Highback vs. Backless boosters (Calling all techs!)

arly1983

New member
So lets talk about what we know about crash test performance of highback vs. backless boosters.

Also, the performance of rigid latch vs. nonrigid latch vs. no latch on boosters in crash tests.

I did a search and read MANY threads. There were some nuggets of nice informations but for the most part there was mostly unfounded statements and conjecture.

I am particularly interested in crash test videos, studies, etc. comparing the two.

Anyone else who has a question between the two feel free to add it here. :)
 
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mommycat

Well-known member
Just subbing so I can read the discussion - good question! Nothing specific to contribute at this time, sorry.
 

Evolily

New member
I'm not a tech

In the Transport Canada study the boosters with rigid latch led to increased abdominal loading. In some other study that I am failing to recall the name of they were unable to show a difference between highback and backless boosters in real life crash data. Some people believe that may in part be influenced by not distinguishing between booster types as many high back boosters (particularly popular cosco 3 in 1's and combination seats) have unusually poor fit.

The only benefit I tell people about high back boosters is that they provide greater support for a sleeping child and greater containment for a wiggly child. the only benefit I give of latchable boosters is that you don't have to buckle them in. Unless there are studies I am not aware (which is highly possible) any other stated benefit is just an informed opinion.
 

LISmama810

Admin - CPS Technician
Pretty sure someone once linked to a study (European, I believe) showing that boosters with rigid LATCH did better in side impacts. Then there was the TC study mentioned above. I think a Sunshine Kids engineered LATCH in a chat here one time, too, but I don't remember what he said.

There are typically two studies people quote about backless vs high-back. One shows an advantage to HB. The other shows no difference. The official line is still that there is no difference.

In reality, it's probably one of those things we just don't have enough info on.

And of course I don't have links to any of that. :eek:
 

Pixels

New member
So lets talk about what we know about crash test performance of highback vs. backless boosters.

Also, the performance of rigid latch vs. nonrigid latch vs. no latch on boosters in crash tests.

I did a search and read MANY threads. There were some nuggets of nice informations but for the most part there was mostly unfounded statements and conjecture.

I am particularly interested in crash test videos, studies, etc. comparing the two.

Anyone else who has a question between the two feel free to add it here. :)
Highback vs backless: An initial CHOP study suggested that there might be a significant difference. A follow-up study said that there was no difference.

The manufacturer(s) of rigid LATCH boosters say that there is a safety benefit to rigid LATCH in a side impact. Celtic already talked about the TC results, which apply to any tightly LATCHed booster.
 

SeattleRain

New member
Even if the only advantage to a HBB is to keep a younger/wiggly child in position, the very fact that it does that would give it an advantage. If a child is more likely to stay in position, then they're more likely to be properly protected in a crash. In the case of an older child/obedient child (for lack of a better word), the gap in safety might not be so pronounced if the child is able to stay in position regardless of the booster they're in. Unfortunately, how well your child is protected in one versus the other is really individual and even dependent on that particular car ride, so I don't know if it's possible to really quantify if a HBB is safer than a LBB overall for all children IF the only advantage is to keep a child in position.

I do not know anything about any increased SIP or whatnot. That's probably something we need more research on. Then you have the case of HBB being the only option for a lot of people who don't have headrests in every position. I was actually really surprised to find out that there are brand new cars that don't have headrests in the middle spot, which is the spot a boostered child might theoretically sit in because they're probably the "least protected" child in many configurations. Yet another case by case safety advantage.
 

Pixels

New member
Even if the only advantage to a HBB is to keep a younger/wiggly child in position, the very fact that it does that would give it an advantage. If a child is more likely to stay in position, then they're more likely to be properly protected in a crash. In the case of an older child/obedient child (for lack of a better word), the gap in safety might not be so pronounced if the child is able to stay in position regardless of the booster they're in. Unfortunately, how well your child is protected in one versus the other is really individual and even dependent on that particular car ride, so I don't know if it's possible to really quantify if a HBB is safer than a LBB overall for all children IF the only advantage is to keep a child in position.

I do not know anything about any increased SIP or whatnot. That's probably something we need more research on. Then you have the case of HBB being the only option for a lot of people who don't have headrests in every position. I was actually really surprised to find out that there are brand new cars that don't have headrests in the middle spot, which is the spot a boostered child might theoretically sit in because they're probably the "least protected" child in many configurations. Yet another case by case safety advantage.

The study I linked above was based on real-world crashes, meaning that it already took into account factors such as keeping a wiggly kid in position and side impacts.
 

Carrie_R

Ambassador - CPS Technician
Somewhere, on YouTube, there is a crash test by a booster mfg that shows the difference in a side impact crash in a HBB vs. a backless. They felt the results are significant enough that they will not sell backless boosters. Of course, like LISmama, I have no link to that, nor can I call the specifics beyond recalling that much. I *think* the booster mfg was Cybex; they have a rep who posts here on the board so I am sure that they will clear it up if I am incorrect. :) I believe it boiled down to keeping the child's neck/spine in alignment throughout the crash sequence. I will go try to find the YT video.

ETA: It is Cybex, here is the link -- they claim 2-3x more forces transferred with a backless.[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJD7_ukUUpA"]Solution X-fix Booster Crash Test: Back versus Backless[/ame] I recall there being more detail given than is attached to that video, but no clue where I read it, so it may be my bias showing through. (I feel pretty strongly about the subject for my own kiddos, but that's based on nothing but my gut.)
 

LISmama810

Admin - CPS Technician
Ah, yes, the Cybex video is interesting.

I think part of the problem, though, is that real-life crashes usually don't mimic crash tests. It's rare to have a TRUE head-on or TRUE side impact.

Typically head-ons are offset, and typically side-impacts come with a frontal element, too (i.e., the car is already moving forward when hit, so there's the side impact, plus the sudden forward stop).

Something that has been suggested by other people here, and that I tend to agree with in theory, is that head wings won't do much good in a side-frontal situation where the child's head is thrown forward of the wings.

Now, does that mean the wings are detrimental? Probably not. There's probably no harm having them, and I can certainly see how there would be a benefit.

Also, is that a situation where having an unLATCHed booster would help, because it would move with the child, making it less likely that the kid's head would be thrown forward of the wings? Maybe. Don't know.
 

emandbri

Well-known member
I'm too tired to find them but after seeing european crash test videos of high back and no back boosters my kids will not use a backless booster until they get too tall for the high back or the belt fits better in the lowback than high back.
 

mimieliza

New member
Curious about this - I would like to travel next summer (by air) and only bring a no back booster for dd. She will be nearly 6 and over 40 lbs.

Sent from my iPhone using Car-Seat.Org
 

firemomof3

New member
The way I think of it is in the event of a crash there is usually several impacts & thus different forces. So, if a child is in a backless there is a better chance that after the initial impact the child will be knocked out of the correct position. Then with the 2nd impact the child will not be correctly positioned. Plus, I do think that side curtain airbags do play a role. My 8y/o is now tall enough to take advantage of the side curtain airbags in my van.
**I have no evidence that any of this is true or not, this is simply how I think of it**
Please chime in with your thoughts :)
 

carseatcoach

Carseat Crankypants
I believe that for a child in position, there's probably very little difference between a highbacked and a backless booster.

But my personal anecdotal (but not insignificant) experience is just as the vast majority of 3yo/30# children is not ready to sit in a highbacked booster, most 4y/40# children are not ready to sit in a backless booster. I prefer the containment of a highbacked booster until 6-7-ish whenever possible (and I realize the definition of "possible" is somewhat subjective -- I wouldn't buy a new car to keep a 6yo out of a backless, but I'd buy three new seats if I had to).
 

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