching and came across this:
He isn't quite 4 yet so really he isn't old enough for a booster. That is sort of saying that your 17yr old is almost 18 so they should be able to go to the bar.
5pt is safer, race car drivers wear 5pt harness because of this. I do have a video for and it is heartbreaking. I couldn't imagine how I would feel knowing that 5pt is safer and something happening to my child.
~Joyce's story.
I have a friend who as an adult was in a collision on the highway (so she was going highway speed). Upon impact her body twisted and the parts of her body that were injured were the parts not restrained by her seat belt. She was driving so the belt was on her left shoulder coming across her body. She injured her right shoulder and her left leg because of the twisiting.
So if you have a 5pt harness why don't you use it? The Parkway is a great seat but why not use it as a spare when you really need it (after he's 4). You say he can sit still, which I do think that my 3yr old could sit still and properly in a booster but I have acess to a 5pt harness and he will be in it when he outgrows it because it is safer (and I am not saying he will be there until 9-10 (he is in a MA).)
I am not sure what Province you are in but since you mentioned April's name I am guessing that is CDNCasper and I know she is in MB.
He isn't quite 4 yet so really he isn't old enough for a booster. That is sort of saying that your 17yr old is almost 18 so they should be able to go to the bar.
5pt is safer, race car drivers wear 5pt harness because of this. I do have a video for and it is heartbreaking. I couldn't imagine how I would feel knowing that 5pt is safer and something happening to my child.
~Joyce's story.
I have a friend who as an adult was in a collision on the highway (so she was going highway speed). Upon impact her body twisted and the parts of her body that were injured were the parts not restrained by her seat belt. She was driving so the belt was on her left shoulder coming across her body. She injured her right shoulder and her left leg because of the twisiting.
So if you have a 5pt harness why don't you use it? The Parkway is a great seat but why not use it as a spare when you really need it (after he's 4). You say he can sit still, which I do think that my 3yr old could sit still and properly in a booster but I have acess to a 5pt harness and he will be in it when he outgrows it because it is safer (and I am not saying he will be there until 9-10 (he is in a MA).)
CDNTech
Senior Community Member
If April is the level headed tech you are referring to, she should absolutely be telling you to keep him in a 5pt harness at his age and in his situation.
Maturity aside, a 5pt will spread crash forces more evenly and keep him properly in position should a secondary collision happen. A 3pt seatbelt will not do that. Basic physics here... 5 is better than 3, much better.
However, you seem bound and determined not to listen to sound advice. Like I said before, the safe option has been laid out in front of you... if you choose to ignore that advice, that is your issue, not ours... but it doesn't make sense to try and get us to agree to the less safe option. No one here is going to do that.
Maturity aside, a 5pt will spread crash forces more evenly and keep him properly in position should a secondary collision happen. A 3pt seatbelt will not do that. Basic physics here... 5 is better than 3, much better.
However, you seem bound and determined not to listen to sound advice. Like I said before, the safe option has been laid out in front of you... if you choose to ignore that advice, that is your issue, not ours... but it doesn't make sense to try and get us to agree to the less safe option. No one here is going to do that.
thrillhouse
New member
I'm curious where it is federally mandated that children be in a harness until 5 and 50. it is only recently that ONE seat is available in canada with a harness that meets that requirement.
we also have a marathon, and my son is too tall for it.
again, we still have the husky and i'm debating whether it is better to be in a legal appropriate seat, or an illegal appropriate seat.
thrillhouse
New member
yes, april advised to use the husky until his birthday, but did agree that i am within the law to choose the parkway for him. the decision is up to me, and I am still deciding.
CDNTech
Senior Community Member
There you go... she stated until his birthday and from the tone of your post I'm sure she advised longer... seeing as she agrees that you are 'within the law'... tech speak for that's not a smart decision, but it's up to you obviously.
CDNTech
Senior Community Member
If you read the quote, it states for MANITOBA (not federal) and it also states an "appropriate device prescribed in the regulations". This can include a booster cushion, but again the child needs to be 4 yrs old AND 40lbs to use one. The law is stating that a child can NOT use *just* a seatbelt until they are both 50lbs AND 5 years old.
thrillhouse
New member
I read the quote.
Originally Posted by aidensmom02 View Post
Manitoba's basic law states the following:
April 1984 (when it came into effect) - All children under 5 years of age and 50 pounds must be restrained in an appropriate device prescribed in the regulations and the device must be properly secured to the motor vehicle.
Remember this is in addition to federal laws... so
RF until 20lbs
Harnessed until 5 years AND 50 lbs
Harnessed until 6 years IF under 40lbs
Boostered until the adult seatbelt fits correctly (can pass the 5 step test)
Originally Posted by aidensmom02 View Post
Manitoba's basic law states the following:
April 1984 (when it came into effect) - All children under 5 years of age and 50 pounds must be restrained in an appropriate device prescribed in the regulations and the device must be properly secured to the motor vehicle.
Remember this is in addition to federal laws... so
RF until 20lbs
Harnessed until 5 years AND 50 lbs
Harnessed until 6 years IF under 40lbs
Boostered until the adult seatbelt fits correctly (can pass the 5 step test)
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