Need a new van...

o_mom

New member
The tranny on our Odyssey is slipping (2002MY w/ 135k mi, so yeah, it's the tranny). I'm going to look into transmission replacement as one option, but also want to know how a 'new' van would compare.

Looking mainly at something 'certified used' if possible, so that limits it to the last 5-ish years. Prefer 8-passenger. My own kids are two in boosters and one harnessed. Regularly take two other booster riders, so fitting at least 5 seats is important, though at least two of those can be backless. When I do take 6+ passengers, usually at least one is SBO and/or front-seat eligible (11.5-14 yos). I would also really like the 8-passenger for times we want to take the kids and cargo putting three across the middle row, though it looks like most of the newer vans have a split third row, so maybe this isn't as big of a deal???

So, what years/models am I looking at?

If I'm looking correctly, the Sienna has the 35/30/35 split up through 2010 MY, but only in the lowest trim level, so no leather and no power doors? 2011-12 has the teeny-tiny seat, but can do that in leather/power?

The Odyssey 2006-2010 (I won't do 2005 because of the TAs) has the leprechaun seat, but can get leather and power doors. 2011-12 has a more reasonable middle seat, w/leather and power doors?

I mention leather and power doors because of all the features on my van, those two seem to make the most sense with kids. We are beyond needing built-in DVD, etc.

Are there any other 8 pass vehicles?

What other 7 pass vans are worth a look?

I'm not an SUV fan for many reasons (gas, safety, cargo, etc.), so I haven't really considered them... should I?

Did I mention I hate car shopping?
 
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bubbaray

New member
Do you need/want 4wd?

Personally I loved my 2005 ody but will never go without 4wd now. so that would limit my options.

If you do not need 4wd, I'd go with any of the ody years that are NOT new designs. Sorry I can't remember which those are except 2005 was definitely a new MY and my Honda service advisor told me to never purchase a new design in the first MY. My 2005 had a lot of problems, not tranny but things like the door motor going and the window motors going repeatedly.

As an aside I have to say I am really impressed with the fit and finish of my Toyota and the service. I was a big Honda Acura fan before but might have been completely swayed to Toyota. If I were to purchase another vehicle today I'd head first to Toyota. I purchased during the floor mat debacle and feel like they really are working hard to keep their customers happy now.

If you really want to think outside the box, we did have a Ford Flex rental for 2w last year and quite liked it. They come in 4wd. I think they only seat 7 not 8 tho. Can't remember if that 3rd row seats 3 or 2. The 2nd row was humongous. It had a lot of power.

ETA I really do like SUVs vs 4wd vans. But here clearance is an issue, so having a 4wd that rides low to the ground like a Sienna is pretty useless. For larger SUVs, I like the pilot, Sequoia, and Suburban/Yukon. I would also look at the larger Ford SUVs because DHs F150 truck is very nice inside

Or you could just google F650. LOL
 

o_mom

New member
On my phone, so excuse any typos. :)

Don't really need AWD. We get snow, but generally don't need to drive in it a bunch as streets are cleared quickly, or they call a snow day until it is gone, lol. Once every few years we get more than a few inches and my Ody w/TCS has been fine even in that.

I'll have to look into the others you mentioned. I'm torn on if I *need* the 8 passenger. There are many times I would like to put them three across to put cargo in the back, but part of that is because my 3rd row is not split so to have all three, I only have the cargo area behind the third row. OTOH, putting cargo next to a passenger in the third row (say folding the 60 of a 60/40 split) isn't a great option, either.

The other time I wish for it is when I need to take 3-4 passengers other than my kids/DH. It would just be convenient to have the option of 8 passengers. I'm just not sure what I would have to give up to get it ($$, features, reliability, etc.).
 

o_mom

New member
bubbaray said:
I'm not a fan of AWD, just 4WD. But, you know your climate better than I do, KWIM?

I just want someone here to get a F650. LOL. Come on, it would be fun. LOL

http://www.truckinweb.com/features/0711tr_ford_f650/photo_01.html

LOL... I would need a new garage for that. I can't even imagine a situation where that vehicle would be useful, except maybe Jurrasic Park.

We had a Subaru w/AWD and it was nice in the snow, but died a sepectacularly expensive death. Since then we have been fine w/just FWD & TCS. About twice a year when we are camping 4WD would be nice, but not enough to really need it.
 

o_mom

New member
8 usable seats limits you to the 04-10 Sienna. You're correct that it only came with cloth. However, I believe you can get power doors (or 1, at least).

Here's a thread about them - http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=221748

I'm seriously considering having the seats reupholstered if I get one. I don't know if I can go back to cloth with kids. :eek:

Thanks! Great thread. A 2009/10 Sienna might just be the ticket. The 11/12 Odys are looking too expensive, in a I don't *want* to pay that way - I usually find 2-3 yrs old is my personal sweet spot for good depreciation vs. still reasonably low mileage. I'll have to see about aftermarket leather. DH would just love that, lol.
 

o_mom

New member
OK.... now that DH has actually witnessed the slipping, suddenly it is now a priority. :rolleyes: Dealer has pronounced it dead... $4k for new tranny through the dealer or a third party (Jasper).

Anyway... these are what we are considering. If you had to choose, which would be the best options for 8 pass:

2009-2010 Sienna 8 pass - having a hard time finding these. Did find one for $16 k with 48k miles, but it is 150 mi away, so I'm wondering if there is a dead body in the back or some other undesirable feature that it is priced low.

2010 Odyssey - seem to be quite a few of these, many certified-used with 20-40k miles - has the smaller 8th seat

2011 Odyssey - I found a few EXs, certified-used with 20k mi. This would be a stretch $$-wise (well, stretch in our debt-averse family, not kids-not-getting-shoes stretch).


We are concerned about going with Honda again, but it doesn't look like anyone other than Toyota has an 8 passenger and the newer Toyota 8th seat just sucks. I think the pre-11 Ody 8th seat is better than the 11+ Toyota seat, correct?

Mainly would be putting boostered or SBO kids there, but they are not getting any smaller. Routinely have 11-14 yos in SBO (14 yo is 5'9" :eek:), also thinking like this week with camp carpool and needing 5-6 boostered kids in there. I still have one in harness, but putting him center is not necessarily needed.
 

TyAndCheyMommy

New member
The chevy venture has 8 seats, and they are all full size seats. I can easily fit 6 car seats in there. I also have leather, power doors, DVD system, and all other add ons you could hope for!
 

bubbaray

New member
2011 Ody for being newer? Tough call Tho you might want to PM quassee as she recently had big problems with hers and I seem to remember it was the tranny. Her experience would make me nervous.

I will say that having gone from an Ody (and prior to that an Acura) to a Toyota, IMO the fit and finish of the Toyotas is way better. I am very impressed with Toyota. I will be buying another Toyota again down the road.

So yeah I'm no help. Maybe the Sienna? Which do you want?
 

o_mom

New member
The chevy venture has 8 seats, and they are all full size seats. I can easily fit 6 car seats in there. I also have leather, power doors, DVD system, and all other add ons you could hope for!

Looks like they haven't made them for seven years, though. I don't think we want to go that old. The Uplander was made through 2008, but still a little older than we wanted. I'll add it to my list of possibles, thanks!
 

o_mom

New member
2011 Ody for being newer? Tough call Tho you might want to PM quassee as she recently had big problems with hers and I seem to remember it was the tranny. Her experience would make me nervous.

I will say that having gone from an Ody (and prior to that an Acura) to a Toyota, IMO the fit and finish of the Toyotas is way better. I am very impressed with Toyota. I will be buying another Toyota again down the road.

So yeah I'm no help. Maybe the Sienna? Which do you want?

I'll PM quassee, thanks.

What I want, doesn't exist, lol. I want the seating flexibility of the 8 pass, but not necessarily the price. I'd like to have 8 usable seats, which looks like either the pre-11 Sienna 8pass (rare) or 11+ Ody ($$) are the best options for.

If I gave up the 8th seat, I could get a brand new Grand Caravan for the same or less than the used Odys... quality probably not as good, but the warranty period would be about the same. I could also get a 10 or 11 Sienna for about the same price (10 being 7 pass, 11 having the all-but-unusable 8th seat).

Gah!
 

o_mom

New member
The plot thickens... After looking at a couple of used Siennas (2011, I think, DH went), the dealer called and asked if we would be interested in a new 2012 for the same price. :eek: Haven't gotten the details yet of what trim levels, etc. DH is talking to them and I need to get in one to look closer at how the 8th seat works.

In the meantime, I just looked up the safety ratings and the 11-12 Siennas did not do very well. They were 2-3 stars for front passenger ratings with NHTSA. Anyone have insight into that?

Really makes me hesitate on newer Toyotas even though I'm not thrilled about going back to Honda with their record on Ody transmissions.
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
I'm not a fan of AWD, just 4WD.

The distinction between AWD and 4WD is rather ambiguous these days, with all sorts of manufacturers arbitrarily using either term with various qualifiers. Unless it's a real "truck" system with locking differentials and true HI/LO settings, you may not really know how robust the system is. Jeep Rubicon and some heavy-duty trucks and SUVs may offer manual lockers.

Some automatic AWD systems are easily as good as a 4WD system for all but the most heavy duty off-road and inclement weather situations. Jeep Quadra Drive is one example. Other AWD systems are little more than 4-wheel traction control. They get the job done for typical rain, snow, sand or dirt/gravel roads, but probably not suitable for real off-road conditions.

On the flip-side, some "4WD" systems that have HI/LO know settings are merely mid or high end AWD systems with a simulated LO range. Results may be quite good, as in the Grand Cherokee Quadra Drive, or not quite as good, depending how it is implemented.

Basically, if you have serious off-road needs, you have to do a lot of homework.
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
Used Siennas and Odysseys often sell for nearly as much as new ones, especially if there are incentives on the new ones.

Some newer Toyotas have fared poorly with the new NHTSA female passenger dummy.

One thing about the Grand Caravan, they are easy to rent for a week if you want an extended trial, though I suspect a dealer will loan you one at least overnight.
 

luckyclov

New member
FWIW, I adore my '11 Sienna. I've had it for 17 months, which is, sadly, pretty much the longest I've owned one vehicle since my early 20s. And I really can't find any reason to want to get rid of it yet. That's a good thing.:p

You're probably aware, but there are only 3 top tether anchors. That's not even remotely a concern for me given my family consists of 2 kids 8+, but for some, it is. The 8th seat is narrow and sits lower than the outboard captain's chairs, so it's not really child seat friendly at all. It's great for a 5-stepping child or petite adult, though. In fact, my 53" 9 year old technically 5-steps in it, even though he's not nearly close in any other seating position, so it's great to have for a spare kid here and there.

ETA: As far as crash testing, it got dinged in frontal for female passenger (chest Gs, I believe). It's really not an issue for me. I'm rarely in the passenger seat. And when I am, I'm as far back as possible while still allowing for proper shoulder belt fit (my body is side-by-side with the pillar - which, FWIW, is further back than NHTSA's female). It's still an IIHS Top Safety Pick and, many times, that means more to me than NHTSA's star ratings. Still a 5 star side impact / 4 star rollover. My main concern has always been, and will continue to be, keeping my passengers, specifically my rear, as safe as possible.

I'm also a fan of Toyota's knee airbags (driver), given how common LE injuries/traumas are.

If you have any questions at all, shoot me a PM.
 
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o_mom

New member
luckyclov said:
FWIW, I adore my '11 Sienna. I've had it for 17 months, which is, sadly, pretty much the longest I've owned one vehicle since my early 20s. And I really can't find any reason to want to get rid of it yet. That's a good thing.:p

You're probably aware, but there are only 3 top tether anchors. That's not even remotely a concern for me given my family consists of 2 kids 8+, but for some, it is.

If you have any questions at all, shoot me a PM. I have the 8 passenger.


How does the base where the 8th seat goes hold up to kids walking through to the back? I need to spend some more time in there when I'm not chasing kids.

The TT is not a huge deal. I have two in boosters nearly fulltime at 7 and 8.5 (DS2 still barely fits a Radian when I need him to because of seatbelt availability). DS3 is still harnessed for the forseeable future, but that is it. Yeah, one it every spot would be nice, but not a deal breaker.
 

o_mom

New member
CPSDarren said:
Used Siennas and Odysseys often sell for nearly as much as new ones, especially if there are incentives on the new ones.

Some newer Toyotas have fared poorly with the new NHTSA female passenger dummy.

One thing about the Grand Caravan, they are easy to rent for a week if you want an extended trial, though I suspect a dealer will loan you one at least overnight.

I kind of expected the price on "newer" used to be similar to brand new, which I have seen on the used 2012s and very low mileage 2011s. But, this was a 2011 Sienna with 40k mi and they were saying we could get the same price on a new 2012 Sienna...

I think the GC may be out. DH drove 2+ hrs with my sister in her 2011 GC and was not impressed... trim pieces falling off, etc. He said it did not inspire confidence, lol.
 

luckyclov

New member
I owned a 2009 Grand Caravan SXT for a year. And that is all I got to say 'bout that.

We actually haven't had any issues at all with the rear seat tracks or the ground "console" in the center of the captain's chairs (where the 8th seat attaches to). And my 9.5 year old DS, who plays travel soccer (and is on the field 5-6 days a week, rain or shine), sits in the 3rd row, if you catch my drift. He doesn't typically step ON it, though - he steps over it.
 

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