Safe, Safer, Safest...

Baylor

New member
Anyone else struggle with this? I know my children are safe.. Good seats, installed right, appropriate for age...

HOWEVER.. I just have this need to make them safer.. And I wonder if it is realistic..

I think Safest is relative.. because it can depend on so much... I just don't know if it is attainable???
 
ADS

ketchupqueen

CPST and ketchup snob
Staff member
I make my kids the safest they can be in any given situation. That means sometimes, they're not in the ideal situation, but it's the best I can do. So that's what matters.
 

munchkin

Active member
Child passenger safety is super-important to me, but so is sanity and balance. Keeping my household budget is important. Not alienating friends is important. Not making my child scared to ride in a vehicle is important. There is a point where good enough is good enough.

THis is a wonderful way to explain it! It makes weighing the pros and cons of certain seats and situations a little easier.
 

Holly

New member
I agree. I do what I can do practically and affordably.
My oldest turned at 1 year because I didn't know better. I bought a radian for her at 2 because I wanted to harness her longer than her seat at the time could do but I couldn't afford a Britax. I knew nothing else about the radian, only that it could harness as long as Britax and it was cheaper.
I found this site by googling "radian", I loved my seat and wanted to tell people about it in reviews and such.

From here I learned about ERF so I turned her back around at 2.
She RF'd to 3, at that point I was comfortable with her FFing (and at the time dh wasn't as on board with ERF as he is now. I told him at the time that I'd turn her FFing at 3 if he let me RF her again at 2).

With my 2nd, she was 32 lbs at 25 months and it was also the middle of winter and I was 8 months pregnant. She was nearing the RF weight limit on all the seats we had at the time and it was getting harder for me to lift her in.
We decided to go ahead and FF her, it made the most sense in our situation. There were not seats with 40 lb RF weight limits yet, so we'd be buying a seat just for 2 extra lbs, it wasn't worth it.
 

jjordan

Moderator
Riding in a car is just dangerous (compared to most other normal, every day activities). So safEST would be to never go anywhere. But that's obviously not realistic. So, as with most other things in life, you have to find the right balance. Then once you have made your careful, thoughtful decision (about what seat to get, or whatever), you just have to stop thinking about it and rest in the fact that you made a good decision. Obviously if something happens that prompts you to re-think your decision (seat gets recalled or whatever), then you re-think. But you can't be constantly re-thinking everything or you'll drive yourself crazy. :)

Case in point - my dd is currently riding in a FF Britax Boulevard. It is installed correctly, top tethered, and she fits it just fine. But every so often, someone brings up the transport Canada tests with the forward facing marathons. A long thread ensues where people weigh in on how they perceive the safety of forward facing Britax (classic) convertibles. And you know what, I could drive myself crazy if I re-hashed the decision each time one of these threads came up. But instead, I thought through the decision very carefully the first time I heard of the issue, and now when it comes up again, I remind myself that I have made a good decision and I don't need to go through that process again.
 

rodentranger

New member
Child passenger safety is super-important to me, but so is sanity and balance. Keeping my household budget is important. Not alienating friends is important. Not making my child scared to ride in a vehicle is important. There is a point where good enough is good enough.

Exactly.
Safe is using an appropriate restraint for the children in my vehicle and for my children in other people's vehicles.
Safer is using best practice to rf my children as long as possible and harness them until it's appropriate to booster them.
Safest might be to never leave the house. It might be importing seats from Sweden and riving a Volvo. I don't know. I'm okay with doing what I can within my budget and in my current situation.
 

HayleyCPST

New member
That's why I try to not use those words!! They are a bit relative.

The kids I nanny for are safe in my car. One is RF, one in a booster. Properly trained and harnessed. Yet, I don't have airbags. So, yeah I could be safer in a car with airbags. But I can't just go out and buy a new car because it's safer. I can't afford it!

So, I make all the passengers as safe as they can be in this situation. We all wear our seat belts. The kids are booster trained. I have a RF seat that goes up to a high weight, might as well use it!

Everyone knows that rear facing is safer for everyone. Adults are safer rear facing. If you have the money to buy a seat for your kid to rear face more in, then go ahead. If you don't want to spend the 200 bucks, I don't blame you. But just know that he is *safe* in his harnessed seat. It's installed correctly, he's harnessed correctly, I hope you are a safe driver. You've conquered all of the issues that we see with misuse.

ETA: even if you stay at home, you could fall down the stairs or hit your head in the shower... KWIM? So, then hold the handrail and get a bath mat!
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
I try to keep them safe from what I consider big risks. The difficulty comes when you've already reduced a particular risk to the order of being hit by lightning or something and then you have to consider the cost, time and stress of making them even safer.

We all know that motor vehicle crashes have historically been the #1 killer of young kids (soon to be surpassed by drowning due to decreasing traffic fatalities). But, by far the majority of these deaths happen to kids who are unrestrained, improperly restrained or driving with an impaired driver. For kids who are correctly restrained in the back seat within the restrictions of the owners manual of their child seat and vehicle, are riding with an unimpaired driver and are in a vehicle made in the last decade or so, their risk is probably very low to be severely injured in a crash.

Safe: 4 year old, 40 pound child buclked correctly in a $20 backless booster in a 2000 Ford Windstar, driving around on routine errands around town. Driver is unimpaired and undistracted. This child is probably in the top few percent of kids on the road in terms of safety and is going to survive all but the most severe crashes, perhaps even those that would kill adult passengers in front.

Safer: Same driver and child, riding rear-facing an expensive convertible seat in a 2010 Honda Odyssey. Sure, this kid is probably now in the top 1% of kids in terms of crash safety, maybe even 2x safer than the other child, but probably not all that much safer than before in absolute terms. Two times a risk that is close to zero is still a risk that is close to zero.

Safest: Kid is not driven anywhere. Stays home in a plastic bubble.
 

Baylor

New member
Riding in a car is just dangerous (compared to most other normal, every day activities). So safEST would be to never go anywhere. But that's obviously not realistic. So, as with most other things in life, you have to find the right balance. Then once you have made your careful, thoughtful decision (about what seat to get, or whatever), you just have to stop thinking about it and rest in the fact that you made a good decision. Obviously if something happens that prompts you to re-think your decision (seat gets recalled or whatever), then you re-think. But you can't be constantly re-thinking everything or you'll drive yourself crazy. :)

Case in point - my dd is currently riding in a FF Britax Boulevard. It is installed correctly, top tethered, and she fits it just fine. But every so often, someone brings up the transport Canada tests with the forward facing marathons. A long thread ensues where people weigh in on how they perceive the safety of forward facing Britax (classic) convertibles. And you know what, I could drive myself crazy if I re-hashed the decision each time one of these threads came up. But instead, I thought through the decision very carefully the first time I heard of the issue, and now when it comes up again, I remind myself that I have made a good decision and I don't need to go through that process again.

Great points..

That's why I try to not use those words!! They are a bit relative.

The kids I nanny for are safe in my car. One is RF, one in a booster. Properly trained and harnessed. Yet, I don't have airbags. So, yeah I could be safer in a car with airbags. But I can't just go out and buy a new car because it's safer. I can't afford it!

So, I make all the passengers as safe as they can be in this situation. We all wear our seat belts. The kids are booster trained. I have a RF seat that goes up to a high weight, might as well use it!

Everyone knows that rear facing is safer for everyone. Adults are safer rear facing. If you have the money to buy a seat for your kid to rear face more in, then go ahead. If you don't want to spend the 200 bucks, I don't blame you. But just know that he is *safe* in his harnessed seat. It's installed correctly, he's harnessed correctly, I hope you are a safe driver. You've conquered all of the issues that we see with misuse.

ETA: even if you stay at home, you could fall down the stairs or hit your head in the shower... KWIM? So, then hold the handrail and get a bath mat!

Good post..
I don't want anyone to think I am freaking out or all worked up. I am not. just wondering what people's thoughts were on the subject.
I agree there is never a safest or for sure safe option..
 

LISmama810

Admin - CPS Technician
Safer: Same driver and child, riding rear-facing an expensive convertible seat in a 2010 Honda Odyssey. Sure, this kid is probably now in the top 1% of kids in terms of crash safety, maybe even 2x safer than the other child, but probably not all that much safer than before in absolute terms. Two times a risk that is close to zero is still a risk that is close to zero.

I largely agree with Darren but I am going to nitpick the implication that an "expensive" seat is better than a cheaper one. Sometimes that might be true--EPS foam, or features that increase ease of use and therefore minimize possible misuse, blah, blah, blah.

But sometimes it's just the opposite. I'll personally take a Snugride--heck, even a rear-adjust Snugride--over a Primo Viaggio any day.
 

SafeDad

CPSDarren - Admin
Staff member
That was kind of the point. Expensive may not make much of a difference, if any;-)
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
I ponder daily how to put my seats, which seats to have, how to keep my older kids in the safest positions. Then I do eventually let it go.

But...

Darren said unimpaired. Which also means not on a cell phone or bluetooth http://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/news/top_three/article_dcab06b6-6614-11df-9e65-001cc4c03286.html or eating a cheeseburger or driving while sleepy, not just drunk :eek: Vehicle maintenance can also be a factor (think: tire maintenance can prevent a blowout on the freeway)

So safEST does depend on other factors than what seat your kid is in...you have to use your noodle to consider all of them :thumbsup:
 

Baylor

New member
I ponder daily how to put my seats, which seats to have, how to keep my older kids in the safest positions. Then I do eventually let it go.

But...

Darren said unimpaired. Which also means not on a cell phone or bluetooth http://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/news/top_three/article_dcab06b6-6614-11df-9e65-001cc4c03286.html or eating a cheeseburger or driving while sleepy, not just drunk :eek: Vehicle maintenance can also be a factor (think: tire maintenance can prevent a blowout on the freeway)

So safEST does depend on other factors than what seat your kid is in...you have to use your noodle to consider all of them :thumbsup:

My brother always says save money elsewhere and get the best tires and brakes you can afford. It makes a difference.. Keep them at the right pressure and check them often..

All great points.
 

tl01

New member
Child passenger safety is super-important to me, but so is sanity and balance. Keeping my household budget is important. Not alienating friends is important. Not making my child scared to ride in a vehicle is important. There is a point where good enough is good enough.

Love this... But what would you say to a friend with a 4 year old in a NBB.
 

urchin_grey

New member
I largely agree with Darren but I am going to nitpick the implication that an "expensive" seat is better than a cheaper one. Sometimes that might be true--EPS foam, or features that increase ease of use and therefore minimize possible misuse, blah, blah, blah.

But sometimes it's just the opposite. I'll personally take a Snugride--heck, even a rear-adjust Snugride--over a Primo Viaggio any day.

I totally loved my rear adjust SR22. :D

(I still don't get the difficulties people had with them. I figured it out without even reading the manual.) :whistle:
 

cpsaddict

New member
I tend to get myself all worked up when certain threads come up, but I really have to remember that I am doing the best I can for MY family and MY child. I do what I can with the resources I have to make her as safe as I can. Sometimes, she is safe and sometimes she is the safER. Yet other times, she is safEST(staying home).
 

Splash

New member
For several years, I drove a vehicle I hated. Hated. HATED. But I bought it (hated it when I bought it) because it was among the safest things on the road. And it was safe. Very safe. And you know what made it super duper duper safe? I was never in a wreck. So it was no more safe than a Yugo, because I never had to use its safety features.
Eventually, I couldn't stand it anymore, and bought a car I loved. One I had loved when I bought the one I hated, but was blinded by safety. So I bought the one that only has 4 stars rear side impact. And yes, there are days this bothers me. But I still haven't wrecked. And as long as I don't wreck, it doesn't matter.
Eventually, I had to go from "super safe barreling at 70 miles per hour in a hot metal box that I hate" to "very safe barreling at 70 miles per hour in a hot metal box that I like." Actually liking my vehicle was more important to me than the statistically insignificant safety differences, safety differences that don't even exist unless I am t-boned.

Get the best seat you can afford, put it in the best vehicle you can afford, maintain it well, and be a good driver. Your driving skills are WAY more important than Cosco versus Britax or Ford versus Toyota.
 

Car-Seat.Org Facebook Group

Forum statistics

Threads
219,656
Messages
2,196,898
Members
13,530
Latest member
onehitko860

You must read your carseat and vehicle owner’s manual and understand any relevant state laws. These are the rules you must follow to restrain your children safely. All opinions at Car-Seat.Org are those of the individual author for informational purposes only, and do not necessarily reflect any policy or position of Carseat Media LLC. Car-Seat.Org makes no representations as to accuracy, completeness, currentness, suitability, or validity of any information on this site and will not be liable for any errors, omissions, or delays in this information or any losses, injuries, or damages arising from its display or use. All information is provided on an as-is basis. If you are unsure about information provided to you, please visit a local certified technician. Before posting or using our website you must read and agree to our TERMS.

Graco is a Proud Sponsor of Car-Seat.Org! Britax is a Proud Sponsor of Car-Seat.Org! Nuna Baby is a Proud Sponsor of Car-Seat.Org!

Please  Support Car-Seat.Org  with your purchases of infant, convertible, combination and boosters seats from our premier sponsors above.
Shop travel systems, strollers and baby gear from Britax, Chicco, Clek, Combi, Evenflo, First Years, Graco, Maxi-Cosi, Nuna, Safety 1st, Diono & more! ©2001-2022 Carseat Media LLC

Top