spoke with Russ about SL trouble

mayamac · Oct 5, 2010

Hey you guys- I entered another complaint on the SK website about how I can't keep my 80SL installed because the LATCH adjuster gets loosened by dd's foot and dd's foot also unbuckles the seat belt install, plus with the seat belt the car seat leans to the side.

guess what? He called me!

He "had never heard of this before" but seemed really nice

He had me install with LATCH, then use the seat belt locking thing (I keep forgetting what this is called) on the tail of the LATCH strap. What do you guys think of that?

I tried it out- the seat does not have the cover on currently, but I was excited to see if this would work. I took pictures. It does not loosen, but I'm not sure about it, and I can move it a bit. Not a ton, but I know know how much is too much movement. see my pix...

http://s291.photobucket.com/albums/ll288/christysmail0/car seat/

ketchupqueen · Oct 5, 2010

He had you put a locking clip on the tail of the LATCH strap. Um, no, that is NOT a solution I'd consider safe. It's the same as using a locking clip on a lap-only belt with tail, which is something we are taught not to do. And, the locking clip, which is not likely to hold it from loosening severely under crash forces anyway, being a pre-crash positioner, is also way too far from the "buckle" (in this case, LATCH strap adjuster) even if it was (supposed to be no more than 1/2-1 inch from the buckle of a lap/shoulder belt ONLY.)

This is not good advice and I wouldn't feel safe taking it with my own kid.

Russ is not an engineer, and he is not a tech. And I REALLY REALLY wish he'd stop telling parents to do stuff like this!

jess71903 · Oct 5, 2010

UGH! NO NO NO!! You can use a locking clip on a lap/shoulder belt because it just holds the seat tight until the crash, when the locking mechanism kicks in. In a lap belt, and that latch strap, the locking mechanism IS the latchplate, or adjuster.

mayamac · Oct 5, 2010

well darn- and I even broke a nail doing that!

mommy-medic · Oct 5, 2010

...... Not to mention that adding a locking clip doesn't fix the actual problem.....:thumbsdown:

Carrie_R · Oct 5, 2010

That's really absurd.

Do you need a SL strap? Can you ask them to send you a non-SL strap, with the push-button adjuster? That should get you through until the seat will be used FF, when you can go back to using the SL (if you so desire) since no one will be stepping on it FF.

mayamac · Oct 5, 2010

I guess I don't need a non-SL. The dd is getting close to 40#, she is probably about 35# now. I bought the seat thinking I would pass it down to the new baby, but then I miscarried

I guess I'll just use the seat belt with the buckle twisted around.

How do you use the locking clip to help keep the seat belt install from tilting to the side?

ketchupqueen · Oct 5, 2010

Using a locking clip to stop tilting only works with a lap/shoulder belt that locks at the retractor. When you have that problem, if it works, you can use a locking clip instead of locking the retractor, to lock the belt. It won't help for belts that lock at the latchplate. Also, with Radians, in some cars there's a locking clip incompatibility (like in mine. Whether I don't twist or twist 1, 2, or 3 times at the buckle stalk, I can't keep the locking clip within a close enough distance from the latch plate and also keep it from lying on the edge of the belt path. So, I have to put up with the tilt.)

ownedbyhorses · Oct 6, 2010

I had a tilt problem, but I reinstalled it and I had the shoulder belt angle more over towards the front of the seat. So, instead of it pulling upwards on the seat, it lays on the vertical opening part of the RF belt path. Do you know what I mean? It is hard to explain. Maybe you can try to reinstall with that in mind. It is worth a try. I know it does not solve your other issues. But, if you could twist the stalk so your child can't release it, that may work.
HTH

bobandjess99 · Oct 6, 2010

oh. my. god.

Really? He's just making [stuff] up?

glockchick · Oct 6, 2010

That is insane! Sounds like Russ is becoming a liability. Could you imagine what would happen if I child were in an accident in one of his jerry rigged solutions?

canadiangie · Oct 6, 2010

Holy crap.

This by far takes the cake. If we didn't already questions Russ' advice, this beyond seals the deal for me.

No, that isn't a solution for your problem. At all.

skitle1802 · Oct 6, 2010

ketchupqueen said:
He had you put a locking clip on the tail of the LATCH strap. Um, no, that is NOT a solution I'd consider safe. It's the same as using a locking clip on a lap-only belt with tail, which is something we are taught not to do. And, the locking clip, which is not likely to hold it from loosening severely under crash forces anyway, being a pre-crash positioner, is also way too far from the "buckle" (in this case, LATCH strap adjuster) even if it was (supposed to be no more than 1/2-1 inch from the buckle of a lap/shoulder belt ONLY.)

This is not good advice and I wouldn't feel safe taking it with my own kid.

Russ is not an engineer, and he is not a tech. And I REALLY REALLY wish he'd stop telling parents to do stuff like this!

Just a random thought, I'm not familiar with them other than what has been discussed a few times on here...but what about a belt shortening clip on the latch strap?

Pixels · Oct 6, 2010

skitle1802 said:
Just a random thought, I'm not familiar with them other than what has been discussed a few times on here...but what about a belt shortening clip on the latch strap?

Nope. A BSC relies on there being a solid connection between the webbing and the buckle. It's used with a sewn-on buckle, not anything with a tail. If you were to try to use a BSC on the LATCH strap (or anything else with a tail), first you would have to lengthen the LATCH strap all the way. The folded over and sewn part would prevent you from pulling the tail all the way through the adjuster, but under crash forces, who knows if that would hold or if it would pull through.

Nice thinking outside the box, though.

BookMama · Oct 6, 2010

mayamac said:
He "had never heard of this before"

Did he consult with an engineer before telling you to use the locking clip on the LATCH strap? I suspect he did not - in which case he gave you a solution for a problem he's not qualified to assess (he's not a tech or an engineer), or else he has heard of this problem before and this is the solution that was decided upon. (I have a very hard time believing that a qualified individual approved this "solution, though."

I just can't believe he says that he's never heard of this problem.

Mae · Oct 6, 2010

BookMama said:
I just can't believe he says that he's never heard of this problem.

You mean just like he's never heard of the sticker problem?

Somebody is a bit high on their horse, IMO. Of course there can be *nothing* wrong with the Radian.

mayamac · Oct 6, 2010

BookMama said:
Did he consult with an engineer before telling you to use the locking clip on the LATCH strap? I suspect he did not - in which case he gave you a solution for a problem he's not qualified to assess (he's not a tech or an engineer), or else he has heard of this problem before and this is the solution that was decided upon. (I have a very hard time believing that a qualified individual approved this "solution, though."

I just can't believe he says that he's never heard of this problem.

I know- now I feel kinda bad for the guy.
I did decide to ask for a set of the old LATCH and he is sending those to me.

BookMama · Oct 6, 2010

mayamac said:
I did decide to ask for a set of the old LATCH and he is sending those to me.

I guess I don't even think that's a great solution. You will probably know/remember to switch to a seatbelt install when your child reaches 40 lbs RF, but what about the less car-seat-savvy parents that he provides an old LATCH strap to? They may not really understand the issue, and they may not remember (or care) to switch to a seat belt install at 40 lbs. RF instead of 45 lbs. RF. :thumbsdown:

APmama2MAK · Oct 6, 2010

I swear, every time I read or hear about someone calling Russ they say he said hes "never heard of this before" hahaha. He is so full of it.

rodentranger · Nov 2, 2010

ketchupqueen said:
Russ is not an engineer, and he is not a tech. And I REALLY REALLY wish he'd stop telling parents to do stuff like this!

Not that I have ever trusted Russ, but when I called yesterday the woman who answered the phone said, "You're going to need to talk to our tech, but he's on the phone right now."
Me: "Would that be Russ?"
Her: "Yes, it is Russ."
I very distinctly remember the fact that she called him a tech because I thought to myself, "There is no [flipping] way a tech worthy of working for a manufacturer would give out the [crud] advice that man does!"

spoke with Russ about SL trouble

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