News seatbelt failure

christineka · Sep 29, 2010

In yesterday afternoon's local paper, there was an article on a fatal crash. The crash was beetween a 2006 vehicle and a 1985 vehicle. All persons involved had been wearing their seatbelts. The guy in the newer vehicle had his legs pinned. The seatbelts in the old vehicle failed. There was one fatality and the other person is in critical condition. I have surmised that the seatbelts were most likely original. We're told to replace seatbelts every 10 years. It could be important.

Defrost · Sep 29, 2010

Another consideration would be the rate of speed at the time of the crash. (And it could very well be a combination of the two - age of the seatbelts and rate of speed.) Yet another factor would be that newer vehicles are designed with more "crumple zones" to help absorb the crash forces, but that would likely only come into play had the seatbelts not failed.

Was there any comment on how it was determined that the seatbelts failed, rather than that they weren't used at all?

In any case, what a sad story.

mimieliza · Sep 29, 2010

Can we talk more about the recommendation to replace seat belts every ten years?

I have a 1999 Honda Odyssey (so it would be due for new belts) and a 2002 Subaru Forester (due in 2012). Will Honda and/or Subaru replace belts for free, just for age? Or do I need to demonstrate that there is something wrong with the belts?

Just wondering, as the cost of replacing belts is probably prohibitive for those of us lucky enough to be driving cars that are 10+ years old.

Mom2FiveGirls · Sep 29, 2010

mimieliza said:
Can we talk more about the recommendation to replace seat belts every ten years?

I have a 1999 Honda Odyssey (so it would be due for new belts) and a 2002 Subaru Forester (due in 2012). Will Honda and/or Subaru replace belts for free, just for age? Or do I need to demonstrate that there is something wrong with the belts?

Just wondering, as the cost of replacing belts is probably prohibitive for those of us lucky enough to be driving cars that are 10+ years old.

This. I've never heard this before... I have a 2000 Ford Excursion, so do I need to replace all the seat belts now? DH has a really old car (1984 I believe) so I'm assuming his need replacing like 16 years ago??

LISmama810 · Sep 29, 2010

Defrost said:
Was there any comment on how it was determined that the seatbelts failed, rather than that they weren't used at all?

Also wondering that.

mimieliza said:
Will Honda and/or Subaru replace belts for free, just for age? Or do I need to demonstrate that there is something wrong with the belts?

I don't know about Subaru, but I believe Honda has a lifetime replacement program. I'm not sure if something needs to be visibly WRONG with them, though. You could always throw a locking clip or lock-off on them for a few days and show that they're "warped."

NannyMom · Sep 29, 2010

WHO says that seatbelts should be replaced every 10 years? I know I've seen it here before, but where does that come from?

That's very sad that the person in the older car died. But I too am interested in how they determined the seatbelt failed.

Mae · Sep 29, 2010

NannyMom said:
WHO says that seatbelts should be replaced every 10 years? I know I've seen it here before, but where does that come from?

I believe I was taught something like this in tech class, as well.

Defrost · Sep 29, 2010

Honda is one of the companies that have a "lifetime warranty" on their safety systems (including seat belts) but most companies don't. And yes, it's quite cost-prohibitive. We replaced a belt with a broken retractor in my dh's VW (the guy laughed in my face when I asked about a warranty on the seat belt) and it cost about $150 including labor.

In some older vehicles someone who is handy enough (and can be trusted to understand the importance) could do the job themselves, but even then the cost of the new seat belts would still be high for every single seat belt in the vehicle.

christineka · Sep 29, 2010

Unfortunately, the article is not available online. (I looked.) Here's a more detailed summary:

AB, 37 was driving eastbound on SR-138 in a 1985 Nissan pickup at about 7:20am when the driver of a blue 2006 Porsche heading west turned left onto Sheep Lane, crashing into the pickup. [sic]

Although both B an her 18 year old son, D were wearing seatbelts, the safety devices appear to have failed, according to UHP Trooper CF.

"They just snapped upon impact," F said of the restraints.

Both occupants of the pickup were ejected, and A was pinned under the truck, F said. The impact of the crash broke both of the Porsche driver's legs. He, too had been wearing a seatbelt.

The speed limit on SR-138 is 60 mph. There have been quite a number of crashes head on. Recently they've repaved the whole road, adding in those bump strips in the middle and sides. (It's a long stretch of not much to look at and little traffic.)

ketchupqueen · Sep 29, 2010

I was taught (in my tech class, but it jives with what an engineer friend told me) that we should advise close inspection yearly after 10 years, possible replacement (consider replacement) after 15 years, and replacement (period) after 20 years. These belts were 25 years old-- well past the point I'd want to be using them in a crash.

Also, my dad's 88 Corolla has only lap belts in the back. Any chance that there were lap belt only riders in the car too?

Defrost · Sep 29, 2010

christineka said:
Although both B an her 18 year old son, D were wearing seatbelts, the safety devices appear to have failed, according to UHP Trooper CF.

"They just snapped upon impact," F said of the restraints.

Interesting. I'm inclined to believe the report - it's likely that the trooper has seen many crash scenes with unrestrained passengers and knows what he's looking at, and it sounds like he was reporting obvious damage to the seat belt that couldn't have occurred if they weren't in use at the time. (It's also possible that they were damaged before the crash, I suppose, but it's not very common for more than one belt in a vehicle to damaged.)

Yeah, I'll go with my first theory - rate of speed + age of belts/vehicle.

Everyone, also keep in mind that substances spilled on seat belts repeated over time have been shown to decrease the strength of the belts. It's possible that was also a contribution in this case, though of course that's just speculation. If you've got older belts & can't afford to replace them, that would be another consideration - have they been soaked with soda several times and left to sit? I've also seen work-trucks where the seatbelts reeked of gasoline & oil due to frequent contact with workers' soaked uniforms (actually I have one sitting in my back yard).

zactayaus · Sep 29, 2010

Yikes! My suburban is a 2000. I'll be keeping an eye on this thread.

bobandjess99 · Sep 29, 2010

For them to say they snapped makes it sound to me like the buckles were buckled, but the harness itself was broken someplace/snapped. That would be fairly easy to see I guess, as opposed to a belt simply not used, not buckled and undamaged.

sunnymw · Sep 29, 2010

Hmmm. Now I'm worried about MY belts in my 2000 Grand Marquis. They are absolutely filthy in spots, stained with drink stains and God-knows-what-else. :/

glockchick · Sep 29, 2010

I'd also love to see a link from a car manufacturer or something like that saying the belts need to be replaced at 10 years.

One of the belts in my 2001 civic is fraying at the edge and when I took it in for service yesterday I asked them if it needed to be replaced and they said it was fine.

christineka · Sep 29, 2010

I should go find the manuals. I remember reading in the ford tempo manual that the belts should be inspected every 10 years and replaced after an accident.

ketchupqueen · Sep 29, 2010

sunnymw said:
Hmmm. Now I'm worried about MY belts in my 2000 Grand Marquis. They are absolutely filthy in spots, stained with drink stains and God-knows-what-else. :/

So, they're 10 years old, and possibly weakened artificially?

I'd probably consider replacing as soon as you're able (most frequently used belts first.)

ketchupqueen · Sep 29, 2010

ShannaLeah said:
One of the belts in my 2001 civic is fraying at the edge and when I took it in for service yesterday I asked them if it needed to be replaced and they said it was fine.

Is it fraying, as in fibers are snapped? I'd go back and demand they replace it if so. It should be free on a Honda, and a cut or fray (involving snapped fibers) of as little as 1/10 of a cm long can cause a seatbelt to fail in a crash, according to information presented in my tech class.

glockchick · Sep 29, 2010

Hold on, I'll go get a pic.

ETA:

It's about an inch long.

From the front of the seat belt

back

I have a car seat in that spot installed with LATCH right now so it's not an issue, but it will be in the future.

Spam · Sep 29, 2010

ketchupqueen said:
These belts were 35 years old-- well past the point I'd want to be using them in a crash.

wait a minute, i'm not 35.. they belts were 25 years old, still past the point of being replaced, but I'm not ready to be in my thirties yet

I'm also curious about this too, our durango is a 00. It would be horrendous if they belts holding my childrens seats in place failed in an accident.

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