Cessna Aircraft with Lap Belt Only

U

Unregistered

Guest

• Oct 3, 2010

• #1

Hello,

I have a daughter who has just turned six, weighs just over 50lbs, stands 48 in tall and uses the Sunshine Kids Radian 65 5-Point Harness Seat in my van. I also use it when we are flying in our Cessna 210, which is only equiped with lap belts in the rear seats. I know that this is NOT recommended by Sunshine (lap belt only), but I was not happy with her being in the lap belt alone so I purchased this in the spring of 2009 as she had outgrown the Cosco Eddie Bauer 5-point harness I had. She is about to outgrow the Radian height wise at her shoulders and I am not sure what to buy next for her that will have a 5-point harness and still be of use in the Cessna. I am looking at the Britax Frontier 85 as it states it is "Certified for Aircraft Travel in Harness Mode". Does this mean I can use it with a lap belt only?
Any information would be greatly appreciated.
Gitte

 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor

Staff member

• Oct 3, 2010

• #2

All harnessed seats can be used with the lap belt only. The Frontier requires a top tether after 65 pounds harnessed.

Honestly, though, on a plane I'd probably just have her sit in the lap belt only, and use a booster when you get to your destination. Does she sit properly in a seatbelt alone (whether in the plane or in a booster in the car)?

Wendy

 

G

gjulien

New member

• Oct 3, 2010

• #3

Hi,
Thanks for the quick reply. I fly commercially with her 3-5 times a year and she is fine in a lap belt.
I am just concerned in our Cessna as we live in Calgary, Alberta and often fly near/over the Rocky Mountains where there can be a lot of turbulance going in/out of the foothills and she falls asleep in the plane 9 times out of 10 so she would slump over or sideways. I am concened she may smack her head on the window if she's slumped and we hit turbulance. My husband and I have harnesses in the front seats and my younger daughter is in a 5-point harness seat. The Radian was the tallest I could find when I bought it but it appears the Frontier 85 is taller. Just not sure what to do.....
Gitte

 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor

Staff member

• Oct 3, 2010

• #4

Your messages are still in moderation, so they need to be approved by a moderator before they appear. I deleted the duplicate.

The Frontier 85 (I believe it's the Frontier XT in Canada) has 20" top slots versus the Radian's 17.5" top slots. Sunshine Kids does allow for the shoulders to go above the top slot of the Radian as long as the tips of the ears are below the top of the shell. That may be an option for you for the plane. They're the only ones who allow that, so take it as you will.

Wendy

 

G

gjulien

New member

• Oct 3, 2010

• #5

Thanks Wendy!!

I will keep an eye on her ear tips and have made a note to read manuals myself before posting silly questions. I just had in my mind that the harness slot could not be below her shoulder height.

I searched several Cessna web pages and other private pilot forums and found nothing there about what people are doing about taller kids in lap belts in small planes, my hubby thinks she's fine with the lap belt.

As a general FYI for others who may read this, the Radian fits great in the Cessna!

My dear hubby will be happy to hear we won't need another expensive car seat!

Gitte

 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor

Staff member

• Oct 3, 2010

• #6

The Radian is the ONLY seat that allows that. It's not silly at all, since we hammer here that seats are outgrown when the shoulders go above the top slot. It's only the Radian that raises that stipulation. Which is why I say make that decision as a parent yourself.

I'm guessing there are no airbags on the plane, so the only harm in her resting against a window is bumping, right? There's no shoulder belt to be out of place, there's no airbag to explode in her ear. So what I'd do when she does outgrow the Radian, is put a pillow there. My dad fixed an armrest pillow of some sort to the middle console of his car with double sized tape. Just a small rectangular pillow. I'd probably do the same for your daughter. That way she has someplace comfortable to rest her head that doesn't bounce and bonk during turbulence. Nor will the pillow flop off.

Wendy

 

Defrost

Moderator - CPSTI Emeritus

• Oct 3, 2010

• #7

Since the plane belongs to you, can have a harness installed in her seat like the ones in your seats?

 

leighi123

Active member

• Oct 3, 2010

• #8

What if she sits in the front and you sit in the back?

 

G

gjulien

New member

• Oct 3, 2010

• #9

Hi Defrost - this is something we have looked in to but is it not available as there is a third row of seats (we don't use them, they're similar to the rear seats of an older sports car - jump seats) and nowhere to anchor the harness. (Our dog sits back there).

Leighi123 - she does sit in the front when she's flying alone with my hubby but she is a big talker and when she falls asleep, hubby and I cannot talk when I am back due to the way the intercom works (either all can talk or only "crew", meanting front). She also infrequently gets motion sickness and this happened to him once when he was on final approach (imagine crying 5 year old barfing and you're talking to control tower about your sequence for landing/getting ready to land while trying to pass her WetOnes), so we keep her in the back seat with air sick bags within reach (of course not needed when she has them in hand).

Wendy, there are no airbags in the plane. I may still be buying the Britax a year from now (or whichever brand is making the tallest harness), but will keep this for now.

Thanks for all the input!!

 

leighi123

Active member

• Oct 4, 2010

• #10

My sister pukes on every plane ride (and in the car, boats, rides etc), and we travel/fly a ton. So I know how bad that can suck (esp being the person who has to sit next to it!)

 

G

gjulien

New member

• Aug 4, 2011

• #11

Hi,
Me again - we have been doing a lot of flying this summer and I am still not comfortable with her just being in the lap belt.
Any new news on tallest harness that allows for lap belt only? She's asleep right now, but has grown since my last posts.
Have also checked with AME where we have plane serviced and no harnesses on market that can be installed in rear seats. Everything you do to a small plane has to be approved prior by Transport Canada.
If anyone knows of a taller one, please let me know!
Thanks,
Gitte

 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor

Staff member

• Aug 4, 2011

• #12

The Frontier XT is still your best bet.

Wendy

 

An Aurora

Senior Community Member

• Aug 4, 2011

• #13

Yep, the Frontier has the tallest top slots.

My oldest is 6 and she is harnessed when she flies with DH She normally rides in a Cessna 206, which has lap/shoulder belts but she does not fit the belt properly (not surprisingly, since well she's 6!).

 

U

Unregistered

Guest

• Mar 4, 2015

• #14

Hi there, we are looking into buying our first Cessna and plan to fly with our two daughters 2 and 4 yrs old. What are the best carseats to use in the Cessna? We have Sunshine/Diono ones in our car, but read that the Frontier may last longer because they allow for taller kids? Does the Frontier fit in the Cessna well? We are looking at getting a Cessna 172 or 182. Any tips for flying with kids would be appreciated! Thanks!

 

Last edited by a moderator: Mar 4, 2015

TechnoGranola

Forum Ambassador

• Mar 4, 2015

• #15

I can't help the most recent poster, but just to respond to the one of the old posts in case anyone is reading, about the Radian allowing the shoulders over the top slots. In Canada, this is not allowed. I don't know if that has changed for Diono's new seats or not, but for Radians you can't use over the top slots if you have a Canadian seat.

 

bccrst

Active member

• Mar 4, 2015

• #16

Just curious, is there a reason the CARES harness wouldn't work in a Cessna?

 

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor

Staff member

• Mar 5, 2015

• #17

It may not tighten the lap belt, but as the seats and belts are different than in commercial, if it does it'd be a valid option if there are trusted seats on either side. I don't think most private seats are built into the plane so you can't get the CARES strap around it.

Wendy

 

M

minimalistmama

Member

• Mar 20, 2015

• #18

I've flown with kids in a larger Cessna (Britax Roundabouts and a Radian -- both seats worked great -- one Roundabout was RF) -- but haven't put kids in a 172. Absolutely, I'd rather have kids in a 5-pt harness on a small plane as long as possible. Personally. There's no extra space back there and it's just so bumpy, and I'd love for them to sleep as comfortably as possible -- partly to avoid the airsickness issues, partly because when they're asleep they're not asking for the potty and making me wonder how soon I need to divert...

I have two different streams of thought going right now... My first thought for carseat would be the Radian, because of the low profile. You might even be able to fit it RF with an angle adjuster.

But then there's the weight issue. On a 172 especially, adding nearly 50 lbs for 2 Radians is potentially significant for the weight & balance. If you can find a much lighter carseat that will fit well back there, I'd maybe go for that and give yourself the option to use that weight you've saved to take on a few extra gallons of fuel.

I haven't used a Frontier so can't help you with that. If you're torn between the 172 and 182, I'd maybe go for the 182. I love 172s but the 182 is definitely roomier (probably many more good carseat options in that one) and as your kids grow bigger and heavier, w&b is only going to get trickier in the 172.

HTH! Happy flying!

 

murphydog77

Admin - CPST Instructor

Staff member

• Mar 30, 2015

• #19

Another thought I wanted to add to this thread for future readers is that the Evenflo SureRide/Titan 65 is lightweight and has the tallest harness slots of any convertible carseat. So it's going to save about 12-15 lbs. over a Radian/Frontier and is available in Canada as well.

 

U

Unregistered

Guest

• Aug 14, 2015

• #20

Just thought I would update with a comparison of seats for anyone looking for more info. Although I could not find the specifics of whether the seats can be attached with lap belt only. Our Cardinal back seats have shoulder straps as well as the lap belt.

Frontier XT:
Seat weight 19.6lbs.
Forward facing weight and height up to 65lbs and 57".
Coverts to no-back booster (so using just the plane harness, not the seats 5-point) 120lbs and 65"
More of an upright seat (better for looking out windows, not as good for sleeping) and has built in cupholders.

Evenflo Sureride DLX/ Titan 65:
Seat weight 14lbs
Forward Facing weight and height up to 65lbs 54".
Does not convert to booster.
More of a relaxed reclined seat (good for sleeping, not for looking out windows), no cupholders.

Diono/Sunshine kids Radian XT:
Seat weight 32 lbs
Forward Facing weight and height up to 80lbs and 57"
Converts to booster (back on, just removing 5-point harness and uses planes harness)
Upright seat with attachable cupholder.

We haven't bought car seats for our plane yet. We have the Diono's in our car, but are thinking we will go with a lighter seat for in the plane. My guess is we will go with the Frontier as it is has a few inches more height, and will grow with them after they are 65lbs.