Need help with grandparent car/in case of emergency Seat - Which seat or RSTV?

When my parents have had the kids, they have had both of them and we switch cars. (And if they want to take just one kid, then we had the option of my moving our seat into their car for the outing.) But now they will be my older DD's in case of emergency contact for school, so they need to keep some sort of seat to use if they need to pick her up. They do not want to keep a seat installed in their car so it would be stored in their basement and installed if they needed to pick her up unexpectedly, like if she was sick and I could not be reached. (not an ideal situation in which for relatively inexperienced installers to be installing a seat )

My DD is 5 yo and approx. 39 pounds and 45 inches. The car is a newish model Forester ('09 or'10). And the grandparents have been good about putting them into their already installed seats properly (tightening harness, checking chest clip).

We have a newer model size small RSTV that she used on a trip about a year ago. It seems like that might be the way to go for this situation, especially given we already have it, but the lack of a shell and the way it works always felt strange to me and after the recent thread on it, I am feeling anxious about using it. If we used it, we would use both the shoulder belt and the tether and the crotch strap (assuming the grandparents remember it all after I train them on it .. I found it a lot to remember when we used it ). I have seen the mention of locking the belt with it, but I would prefer to avoid that. Finally, especially without a shell, I'd want her riding in the center position, but would that be okay in this car? (I think it may have one of those arm rests that folds down out of the seat back.)

So what do you think? Would you use the RSTV or a seat? If a seat, then I'm assuming, given her height, that a nautilus would be our least expensive option? I'm feeling really unsure about what to do and I'd really appreciate your advice! Thank you!

I'd consider a booster for that situation. If you don't want to consider a booster I'd have the grandparents try out the vest and some seats and see what they prefer.

I should have mentioned, she has never been in a booster.

I thought the minimum for boostering was 4 years AND 40 pounds and she is not 40 pounds yet so she's never been in one.

It depends on where you are. I believe that in Canada, a child is required to be 4 years old and 40lbs to go in a booster.

I think that in a situation like this, a little booster training and a high back booster for the grandparents would be a good solution. There is far less chance of misuse or installation mistakes. An inexpensive booster like the Graco Turbobooster or the Evenflo Big Kid could fit her well. If she is a compliant child who follows directions well then a little booster training and instructions for the grandparents on how she is to sit at all times could be all you need.

Check your state laws. Your child is big enough then "in case of emergency" I'd be perfectly comfortable transporting her from school to home in a $13.50 Harmony LBB from Walmart as long as it isn't against the law in your state. I wouldn't drive her around like that unnecessarily, especially because she hasn't been "trained" to a booster yet, but in an urgent situation I'd be OK with it.

Honestly, a LBB is cheap enough, and she's close enough to the age where it would be a reasonable occasional/friend/carpool use product, that if she meets the legal minimums in your state I'd buy one. Then I'd sit down with the grandparents and their car with both restraints (the RSTV and the booster) and see which one they are more comfortable with. She is small enough she'll probably need to use the belt positioner with the booster, so it's not necessarily a given that your parents will find the booster easier. They'll need to know how to evaluate belt fit and adjust as necessary.

Either the RSTV or the LBB could easily be stored in their trunk, too. I keep my RSTV in the under-trunk compartment with my spare tire so it doesn't get heavy stuff plunked directly on top of it. If they have a generous space in there like I do, they might be able to do that, too.

Keep in mind that for car seat purposes, a child's weight is the clothed weight. So if your child is 39 lbs naked in the doctor's office, she may be 40 lbs fully clothed with shoes on anyway.

P.S. - If you feel much more comfortable with a car seat, I'd go with a Maestro for this purpose rather than a Nautilus.

Thank you for the responses. I had thought she wasn't old/ big enough to booster yet. So is that what we should do in our cars too? Is she ready to move up to the booster?

Athena said:

Thank you for the responses. I had thought she wasn't old/ big enough to booster yet. So is that what we should do in our cars too? Is she ready to move up to the booster?

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She might be. It depends on if she's mature enough to sit correctly ALL the time. But if she fits in harnessed seats in your car, I don't see much reason to switch her. Practice with a booster as needed, and move later when you feel more comfortable.

I'd do a booster in Grandma's car, too.

No one thinks we should use the vest we already own?

How do I know if she fits in a booster properly/safely (or which one she would)? She is really slim ... like practically off/below the BMI chart slim.

Since we haven't tried it, I really wouldn't know if I can trust her to sit properly. She's just turned 5, so she still falls asleep in the car, sometimes she does things she's not supposed to, you know typical 5 year old behavior. If they were to need to pick her up, it would be something like because she was sick and throwing up and I was too far or could not be reached, so for those of you who have been in this situation, do kids sit properly under those circumstances?

Thanks.

Ok, this is long. Sorry.

Athena said:

No one thinks we should use the vest we already own?

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Only if your parents are comfortable using it. I personally think there's more room for error than with a booster. But if they'll use it right, I'd use what you already have, yes.

As for whether she "should" move up to a booster yet, as long as she still fits in her current harnessed seat I would say no. Although I'd be perfectly comfortable with a booster as an occasional or emergency seat, I personally feel that a harness is safer for a child that age and size. I have no scientific evidence to back that up. It has to do with my own opinion and my own comfort level. The biggest accident I've ever been in was a "vaulting" accident; that is, an end-over-end wreck down a steep embankment. Two of the three adults (all were wearing 3-point seat belts) in the car were seriously injured. The baby in his harnessed (infant) car seat was unharmed. Although there is no evidence that a harness is safer than a booster and seat belt for a child over the age of 5 and over 40 lbs, the crash tests are for front-end collisions, not roll-overs. Roll-over accidents are the rarest type but also the most deadly. I have a hard time believing that a seat belt is equally safe with a harness in a roll-over accident (this applies to anybody, of any age). So I am in favor of keeping a child in a harness whenever possible, as long as the child will fit.

That said, the whole thing is a risk/benefit analysis. First, it's unlikely that your parents will need to unexpectedly pick your daughter up from school at all. If the pick-up is planned, you can always install her car seat in their car ahead of time if you would prefer. Second, in the unlikely event that she does get picked up unexpectedly by the grandparents, the chances of a major , complicated accident on the presumably short ride home are really slim. The vast majority of accidents, especially on neighborhood streets, are front-end collisions and a properly used booster or RSTV will protect her just as well as a harnessed seat if that happens. Third, the odds are probably higher that your parents will improperly install a car seat compared to properly using a booster. A properly used booster is much safer than an improperly used car seat. And this is also the only reason you might want to do the booster instead of a RSTV. An RSTV passes the same crash testing as a booster and should be at least as safe as a booster if it's used correctly. But IMO, it's a little more complicated than a booster. On the other hand, if you do choose to do a booster, you'll need to take her on some practice rides first to make sure she can sit properly, refrain from playing with the seat belt or leaning out of it, and you'll still need to go over proper use and fit with your parents.

So really, either one would be just fine, but I think it's important that the people using the restraint are comfortable with it and can demonstrate to you that they can use it correctly.

Athena said:

If they were to need to pick her up, it would be something like because she was sick and throwing up and I was too far or could not be reached, so for those of you who have been in this situation, do kids sit properly under those circumstances?

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Sorry, I forgot to address this in my novel.

It's definitely a good point. I would counter that you may not want her throwing up on your RSTV, whereas a $13.50 LBB would be pretty expendable. Then again, if she's vomiting, Grandma will probably give her a bucket and can drape a towel over her to catch stray ickies.

I still say it boils down to which one your parents can use correctly and are comfortable with. Either option is safe. And yes, it's possible that a sick child might be less likely to sit up straight and not lean out of a booster. On the other hand, a sick child might also be less likely to be squirmy and fidgety. So I guess it depends on what kind of sick she is.

Thanks for all the info. I'm going to have to give this some thought. I'm having trouble imagining her in a booster. She is just so tiny that it is hard for me to imagine her fitting properly in a HBB, much less considering putting her in a LBB. I'm not even completely comfortable with her riding in the RSTV because of her size. So I think I might need some time to become more comfortable with it.

If she has the small size RSTV and it fits her snugly, her size shouldn't be an issue. And if you use the top tether with it, neither should her maturity (within reason; I'm assuming of course that she's not going to try to escape it).

I understand your concern about the booster and her size, too. I don't like to see kids under 40 lbs in boosters myself. But she's awfully close, and most boosters are designed for kids 30 lbs and up so she's well within that range. We're also only talking about an unusual and unlikely scenario which would have her in the booster for a single, fairly short ride. I have two school-age children who are going into 11th and 12th grade this year. Only ONCE in their entire lives has one of the kids needed to be picked up by an emergency contact (because I was out of cell phone range & didn't get the call from the school). And that was when my younger son was in middle school & got sick in the middle of the day.

Good luck with whatever you decide. If you'd really feel better, and if your mom can install a car seat correctly, get her a Maestro. They're usually around $80. You may be able to do better right now, too. I don't know what the prices are at the moment, but Target is having a baby sale and Babies R Us is having their trade-in event.

Your peace of mind may be worth the $80-ish.

Any suggestions for how to explain to a child why it's okay for her to use the booster for this situation (requiring her to take some rides in it to prepare for this potential event, right), but she still needs to be harnessed in our car? I wouldn't be surprised if the situation confuses her and she asks and I want to be prepared, but am not sure what to say. Thanks!

What about a HBB for grandma's car and locking the seatbelt? My 5yo insists on the seatbelt being locked My daughter did ride in a LBB booster once, just before her 5th birthday, when she was throwing up at school, I was at a workshop two hours away, and my SIL was able to pick her up. When she told me she had a booster she could grab and go, I was happy because I didn't have to worry about it being installed improperly. I thought it was a HBB, but I misunderstood. Anyway, everyone made it home safely and my DD excitedly talked about her ride in the "little seat" but never asked about having it on a regular basis. She knew it wasn't hers and she hasn't ever seen that seat since. If you use it just for emergencies, I don't think it creates an issue. It's not like there will be that many emergencies Then the grandparents can use it later on for day trips when she IS using a booster on a regular basis, too.

Athena said:

We have a newer model size small RSTV that she used on a trip about a year ago. It seems like that might be the way to go for this situation, especially given we already have it, but the lack of a shell and the way it works always felt strange to me and after the recent thread on it, I am feeling anxious about using it.

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Can someone direct me to this thread?

P1ally said:

Can someone direct me to this thread?

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http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=182245

Here it is ... but I was probably being overly anxious about it. It is not unsafe to use .. actually the funny thing is that part of my concern was it being called a booster and now we're looking at boosters for our urgent back up seat. Sorry if I alarmed you with my reference.

kam1011 said:

What about a HBB for grandma's car and locking the seatbelt? My 5yo insists on the seatbelt being locked

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That doesn't squeeze her too tightly? It sounds horrible to me, but if the kids are okay with it ... Am I remembering reading that only some boosters allow seatbelt locking?

kam1011 said:

but never asked about having it on a regular basis. She knew it wasn't hers and she hasn't ever seen that seat since. If you use it just for emergencies, I don't think it creates an issue. It's not like there will be that many emergencies Then the grandparents can use it later on for day trips when she IS using a booster on a regular basis, too.

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Good point. Hopefully she won't question it .. or better yet, hopefully we won't have any pick up emergencies. I am thinking that now too, that maybe it makes sense to get a nice HBB that they could use in the future.

Yes, you can only lock the seatbelt with certain boosters.

Check both the booster owners manual and the vehicle owners manual before locking a seatbelt with a booster. I know the owners manual for my VW Beetle states that you cannot lock the seatbelt while using a booster seat.