Unbelievable(maybe not)

cpsaddict · Feb 6, 2007

The Cosco Summit cannot be used WITHOUT the base, correct? Last night on the news they had a segment about a car seat check the station is sponsoring. Anyway, they show the whole check set-up; the van, the tents, cars, etc. They show a TECH putting a Summit in without the base. I know it's the Summit because of the Huge red buttons on the armrests.

UGH!!! I see the Summits for sale on CL all the time without the bases, but I did not think I tech would use one without it.

Rant over,

Splash · Feb 6, 2007

Yes, it can be used without the base. It MUST be used without the base as a booster, also.

cpsaddict · Feb 6, 2007

Really? I could swear there was a converstion once upon a time about how dumb it was to have the same base as the AO and not be able to remove it. Maybe they changed them, that was clear back when I worked at BRU, about four years ago or so.

Or, maybe I am losing my mind. Major possibilty there!

Mom2nj · Feb 6, 2007

I have a question then, I have 2 Summits and I have read the manual a couple of times today for various reasons. Can you use the seat without the base and use the harness. Both kids that use it are under 3 and under 40lbs. I could have sworn you had to use it with the base for a BPB also, till I just reread the manual and found were it says you must take of the base and harness to use it as a BPB, they should make it bold because in this manual it is normal print and ever picture they show of it as a booster has a base on it. I can't find if you can take off the base for harness use though.

Splash · Feb 6, 2007

When using it with the harness, you can use it with or without the base.
When using it as a booster, you MUST remove the base.

The base is optional for harnessed use, but MUST be removed as a booster.

As far as I know, it's always been that way. I owned one back when they first came out, and it was the same then.

Mom2nj · Feb 7, 2007

Thanks for the clarification. Sorry for the double post, just wasn't sure where I should put the post, after I posted this one I figured I may have put in the wrong spot. Thank You, Thank You.

joolsplus3 · Feb 7, 2007

Splash said:
When using it with the harness, you can use it with or without the base.
When using it as a booster, you MUST remove the base.

The base is optional for harnessed use, but MUST be removed as a booster.

As far as I know, it's always been that way. I owned one back when they first came out, and it was the same then.

I'm really sure that's the rule for the AO, but the Summit's base is NOT supposed to be removed, ever.

joolsplus3 · Feb 7, 2007

Yeah, unless they've changed something, here's darren's original review.... http://www.car-seat.org/showthread.php?t=555

scatterbunny · Feb 7, 2007

joolsplus3 said:
I'm really sure that's the rule for the AO, but the Summit's base is NOT supposed to be removed, ever.

GOOD to know!

Scary that a tech (from my home state) was installing it wrong!

murphydog77 · Feb 7, 2007

I didn't see any wording in the current manual regarding the base, but in the diagrams in the manual, the base is always used. If in doubt, leave it on. It's not just a forward-facing Alpha Omega.

momika · Feb 7, 2007

The base on the Summit (and it's twin the Eddie Bauer Deluxe High Back Booster with front adjuster) is NOT removable. Not ever. Not during harness mode, not during booster mode.

It is NOT the same as the Alpha Omega.

Splash · Feb 7, 2007

The one on mine was/is. It was very specific in the manual that the base MUST be removed to use as a booster, and could be removed for the harness. But it was very clear, in big letters in the manual, that to use as a booster you MUST remove the base.
I don't have the seat, or the manual, anymore, but I remember that clearly.

momika · Feb 7, 2007

I'm sorry, you must be confusing it with another seat (perhaps an AO or one of it's kin). The base on the Summit may NOT ever be removed. It never was allowed. I have a copy of the manual from 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006 (I don't think they revised it in 2004) ... Not one of them allows the removal of the base.

Here is the diagram from the manual clearly showing the base when it's used as a booster.

Splash · Feb 7, 2007

Nope, it was a summit. I bought it when it first came out, I'm thinking 2001? The base was removable and it said in the manual to remove the base for booster use. It was a completely flat seat under the base, so no worry about it tipping like Julie asked. I thought it was odd, since the cup holder was on the base...
I took the base off and used it harnessed with no problems. I never did use it as a booster though.
This seat. I had the tan one.

mom2acrew · Feb 7, 2007

Thanks Monika, for anyone confused on this topic I suggest you call Cosco. Despite other opinions I think you will find Cosco has never allowed it to be used w/out the base. Maybe Splash recieved the wrong manual with hers? Cosco isn't exactly on the ball sometimes.

momika · Feb 7, 2007

I'm sorry, your memory is not correct Splash. Jodi gives good advice, please do call Dorel and you may confirm that it is NOT removable and never was.

I did find the manual from 2001 (you are correct in that it was first released in 2001, I misspoke when I said earlier that it was a 2002 manual, it's actually from 2001, pre-LATCH, but I had it in my 2002 folder), and in that manual, they DO specify to NOT use it without the base. I've copied and highlighted that part here and am happy to email you the .pdf of the complete manual file as well.

Yes, I really DO have every manual, I am a contractor for SafetyBeltSafe USA and I am the project manager every year for the instruction summary project (you know, the CD with all the instructions and summaries of them). I know that we specifically mention the base in the summary and how it is NOT removable and did even the very first year it was released.

Splash · Feb 7, 2007

Okay, I don't want to beat a dead horse or get into an argument, but I know I am not confused or remembering wrong.
However when in Target tonight I looked at the one they had there. I did not see the manual (display), but on EVERY sticker on the seat it showed it being used WITHOUT the base. It also said no where on the stickers never to use without base.
Now why would they put the stickers on it showing it without the base if you can't use it without the base?
I'm sure the manual may have changed, or maybe it was even the wrong manual included with my seat (which I really doubt). But at the time it was my only Cosco seat (bought an AO a bit later) and I was quite confused as to why the base had to be removed for the booster, since the base had the cupholder. But it was in black and white in the manual, that removing the base for booster use was mandatory.
I did email Dorel (not expecting anything to come of it) and i suppose I'll call them tomorrow, because this is really bothering me. I'm sorry I gave the PP incorrect information, but I was going off the one I owned, not knowing it had changed.

Mom2nj · Feb 8, 2007

I agree with Splash, I read the manual for my seat dated 08/08/02, it says that the Base MUST be removed and the harness must be removed for booster mode. I have read it numberous times, I initally thought you couldn't remove it either until I read that in the manual. I will try to post the page where is says that if I can. The seat I have is the Tan one also. I have a black one but can't find the manual to that one.

joolsplus3 · Feb 8, 2007

Splash said:
Okay, I don't want to beat a dead horse or get into an argument, but I know I am not confused or remembering wrong.
However when in Target tonight I looked at the one they had there. I did not see the manual (display), but on EVERY sticker on the seat it showed it being used WITHOUT the base. It also said no where on the stickers never to use without base.
Now why would they put the stickers on it showing it without the base if you can't use it without the base?
I'm sure the manual may have changed, or maybe it was even the wrong manual included with my seat (which I really doubt). But at the time it was my only Cosco seat (bought an AO a bit later) and I was quite confused as to why the base had to be removed for the booster, since the base had the cupholder. But it was in black and white in the manual, that removing the base for booster use was mandatory.
I did email Dorel (not expecting anything to come of it) and i suppose I'll call them tomorrow, because this is really bothering me. I'm sorry I gave the PP incorrect information, but I was going off the one I owned, not knowing it had changed.

Sounds to me like one of the issues that Cosco SHOULD have a recall for, but never does. It has to be used with the base, and they are notorious for copying and pasting manuals together poorly (like they tell how to use the Touriva as a booster), so something is just mucked up in the printing department, is my guess, and there won't be a recall (like there should have been, for example, for the Touriva with the aircraft sticker not printed in the legally mandated red ink).
Can't use the top slot on the Summit either, but they don't even bother to stamp that on the back of the seat anymore

momika · Feb 9, 2007

Here's the official word from my contacts at Dorel:

"The Summit base should not be removed in the Forward-Facing or Booster modes. In our labels and instructions, we do not show the consumer how to remove the base or state to remove the base.

From October 1, 2003 to mid/late December 2003, we did, however, have a typo on page 32 (introduction to the Belt-Positioning Booster Use section) in the instruction manual that stated to remove the base. In this same manual, we did not show or describe how to remove the base. As soon as the typo was discovered, we corrected the manual."

So that's that. This comes from a gentleman who writes their manuals and was confirmed by their products standards manager. If you find any stickers or manual that state otherwise, please do let me know and show me the proof. In that case, they may have a recall issue on their hands and I will forward your information to my contact at Dorel.

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