Britax response to harness vs. booster

Angela

New member
*Mods please keep here, since I am linking it to a FB discussion I've been having and want to make sure everyone can see it. Let me know if that's not alright.*

I've been having a nice discussion on a group I belong to on FB about the harness vs. booster debate with older children. One person wondered why car seat manufacturers are producing these high weight harnessed seats, when most of us say that boosters are okay for kids over 4 and 40. I emailed Sarah at Britax, to see what she had to say. I thought she gave a good response. I figured some here might want to see it along with the FB members I wanted to share with. Here was her response:

'Higher weight harnessed seats are being driven by consumer demand. Technicians are doing such a good job of educating caregivers that 5-point harnesses help to retain the body in the vehicle better than a 3-point. If you look at many of the CRSs on the market today (regardless of manufacturer) they all have similarities in some way of a NASCAR vehicle seat – maybe 5-points harnesses, side impact protection in the head and/or torso area. Granted, we don’t all drive as fast as NASCAR drivers do every Sunday, but the end result is the same – retention in the vehicle. As well, many parents do not understand the performance difference when moving their child from a harness to a booster. As you know – that child must sit upright and in position consistently the entire ride to be properly protected.

You have many children who are of a heavier weight at a younger age (we know all 40 lb. children are not physically built the same, regardless of age or height as well) and the maturity level of children will play a part of selecting a 5-point harness over a belt positioning booster. There is then information developing as people realize that a high back with some type of side impact protection is better than a backless booster: kids fall asleep, fall out of position, sleep against doors and c-pillars in the deployment zone of side/curtain airbags.'
 
ADS

mylittlet

Senior Community Member
Good job asking. Sarah and Britax do good about answering questions. Does everyone in the fb group understand?

Stefanie - CPStech in Iowa
 

Angela

New member
Good job asking. Sarah and Britax do good about answering questions. Does everyone in the fb group understand?

Stefanie - CPStech in Iowa

I believe everyone is understanding the different positions well. It's been a good discussion with good points on both sides.
 

An Aurora

Senior Community Member
I think it's misleading for them to use the NASCAR line since know that's apples and oranges.
 

Morganthe

New member
I think it's misleading for them to use the NASCAR line since know that's apples and oranges.

Just out of curiosity, what speeds DO Nascar drivers run at? :scratcheshead:

I have no clue, honestly. I just know that my regular autobahn/autoroute speeds average around 130-150kph. I"m often passed by much faster car, so I'm not really that unusual. I have a Britax Regent used daily by my dd, so maybe she'd reconsider her statement that parents don't drive at or near Nascar speeds :whistle: :duck:
 

An Aurora

Senior Community Member
Well Sarah is with Britax USA so I'm sure they don't consider the Autobahn. I was referring more to the HANS device.
 

Morganthe

New member
Well Sarah is with Britax USA so I'm sure they don't consider the Autobahn. I was referring more to the HANS device.


HANS device? what's that?

Besides, it's not just overseas where there's legal fast driving -- Montana has no daytime speed limits on the open interstate. ;) (unless they changed it within the past few years. :scratcheshead:)
 

TechnoGranola

Forum Ambassador
Just out of curiosity, what speeds DO Nascar drivers run at? :scratcheshead:

Depends on the track. Talladega is the fastest track and speeds average just over 300 km/hr (so top speed is higher). I think the slowest tracks average just over 150 km/hr. Then other tracks have ranges in between.

The Hans device holds their head back so it doesn't while forward with the rest of their body restrained. It started to be used after Dale Earnheardt died I believe, because his injuries were a result of his shoulders and body being restrained but his head not being held.
 

safeinthecar

Moderator - CPS Technician
The NASCAR analogy is incorrect more for the structure of the vehicle than in the speed of the vehicle. NASCAR cars have very small driver compartments and an extremely rigid frame. There are no crush or crumple zones in the cage and no margin of error. NASCAR harnesses are also different than car seat or even seat belt webbing. There is no stretch and they are not designed to give ride down time. There's no room for ride down. There is literally only inches of space around the driver.

Passenger cars have energy management crush zones, and room to allow enough stretch in the restraint system to redirect a lot of the energy of the crash away from the occupant.
 

DahliaRW

New member
I agree that NASCAR shouldn't even be a comparison. Their harnesses function totally differently. As mentioned, there is HANS and different webbing. It also is attached to the FRAME of the car, not secured via seatbelt or LATCH like a car seat.
 

Angela

New member
My take on her response and the NASCAR analogy is just that... it's an analogy. She's not saying that kids have to be in NASCAR seats, but that car seats are modeled after the look and function of NASCAR seats. Which is exactly what parents are looking for. Just my :twocents:
 

erikanohelani

New member
My choice in harnessing longer will be based on maturity level as she discussed.

She makes a great point because all 4lb 4yo are are not automatically booster ready at the same time.

While my 4yo son does not fall asleep in the car often, my nephew who is just 3 months older always does.

The NASCAR comparison may not be based strictly on safety comparisons from a Britax design point, but from a marketing standpoint. Many parents do make that comparison, even though they are totally different scenarios and conditions.
 

Kat_Momof3

New member
I liked her analogy... and honestly, unless there was no affordable option that fit my vehicle and child, I would not put a 4yr old child (even over 40lbs) in a booster... I prefer 5yo as a spare, 6yo as primary... and those are my comfort zones... maybe not minimums... I still think of 4yo as the spare minimum... and 5yo as the primary seat minimum... but I try to always go above the minimums with kids...

not everyone can, and I get that... so I'm glad there are boosters like the turbo and dreamtime that accomodate those that have to use them earlier than we would like.

I also don't think we have to harness inevitably... I think somewhere around 5-7yo is fine... but I don't think it's bad to continue harnessing after that, of course.
 

Baylor

New member
My take on her response and the NASCAR analogy is just that... it's an analogy. She's not saying that kids have to be in NASCAR seats, but that car seats are modeled after the look and function of NASCAR seats. Which is exactly what parents are looking for. Just my :twocents:

Yep, that is what I got too. Thanks so much for posting it. I don't take the nascar analogy as a literal comparison. I take it as, We know that keeping children in their seat during a crash is vital and the 5 pt harness is going to get that done every time where as with a booster there are more variables that may not keep one in their seat.
 

leighi123

Active member
I don't know if it will actually happen, but I did send a "request" to a family member for crash test data regarding this issue.

My family has worked for a place that does crash tests for a looong time now (like sense Ford first started), and he has connections with the people that decide what crash tests are done, so he forwarded my questions direct to them.


Its interesting because I never knew he had anything to do with carseats, he comes for a visit and it comes up, and turns out he has this connection, and connections with Britax in Sweden (he was trying to tell ME why ERF is better not knowing Levi was RFing still). Hopefully he can help out with some stuff.
 

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