Help Please 3 yr old won't poop in potty

Mom2nj

Member
They little girl I watch was potty trained pretty successfully the end of March first part of April. She WILL NOT poop on the potty. Won't tell you if she has to go, just poops in her pants when ever and where ever. I suggested to the Mom the end of April to have her clean up the mess, thinking that she would get sick of it, but nope. I talked to S about it and I got the response that she felt she didn't have to poop in to potty. So I relayed that to the Mom so she could talk with her about it... Today she just majorly pooped in her pants. Poop everywhere when she took off her pants. I let her know how upset I was, but I am at my wits end here. I just don't know what to do. Any suggestions.
 
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scatterbunny

New member
Hayley is almost six and still has small poop accidents sometimes (thankfully she doesn't just let go, LOL). She SWEARS she doesn't realize she needs to poop until it's happening. I wonder if this little girl has similar issues? Maybe the need to go pee is easier for her to recognize? 3 is still pretty young. Some kids aren't even potty trained at that age. I wouldn't push her, honestly--although I understand how gross it is to have to clean up someone else's child in this way.
 

Mom2nj

Member
We think she does realize she needs to go, because when she is at home, which is where most poop accidents are, she goes and hides... and here, like today for instence, she got her "stuff", I thought she was doing quiet time before her nap, cuz I had just given her the 15 minute warning, and she goes off by herself and poop, she just disappears on you, and by the time I realize, because I have 3 others to supervise, it's too late... So it's a matter of will at this point. I am running out of suggestions for the Mom... so I thought I would pick some more peoples brains :scratcheshead:
 

Morganthe

New member
They little girl I watch was potty trained pretty successfully the end of March first part of April. She WILL NOT poop on the potty. Won't tell you if she has to go, just poops in her pants when ever and where ever.
I suggested to the Mom the end of April to have her clean up the mess, thinking that she would get sick of it, but nope. I talked to S about it and I got the response that she felt she didn't have to poop in to potty.

I've known a couple of moms who had their children clean up after them to 'teach' them. They were so desperate to try anything by that time. They were much older, both 5-6 years old.

But for a three year old who has very recently learned to potty train... the whole cause/effect (Mess out of potty -- clean up on my own vs. using potty) developmentally, it's much too old for her to understand. It's really really harsh for her and it could set up a control battle you definitely don't want to fight. Nasty, prolonged, and very yucky to you both.

I don't know how old in her 3 years she is (closer to 3 or closer to 4) but a body does not have full sphincter control until just past 36 months. Even then, it's a lot of courage & coordination for a young child to face that loud potty every time to give up something that's part of their body, no matter how us adults view it.

A really helpful book on potty training that helped me to understand the mental & physical process a child goes through for Potty training is:
No Cry Potty Training solution by Elizabeth Pantely. She's very good at explaining how potty training is a long patient process instead of a skill gained immediately.

My dd gave up diapers in the middle of January. Biologically she was 3 years and about 4 months old. We had a lot of conversations before we started about giving up diapers and pooping in the potty. It scared her even though she was eager to do it. She didn't gain full control until April or so. It took her until May to feel comfortable pooping on the potty instead of in her nighttime diaper first thing in the morning. And that was with a lot of positive reinforcement. Even when I was frustrated, I didn't show anything but a "Well, next time, let's do it on the potty." It was very hard sometimes to do that. She's great now, but I still consider the whole potty training incomplete and more like a work in progress. :whistle:


You probably won't like my suggestion. Since she is only 3 and seems to not have ANY interest in #2's on the potty, put her back into diapers/training pants to give you both a break. Incentives do work like stickers or stamps or small cookies. But it sounds like currently, she has no desire to do #2 on the potty with you around. Give yourself a break of a week or two, then start over. It's better than cleaning up icky poop all over the place.

good luck :)
 

Gypsy

Senior Community Member
Sit her on the potty every few hours and have her blow balloons, blowing balloons increases rectal pressure and encourages kids to feel that and recognize it and use the potty.

HTH.
 

fastdogs

New member
my son was like that- we had maybe two days where it looked like he was going to suddenly be potty trained. THen, he pooped in the potty and for some reason it scared him, and he would not go any more in the potty. At daycare, they wanted to move him to the 3 year old room, but only potty trained kids go there. I was apprehensive, but let them move him and sent him to school in underwear (bought new just for this, since he wore pull ups at home). He was suddenly potty trained!
I have no idea what their thought processes must be regarding potty training, but it could be she is frightened somehow by it. I don't have any good ideas, though, since he just sort of did it himself once put in with all the other kids in underwear. But he was really somehow terrified of pooping in the potty, and we had a lot of talks about that, trying to get him to see that it there really wasn't anything scary about it.
vickie
 
I've known a couple of moms who had their children clean up after them to 'teach' them. They were so desperate to try anything by that time. They were much older, both 5-6 years old.

But for a three year old who has very recently learned to potty train... the whole cause/effect (Mess out of potty -- clean up on my own vs. using potty) developmentally, it's much too old for her to understand. It's really really harsh for her and it could set up a control battle you definitely don't want to fight. Nasty, prolonged, and very yucky to you both.

I don't know how old in her 3 years she is (closer to 3 or closer to 4) but a body does not have full sphincter control until just past 36 months. Even then, it's a lot of courage & coordination for a young child to face that loud potty every time to give up something that's part of their body, no matter how us adults view it.

A really helpful book on potty training that helped me to understand the mental & physical process a child goes through for Potty training is:
No Cry Potty Training solution by Elizabeth Pantely. She's very good at explaining how potty training is a long patient process instead of a skill gained immediately.

My dd gave up diapers in the middle of January. Biologically she was 3 years and about 4 months old. We had a lot of conversations before we started about giving up diapers and pooping in the potty. It scared her even though she was eager to do it. She didn't gain full control until April or so. It took her until May to feel comfortable pooping on the potty instead of in her nighttime diaper first thing in the morning. And that was with a lot of positive reinforcement. Even when I was frustrated, I didn't show anything but a "Well, next time, let's do it on the potty." It was very hard sometimes to do that. She's great now, but I still consider the whole potty training incomplete and more like a work in progress. :whistle:

You probably won't like my suggestion. Since she is only 3 and seems to not have ANY interest in #2's on the potty, put her back into diapers/training pants to give you both a break. Incentives do work like stickers or stamps or small cookies. But it sounds like currently, she has no desire to do #2 on the potty with you around. Give yourself a break of a week or two, then start over. It's better than cleaning up icky poop all over the place.

good luck :)

ITA ITA ITA!!! Well put.

The only thing I might suggest differently, is to allow her to stay in her underwear to avoid confusion or regression with wetting. At this stage, the only one with a problem with the poopy pants is the adult (NOT judging-- I've totally BTDT. *Several* times. ;) ), and maybe just having you back off with the pressure and comments and talks etc. will be enough for her to come to terms with this in her own time and way.

My youngest potty-learned this spring, very similarly to Morganthe's. She turned 3 at the end of April, and was only just barely at that point choosing to go poop in the potty instead of her pants. Now she is doing it pretty regularly, but still has a fair few accidents (non-accidental usually-- she *can* hold it but sometimes chooses to mess her pants). I do have her help clean herself up in any way she is capable, but not as a punishment. Just a matter of course. :twocents:
 

LuvBug

New member
children usually poo train after learning to pee train. Since she has just recently learned I wouldnt worry but try to practice with her about that she needs to use the potty and have her sit on it from time to time(the balloons sound interesting lol! Maybe a noise maker or kazoo or something similar would work as well).
 

mominabigtruck

New member
Ds didn't potty train until after he was 3 but then he was doing the whole hiding and pooping thing. Since I knew he knew what he was doing I just took away the tv. He wasn't allowed to watch tv again until he pooped in the potty and if he pooped his pants again it would start all over. He still has little accidents every now and again because unfortunately he has my digestive system, but nothing like deliberately going.
 

Morganthe

New member
children usually poo train after learning to pee train. Since she has just recently learned I wouldnt worry but try to practice with her about that she needs to use the potty and have her sit on it from time to time(the balloons sound interesting lol! Maybe a noise maker or kazoo or something similar would work as well).

Cute Ideas. What also helped with my dd was going ahead and reading a completely unrelated book in the bathroom. She'd get so involved in the story, she'd relax and out everything would come. Unfortunately, that CAN backfire. DH weaves such great imaginative epics that she has no desire to do anything except sit there & listen. Now I just help her on, then tell her I"m giving her 'privacy' and I"ll be back after she says she's ready. :p She's not so eager to sit for 30 minutes in comparison with dh :rolleyes:

Since the OP has care of other children, it might be easier to have them sit out in the hallway 15 or so minutes after lunch to listen while she keeps the little girl company and reading/telling stories in the bathroom. It's gotta be extremely difficult to focus on encouraging her to do her business at the same time taking care of 3? other little ones. My hat's off to you :thumbsup:
 

skaterbabs

Well-known member
But for a three year old who has very recently learned to potty train... the whole cause/effect (Mess out of potty -- clean up on my own vs. using potty) developmentally, it's much too old for her to understand. It's really really harsh for her and it could set up a control battle you definitely don't want to fight. Nasty, prolonged, and very yucky to you both.

...........................

You probably won't like my suggestion. Since she is only 3 and seems to not have ANY interest in #2's on the potty, put her back into diapers/training pants to give you both a break. Incentives do work like stickers or stamps or small cookies. But it sounds like currently, she has no desire to do #2 on the potty with you around. Give yourself a break of a week or two, then start over. It's better than cleaning up icky poop all over the place.

good luck :)

I totally agree.
 

Jeanum

Admin - CPS Technician Emeritus
Staff member
Books were also a big help for DD1. Ironically, I was reading a children's book called "Time to Pee" by Mo Willems to her when she pooped in the toilet for the first time. The book comes with reward stickers, very helpful. :thumbsup:
 

snowbird25ca

Moderator - CPST Instructor
It sounds like a full out control issue to me and I would totally back off on the poop thing. The more you focus on it, the more she's apt to fight it. My dd had full control for months before learning to use the potty. Pee came first, the first time she pooped it was accidental and then she pooped in her panties a few more times before deciding it was worth finding out what her "big treat" would be. :whistle:

She pooped in her panties once after that and since then has only pooped in her potty. I know for her it was just a control/change thing, but once she did it she realized it was nice not to have poop against her bum. ;)

We're facing something similar now with night training, and I have to be mindful of myself... dd wakes up dry pretty much every single morning, but was waiting until right before her night diaper was going to be taken off to pee. We got her some pull-ups and called them night time panties, and she's dry over 80% of the time lately. This morning she peed while cuddling in bed with me, so she still woke up dry...

Anyways, for lots of kids diapers are the last part of being a baby. And while they like the idea of being a big girl or big boy for the most part, it's scary for them to get older and this is an age of wanting to be independent the majority of the time, yet still wanting a bit of dependence. With other kids in the house, she may see the pooping in her pants as a way to get 1 on 1 time because you can't do anything with the other kids while you're cleaning her up.. or maybe it's just another way of asserting her independence - that she'll poop when she wants to poop and not when someone else is trying to get her too.

Anyways, as much as you hate cleaning it up, I'd quit focusing on it. Don't make her feel punished or shamed for pooping in her panties - because making her clean it up is in essence punishing her and trying to make her feel bad about it. Just be matter of fact and while you're cleaning her up you can give positive reinforcement - "Ooops, you pooped in your panties... let's get you cleaned up. You don't have to poop in your panties you know, you could go in your potty if you wanted to. Then we wouldn't have to clean you up and you'd get to keep wearing your "fill in the blank" panties." (princess, dora, whatever...lol, my dd loves picking out what or who is on her panties every morning.) "It feels so much nicer when you don't have that poop stuck to your bum." And then just leave it. If you see her showing signs of having to poop, ask her once, if she says no then just leave it.

Take away the power factor of trying to get her to poop on the toilet, and give her the choice with positive motivation stuck in there. I'm not a fan of rewards for a lot of things, but for potty learning rewards have worked really well. And my dd weaned herself from the rewards - the only time she asks now is when she poops. When she first started she was getting a few smarties every time she peed, now she sometimes even forgets about her treat after we're done wiping her bum after she's pooped.

My thoughts is that kids *want* to use the toilet. They don't really enjoy peeing and pooping in their diapers or pants... but they need to make the decision, and then experience success before it really clicks. She'll do it when she's ready. And I'm betting once she realizes you've dropped it and it's not getting any special attention but more matter-of-fact care, she'll decide to poop in the potty. All it takes is a couple of successes and she'll decide for herself that she likes it. :thumbsup:

In the meantime, hugs coming your way. I felt the frustration too. It's so hard when you know that they know when they have to go, and when they'll hold it until they're in a private place. It's just a matter of creating the circumstances that will let her succeed. And she's still young... she'll figure it out before you know it.
 

jebedyah

New member
It was a control issue for my daughter as well. She's now 32 months, and has been pee trained at school for several months. She had been having accidents at home--mostly, I think, because with two babies we're not as good at reinforcing potty stuff with her as we should be--but in the last three weeks or so even those have stopped.

For poop, though, she REFUSED to poop on the potty. REFUSED. She had enough control to sit on the potty at school for ten minutes, then poop in her underwear as soon as it went back on. Eventually she stopped going at school altogether, but would go at home as soon as her nighttime diaper was on, or her naptime diaper on weekends.

Somewhere in all of this we asked school to stop all poop-on-the-potty comments. It felt like they were putting too much pressure on my daughter, and I felt like we needed to just back off and make it her decision. We went on like that for a few weeks, and then one night right after dinner she started grunting in the kitchen and said she needed to poop. I rushed her down to the potty, and she pooped in it. Since then she's been about 90/10 for potty/diaper. She does get stickers as a reward, but only if she asks for them (we don't offer), and she's definitely asking less than she used to.

Oh, and she insists on being alone in the bathroom, preferably with the door closed, while she poops.

At the same time, she's still not pooping at school. I actually wonder if it's a comfort thing--at home she has a standalone potty on the floor in one bathroom, and a toilet insert + stepstool in the other bathroom. At school they have a kid-sized toilet, but her feet don't quite reach the floor. I wonder if she has trouble going because her feet are dangling, so she has nothing to push against. Her teachers also think the privacy thing is an issue, since legally they can't close the door.

So my suggestions:
1) Back off for a few weeks. If the child is regular about when she goes, consider putting a pull-up on her for those times.
2) Consider whether there's a comfort issue, e.g. support for her feet.
3) If she's disappearing, clearly she wants privacy--again, if she's regular, can you put her on the potty at an appropriate time and leave her there for a few minutes?
 

Morganthe

New member
At school they have a kid-sized toilet, but her feet don't quite reach the floor. I wonder if she has trouble going because her feet are dangling, so she has nothing to push against. Her teachers also think the privacy thing is an issue, since legally they can't close the door.
Too bad they don't have a small step stool, I bet she'd feel much more secure.

Just a suggestion, you might ask the teachers to 'Announce' to your daughter they are turning their back on her to 'give' her privacy. "No one is looking. Pretend I'm not here".

Yeah, I actually stand & face a corner when I'm in a public restroom when my dd is doing #2 if it's not appropriate to leave her alone in the stall. :rolleyes: Or if she's in a room with a single toilet, I stand outside with the door cracked, but tell her I'm only leaving it open a "tiny bit" to hear her when she's ready for me. :whistle:

Sure used to be easier sometimes with a baby :p
 

jebedyah

New member
Too bad they don't have a small step stool, I bet she'd feel much more secure.
They tried it for a little while, but I'm not sure how consistently. It was actually kind of hard to find a stool short enough--she only needs a couple of inches, and most standard stools had her knees up to her chin.

Just a suggestion, you might ask the teachers to 'Announce' to your daughter they are turning their back on her to 'give' her privacy. "No one is looking. Pretend I'm not here".
The teachers can and will actually leave the room. The harder part is keeping the other kids away from the door. The teachers try but invariably someone sneaks back. Or someone else needs to go, and although the teachers try not to put pressure on the kids it sometimes happens anyway (the bathroom is in the classroom, and there's only one toilet).

I'm not too worried, since she does go daily at home. If that wasn't happening then I'd be trying harder to work out the school issues.
 

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