Are older kiddos actually safer more upright when RF?

L

LuciaBella

Guest
I've been on this debate back and forth with you know who from SKJP. Are there studies and crash tests done where it's shown that older kids are safer when they are more upright when RF?

It makes sense to me, because the heavier the kiddo, the more force the seat will incur during impact. If the seat is initially at 45 degrees with an infant (say 22lbs), it won't move nearly as far towards the impact as an older toddler (40lbs) will at the same angle.

I'm confused and would also like to see actual studies done!
Thanks!
 
ADS

mommycat

Well-known member
Being more upright is safer because there is less chance of ramping up+head strike, and because with less downward rotation you spread the forces out more over the whole back rather than compressing the spine/shoulders against the straps. The need for a recline in a seat is to keep airways open for small babies, and mostly for comfort later on (most people don't like to sit perfectly vertical) - I am not sure if there any tradeoff for rear crashes in the equation as well. Of course, this is all stuff I have picked up from various sources along the way with no actual study/data to point to.
 

Guest

New member
Mommycat hit the crucial point: forces are spread over the entire back vs a couple of points.

Regardless of how much difference in forces there are btw 45 degrees and something more upright, the alternative is still far worse.

You can think of equivalent examples in everyday life. Tiny sandal straps dig in and are subjected to more force than a shoe that covers your whole foot. Thin straps on a purse hurt a lot more than a thick shoulder strap on a backpack.

When you have a wider area to distribute forces, the forces suffered are a lot less.

Then you get into the head/neck. Basically the most important part of the body. You don't want a head flying around (particularly when it's a big % of the body weight, as it is in a child vs an adult). If you can keep it more or less in line with how it is naturally, it suffers a lot less damage in an accident.

There's not much thought needed into the ERF thing. Do you want your child's head to pop off? Yes or no? It's pretty much that simple.
 

Guest

New member
Do you know this from experience? :p

Maybe.
icon9.gif
 

jeminijad

New member
So what is the risk in having a convertible seat TOO upright? Say, 20 degrees?

I am not advocating this at all. I do wonder, though- what are the possible consequences in a crash, for a seat that installs naturally at like 25 degrees, where most people have to use a noodle to reach the 35 that the manufacturers want?
 

Chex

New member
I would think the danger then would be rebound, wouldn't it? If a kid is that close to the back of the seat, they may hit it quite a bit harder. I don't know, I'm really just speculating. :eek:
 
L

LuciaBella

Guest
Thanks everyone, but is there any actual data to prove this? Other than common sense and a physics class...
 

jeminijad

New member
Bump...

I know some seats from other countries are meant to be very upright, and while I get that being closer to the back seat could mean slamming into it harder in a collision, what is negating that danger on other seat designs?
 

mommycat

Well-known member
I think often the seats have an anti-rebound bar or similar feature or foot prop or RF tethers or even the shoulder belt looped around the shell or brace on the front seats, all of which reduce motion overall. Though I can't say for sure if they all do.
 

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