K
Keurigirl
Guest
I just want to warn everyone about using Hawaiian Airlines if you're traveling with a carseat.
I just finished writing up my complaint of the most horrible travel experience I've ever had. We travel frequently and I have a 16 month old and a 4.5 year old. I have never been treated so poorly by an airline for doing nothing other than trying to use a carseat.
If you every fly Hawaiian, make sure your seat has a current FAA approval sticker, and you have a copy of the FAA circular about carseats on airlines (http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC 120-87B.pdf) so you are allowed to install your carseat correctly.
For those of you who want specifics, my complaint about Hawaiian is below.
I had purchased four tickets for my family, including one ticket for my 16 month old baby. I brought his infant car seat to use on the airplane, which
I have done dozens of times before, on many different airlines.
Upon boarding the plane, a flight attendant very rudely stopped me and asked me to prove that my carseat was airline approved. This surprised me, as my carseat is a
very common Graco seat, but I was fine with showing her that it was airline approved.
The FAA sticker on this carseat had fallen off some time ago, and I had never had a need to replace it. In the dozens of trips this carseat has made on airlines I have never ONCE been asked to show this sticker to anyone to prove it was airline approved. I realize Hawaiian has a different policy (or is far more strict than other airlines), therefore I was willing to provide the carseat manual to the flight attendant to show it's airline approval.
When I started to explain to the flight attendant that while I did not have the sticker, I could show her the manual, she told me that if I did not have the sticker they would be confiscating the carseat. She began to get very confrontational, ordered me to my seat, threatened me with an "incident report" and told me someone would be down to speak with me. I was shocked and appalled by this, as I had not been rude, raised my voice, or said anything at all to warrant this type of reaction from the flight attendant.
I went to my seat and opened the manual to the correct page, which explained how to use my carseat on an airplane. I asked another flight attendant to come over and ok the carseat for use, but she very coldly said "I am aware of the situation" and asked me to sit down again. Again, I was shocked by the rude way I was being treated, as I had been nothing but friendly and accommodating to their requirements.
Finally a fourth flight attendant came over, and after a lengthy discussion and a reading of the instruction manual, she said she would allow it's use, but not during takeoff and landing. In addition, she would be writing up an incident report (although I never found out what that meant).
Considering that takeoff and landing are the most obviously dangerous portions of the flight, I pleaded with her, again showing her the manual and reading where it indicated my carseat was airline approved. She finally relented.
Thinking this was finally over, I began installing the carseat into the seat next to me. Within a moment the flight attendant came back and told me I was not allowed to install the carseat rear-facing. Her reasons included that the intructions she just read indicated it needed to be forward-facing, as well as the fact that the person in the row ahead of my son would not be able to recline their seat.
There are two major things wrong with these reasons: One, the instructions clearly say to install the seat as you would install it in a vehicle (rear-facing). Two, this flight was by no means full. There were at least eight seats within four rows of me that were empty, including an entire bulkhead row of five empty seats. The person in front of my son could easily have been moved to another seat, OR my husband would have gladly swapped seats with this person to allow me to install my seat correctly.
However, the flight attendant refused to allow me to install my seat properly, continuing to threaten incident reports and be very rude to me and my husband.
I finally relented and installed my seat incorrectly, afraid that if I protested any further we would be thrown off the airplane.
A few minutes later another flight attendant came back and asked me who would be my lap child, since I was now "taking up a seat with a carseat". I told her no one, because I had purchased four tickets, but she interrupted and talked over me, lecturing me about proper airline travel and how I was "causing trouble" and that I was not allowed to take up more seats than I purchased. When I finally was able to tell her that I had purchased four seats, she demanded to see my tickets.
At that point I was livid with the flight attendants and Hawaiian Airlines. I have never had such a horrible travel experience, all in the name of keeping my child safe.
I was well within my rights to use my carseat on this flight, and be able to install it correctly. I am familiar with the FAA Adisory Circular regarding Use of Child Restraint Systems on Aircraft (http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC 120-87B.pdf). Perhaps Hawaiian Airlines should review this document with their staff, in which it states the following:
1. Section 10-d on page 7, it indicates that no airline can prohibit a child from using an approved carseat when a ticket has been purchased for that child.
2. As stated in section 11 on page 7, an owner's manual is acceptable as proof of safety standards.
3. Section 10-f on page 7 indicates that if an approved carseat does not fit in a particular seat, the aircraft operator has a responsibility to accomodate the
carseat.
I find it horrifying that any flight attendant would attempt to disrupt a parent trying to keep their baby safe while in flight. If my laptop needs to be secure during takeoff and landing, my child should be, too.
The behavior of these flight attendants was appalling, both in the way they spoke to me and the way they handled the situation. I did nothing to warrant this type of treatment. I walked on the airplane with an approved carseat for my baby, and was treated as though I was trying to get away with something horribly illegal. It was so bad that at one point I actually thought I might be either escorted off the airplane, or arrested upon arrival in Maui, or perhaps put on some sort of flight blacklist. All for trying to use a common infant carseat to keep my baby safe during flight.
I have flown dozens of times with this carseat, on many airlines, including Alaska, Delta, United, and British. I have never received any questions or comments, other than compliments from flight attendants who believe it is far safer to fly with a carseat than fly with an infant on your lap.
I have many choices as a consumer when I fly, especially in this economy. The complete lack of customer service and common decency that I received on this flight does not keep customers. I will never fly Hawaiian Airlines again after receiving this kind of treatment. Judging by the plethora of empty seats on both my inbound and outbound flights, it appears I am not the only one making this choice.
I just finished writing up my complaint of the most horrible travel experience I've ever had. We travel frequently and I have a 16 month old and a 4.5 year old. I have never been treated so poorly by an airline for doing nothing other than trying to use a carseat.
If you every fly Hawaiian, make sure your seat has a current FAA approval sticker, and you have a copy of the FAA circular about carseats on airlines (http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC 120-87B.pdf) so you are allowed to install your carseat correctly.
For those of you who want specifics, my complaint about Hawaiian is below.
I had purchased four tickets for my family, including one ticket for my 16 month old baby. I brought his infant car seat to use on the airplane, which
I have done dozens of times before, on many different airlines.
Upon boarding the plane, a flight attendant very rudely stopped me and asked me to prove that my carseat was airline approved. This surprised me, as my carseat is a
very common Graco seat, but I was fine with showing her that it was airline approved.
The FAA sticker on this carseat had fallen off some time ago, and I had never had a need to replace it. In the dozens of trips this carseat has made on airlines I have never ONCE been asked to show this sticker to anyone to prove it was airline approved. I realize Hawaiian has a different policy (or is far more strict than other airlines), therefore I was willing to provide the carseat manual to the flight attendant to show it's airline approval.
When I started to explain to the flight attendant that while I did not have the sticker, I could show her the manual, she told me that if I did not have the sticker they would be confiscating the carseat. She began to get very confrontational, ordered me to my seat, threatened me with an "incident report" and told me someone would be down to speak with me. I was shocked and appalled by this, as I had not been rude, raised my voice, or said anything at all to warrant this type of reaction from the flight attendant.
I went to my seat and opened the manual to the correct page, which explained how to use my carseat on an airplane. I asked another flight attendant to come over and ok the carseat for use, but she very coldly said "I am aware of the situation" and asked me to sit down again. Again, I was shocked by the rude way I was being treated, as I had been nothing but friendly and accommodating to their requirements.
Finally a fourth flight attendant came over, and after a lengthy discussion and a reading of the instruction manual, she said she would allow it's use, but not during takeoff and landing. In addition, she would be writing up an incident report (although I never found out what that meant).
Considering that takeoff and landing are the most obviously dangerous portions of the flight, I pleaded with her, again showing her the manual and reading where it indicated my carseat was airline approved. She finally relented.
Thinking this was finally over, I began installing the carseat into the seat next to me. Within a moment the flight attendant came back and told me I was not allowed to install the carseat rear-facing. Her reasons included that the intructions she just read indicated it needed to be forward-facing, as well as the fact that the person in the row ahead of my son would not be able to recline their seat.
There are two major things wrong with these reasons: One, the instructions clearly say to install the seat as you would install it in a vehicle (rear-facing). Two, this flight was by no means full. There were at least eight seats within four rows of me that were empty, including an entire bulkhead row of five empty seats. The person in front of my son could easily have been moved to another seat, OR my husband would have gladly swapped seats with this person to allow me to install my seat correctly.
However, the flight attendant refused to allow me to install my seat properly, continuing to threaten incident reports and be very rude to me and my husband.
I finally relented and installed my seat incorrectly, afraid that if I protested any further we would be thrown off the airplane.
A few minutes later another flight attendant came back and asked me who would be my lap child, since I was now "taking up a seat with a carseat". I told her no one, because I had purchased four tickets, but she interrupted and talked over me, lecturing me about proper airline travel and how I was "causing trouble" and that I was not allowed to take up more seats than I purchased. When I finally was able to tell her that I had purchased four seats, she demanded to see my tickets.
At that point I was livid with the flight attendants and Hawaiian Airlines. I have never had such a horrible travel experience, all in the name of keeping my child safe.
I was well within my rights to use my carseat on this flight, and be able to install it correctly. I am familiar with the FAA Adisory Circular regarding Use of Child Restraint Systems on Aircraft (http://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC 120-87B.pdf). Perhaps Hawaiian Airlines should review this document with their staff, in which it states the following:
1. Section 10-d on page 7, it indicates that no airline can prohibit a child from using an approved carseat when a ticket has been purchased for that child.
2. As stated in section 11 on page 7, an owner's manual is acceptable as proof of safety standards.
3. Section 10-f on page 7 indicates that if an approved carseat does not fit in a particular seat, the aircraft operator has a responsibility to accomodate the
carseat.
I find it horrifying that any flight attendant would attempt to disrupt a parent trying to keep their baby safe while in flight. If my laptop needs to be secure during takeoff and landing, my child should be, too.
The behavior of these flight attendants was appalling, both in the way they spoke to me and the way they handled the situation. I did nothing to warrant this type of treatment. I walked on the airplane with an approved carseat for my baby, and was treated as though I was trying to get away with something horribly illegal. It was so bad that at one point I actually thought I might be either escorted off the airplane, or arrested upon arrival in Maui, or perhaps put on some sort of flight blacklist. All for trying to use a common infant carseat to keep my baby safe during flight.
I have flown dozens of times with this carseat, on many airlines, including Alaska, Delta, United, and British. I have never received any questions or comments, other than compliments from flight attendants who believe it is far safer to fly with a carseat than fly with an infant on your lap.
I have many choices as a consumer when I fly, especially in this economy. The complete lack of customer service and common decency that I received on this flight does not keep customers. I will never fly Hawaiian Airlines again after receiving this kind of treatment. Judging by the plethora of empty seats on both my inbound and outbound flights, it appears I am not the only one making this choice.
