Tether part # for 2002 Grand Caravan

mommy2zander+baby

Senior Community Member
ummm.. consider an accident that dislodged that rear seat from it's position at all. even if the seat your child seat is in is stationary, that rear seat could rip your child seat apart. I assume that's why all proper teathers are attatched to the structure of the car that isn't going to move... bad bad idea in my mind.

All van factory tether anchors I have ever seen were attached to the seat in the rear behind/under the butt of the seat... so this setup is no different then the factory setup...

I also don't understand where you are coming from... Are you saying that if the van seat were to become unattached from the van, you'd want the tether attached to the frame, thinking this would keep the child safe? I have heard a similar argument about putting children in a tethered seat if you are worried about your seatbelts failing, but I don't know that this is a great argument either... The tether is not made to replace the main support holding the child seat in the car, only to reduce head excursion... (from my understanding :eek: )
 
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stevel

New member
rediculous was probably the wrong word, sorry about that.

the whole idea seems odd to me because cars, as far as I know all anchor to a fixed point, like a bolt into the body, or a fastened part of the rear shelf, something like that. so to attatch it to another seat, removable no less, just seems wrong to me. but if that's what they tell you to do......
 

CDNTech

Senior Community Member
rediculous was probably the wrong word, sorry about that.

the whole idea seems odd to me because cars, as far as I know all anchor to a fixed point, like a bolt into the body, or a fastened part of the rear shelf, something like that. so to attatch it to another seat, removable no less, just seems wrong to me. but if that's what they tell you to do......

Actually the majority of vehicles top tethers are attached to the back of the vehicle seat in all new vehicles... it's really only sedans that have the top tether bolt attached to the shelf and a few small suvs that still have it attached to the roof.

Most vans, suvs, trucks, hathcbacks all have the top tether anchor attached to the back of the vehicle seat.

The top tether is to reduce head excursion, it does not hold the carseat in in the event of an accident. That is the job of the lower anchors OR seatbelt.

When you install a carseat, you install using the lower anchors OR seatbelt, then you test for movement. Once you have a solid install (less than 1" movement at the belt path both side to side and front to back), THEN you attach the top tether.

Hope that clears this confusion up a little for you.
 

stevel

New member
interesting......

but then why does skaterbabscps say....

hmmmm....okay.....retrofit tethers are usually bolts that attach to a metal piece welded into the vehicle structural supports. I would not be willing to trust that setup.
I question the would not be willing to trust that setup, if what the rest of you are saying is true?

I still tend to agree with her.
 

wondering1

New member
Funny thing is that this vehicle has dangerous seatbelts to begin with. They are called Gen3 seatbelts and they are very questionable.

The front seatbelts are Gen4 and are safe. The rear seatbelts are Gen3 and will unlatch easily if debris hits the orange release.

Press a bouncy ball into the front seatbelt release and try the same on the rear seatbelts and you will see a huge difference. it is very shocking.

I find it interesting that this issue isn't mentioned to everyone who owns an affected vehicle.
 

wondering1

New member
wondering1...... I thought about that too. but I figured I was being too negative as it was. :(

Information is power. When one has information, they can make the best decisions possible for their unique situation. I see people splitting hairs over seemingly minor details when there are other big issues...like talking on the cell phone, even hands free, or having Gen3 belts. If you are an attentive and safe driver, what is the next big problem with your vehicle safety?
 

CDNTech

Senior Community Member
interesting......

but then why does skaterbabscps say....


I question the would not be willing to trust that setup, if what the rest of you are saying is true?

I still tend to agree with her.

I am not positive why this particular retrofit anchors are the way they are... I am also used to retrofit anchors being bolted into a predrilled location in the vehicle, generally the floor.

I just wanted to point out that most anchors in vehicles newer than 2002 are not on the floor anymore.

It may be that it's a newer vehicle and tethers have been tested to be used/retrofitted in that location... whereas older vehicles (which are generally the ones being retrofitted) are not tested with those locations and are tested with the bolt in the floor location.

I would just prefer to buy a vehicle and have tether anchors installed in all possible child restraint locations in the vehicle... if only we lived in a perfect world. :D
 

CDNTech

Senior Community Member
Funny thing is that this vehicle has dangerous seatbelts to begin with. They are called Gen3 seatbelts and they are very questionable.

The front seatbelts are Gen4 and are safe. The rear seatbelts are Gen3 and will unlatch easily if debris hits the orange release.

Press a bouncy ball into the front seatbelt release and try the same on the rear seatbelts and you will see a huge difference. it is very shocking.

I find it interesting that this issue isn't mentioned to everyone who owns an affected vehicle.

I don't think it's fair to assume that people with these vehicles don't know they have Gen3 seatbelts or that they are unsafe.

Often you don't find out these issues until after you have bought the vehicle and then you need to make do with what you have.

We very rarely use the seatbelts in the back of our '03 Grand Caravan and I can't honestly tell you if they are Gen3 or not. My seats are installed with LATCH and we don't use the other spots in the van.

Our lease is up next May and then I plan to get a new, safer vehicle that I can feel good about using the seatbelts in.
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
I wouldn't trust that UNLESS I knew it was a Specific Canadian part that the US dealer was able to get ahold of. I trust the LATCH manual more than dealers, honestly.

:)
 

wondering1

New member
My point is that the members of this community need to educate owners of 1993-2003 Dodge, Jeep, Chrysler, etc, vehicles that they likely have Gen3 belts. I didn't know about it until I started researching installing a seat in our 1993 Dodge. I always felt that putting a car seat in that car was unwise, call it intuition, but years later I finally found out why!
 

skaterbabs

Well-known member
Unfortunately, short of buying a different vehicle, there isn't much you can do if you have a vehicle with Gen3 seatbelts. I have one, I know exactly what's involved. It would cost more then the car is worth to replace the belts and financially that's just not an option. People who have these vehicles already generally can't afford the retrofits, and often people buying these vehicles are getting them cheaper than they could get a similar vehicle with regular belts. So the somewhat judgemental attitude isn't helpful. People who don't know generally aren't going to avoid the vehicles, and people who find out afterwards certainly as a rule won't be able to to just buy a new car when they find out.
The safest way to deal with these belts when replacement of belt/vehicle is not an option is to limit projectiles.
 

wondering1

New member
Skater, so you've decided to keep this information to yourself because you've decided that it would be less stressful for the people involved? How about airplane seats for under 2 year olds? We discuss that all the time!

I don't like the idea of not mentioning something because it doesn't help anyone.

If we get enough people to report to NHTSA and the manufacturers, our voice will be heard! The car must be newer than 10 years old for the NHTSA to follow-up, so my car wasn't helpful when I called.

I tried to get the information in a Sticky on the board, but that hasn't happened.
 

skaterbabs

Well-known member
Who said anything about keeping the information to myself? The FACTS are that the failures are not actually occurring that often (especially when you consider just how many of these vehicles are on the road, and how many crashes there are on a daily basis), replacing the belts is cost prohibitive, and there's literally NOTHING that can be done because Dodge will only replace them with the SAME belts anyway. If there was going to be a recall, there would have been one already.

The only thing that can minimize the risk is to reduce projectiles. Flipping the buckle backewards may or may not help. Panicing parents who cannot afford to repalce their vehicle or retrofit belts doesn't help, and that's what your attitude on this subject seems to be.

Riding in a car is a risky proposition in the first place. We are here to reduce the risks in the best way we can. Few people have the ability to replace a car becvause of Gen 3 belts - and that won't make a difference in getting the belts off the road anyway.
 

wondering1

New member
I am giving information not hysterics. We do not know how many people have been injured in accidents due to these seatbelts. Do we have access to 1993-2003 vehicles involved in car accidents so that we can find the ones where the passenger was not using their seatbelt or the carseat was not installed properly? We would have to pull all those cases and have them reexamined to find out if Gen3 belts were the cause.

Lawsuit losses preceeded Chrysler moving forward to Gen4 seatbelts - partially in 2003 and totally in 2004 onward.

Check out this article: http://www.kirotv.com/weblinks/2148969/detail.html


In my case, it was a choice to use the affected vehicle or not. Intuition kept me from allowing the car to be used until I found facts years later to back up that intuition.

With information, people can make the best decisions possible for their unique situation. Withholding information helps no one.
 

skaterbabs

Well-known member
You keep insisting that we're withholding information, but we're NOT. If there were as many injuries as you seem to think, there would have been a recall.

You asked for statistics. I don't have them handy, but there is a record of every crash reported to the authorities, and those records include the make, model and year of the vehicle(s) involved, as well as whether or not any injuries occurred.

Also, the unsafebelts.com website? Is run by a personal-injury law firm. It's in their best interests to have as many people as possible suing Chrysler. While I agree the belts are problematic, the source of much of the information is not an unbiased one.
 

skaterbabs

Well-known member
Who said anything about it being a non-issue? I've given the information many times - you are sitting there making assumptions and being abrasive and rude.
 

wondering1

New member
You are saying that most people are not in a position to do anything about their Gen3 seatbelt vehicle. That they usually have no options or choices. What do you base that on? From your own experience?

You also say that it is not a real danger because no recall has ever been made.

I agree that there are no easy answers to this issue. I do not feel that nothing can be done about the situation. And I feel that knowledge is power and that people need this information so that they can make informed choices about their unique circumstances.
 

stevel

New member
easy answer. get people to avoid chrysler products. go Honda. they have recalled seat belts before, and they warranty seat belt parts for the LIFE of the vehicle. if you had a 1985 accord with 300,000 miles and a seat belt didn't work properly, it's still covered under warranty. proof that some manufacturers care more about your safety and the importance of seat belts than others. :thumbsup: that's my :twocents: anyways.
 

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