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  1. #21
    Senior Community Member mommaon112903's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by bobandjess99 View Post
    If the fit is bad, it's bad, and you certainly shouldn't use it.
    The 6 yo dummy specs are here.http://www.ftss.com/crash-test-dummi...iii-6-year-old at the bottome, choose external specs and weights, etc.
    It's small. Well, at least from my perspective, lol. only 52 lbs, 45 inches, 25 inches from butt to head. A child that size, unless they had an extremely long, disproportionate torso, would still fit in the nauti harness for a year or more.
    Josef is 44", 44lbs and has outgrown the GN in harness mode, and *just* turned six two weeks ago. The fit for him in the GN was horrible even before he officially outgrew the GN.

    I am shocked to see the Symphony65 on the good bet list. From what I have seen I was under the impression it did *not* make a good booster for the average child.
    Crystal, SAHM to J age 8yrs11months/49.25"/55lbs/Blue Opal Recaro ProBoosterand Orange OSPKWY

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  3. #22
    Admin - CPS Technician joolsplus3's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by mommaon112903 View Post
    I am shocked to see the Symphony65 on the good bet list. From what I have seen I was under the impression it did *not* make a good booster for the average child.
    Not sure where you read that, the only person who's used one as a booster is Ulrike and she liked it, here's here 10 year old in it... http://s287.photobucket.com/albums/l...t=100_1755.jpg

    It's possible that people universally berate 3-in-1's and so people have lumped this one in with the Coscos, I guess, but it's really not bad, I recommend it to BRU shoppers all the time because I know it'll make a decent booster
    Julie
    CPST since 2003, pu"R"ple since 2008, three kids growing too fast since 1997, 1999 and 2006

    Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good

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  5. #23
    CPSDarren - Admin SafeDad's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Kecia will have some commentary on the IIHS ratings soon at www.carseatblog.com . We are also giving away some boosters that rated well in the results!

  6. #24
    CPSDarren - Admin SafeDad's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    One point I made in my interview that was omitted: checking the fit in each vehicle is important because seats and seatbelts vary a lot. Some have shoulder belts that come out of the ceiling, others from the pillar, some on the seat back itself. Lap belts might come from very low on the floor to way up on a long stalk sticking out of the seat. The vehicle seats themselves vary, too. A booster that fits well in one of your vehicles could fit poorly on the same child in your other vehicle. Shoulder belts also affect whether the belt can "catch" in the guide on some high back boosters. Depending on the design of the shoulder belt and the angle and position of the guide in the booster, it makes a difference.

  7. #25
    Admin - CPS Technician LISmama810's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    I haven't read the article yet (though I did just see Darren on the Today Show!), but I'm still not entirely happy with this process.

    I agree with Snowbird that it provides a good starting point, but testing the fit on ONE dummy in one car (or a limited number--not sure on methodology) is VERY useful information if you have a child with those exact proportions and a car with those exact proportions. Beyond that, it doesn't say a whole lot.

    Clearly there are some boosters that are just horrendous in nearly every circumstance, but I really don't like the idea of rating boosters as "good" or "bad" because a booster that fits the dummy great could be terrible for a kid who actually uses it.

  8. #26
    Admin - Webmaster Admin's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by LISmama810 View Post
    I haven't read the article yet (though I did just see Darren on the Today Show!), but I'm still not entirely happy with this process.

    I agree with Snowbird that it provides a good starting point, but testing the fit on ONE dummy in one car (or a limited number--not sure on methodology) is VERY useful information if you have a child with those exact proportions and a car with those exact proportions. Beyond that, it doesn't say a whole lot.

    Clearly there are some boosters that are just horrendous in nearly every circumstance, but I really don't like the idea of rating boosters as "good" or "bad" because a booster that fits the dummy great could be terrible for a kid who actually uses it.
    Best I can tell, they used a specially fitted dummy about the size of an average 6 year old and put it in 4 different seating configurations. This is exactly why parents need to know about how to make sure their own child fits in their own vehicles. The time and effort to measure 60 models of boosters in dozens of popular vehicles with various sized dummies is probably so large in scope that it would take significantly more hours and dollars to complete. That said, I would hope they did some other general checking to see if the fit of the higher rated models was generally good outside of the testing. It is also not clear to me that they did any crash testing to correlate their fitment ratings to crash test injury measures.
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  9. #27
    Admin - CPS Technician LISmama810's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by Admin View Post
    Best I can tell, they used a specially fitted dummy about the size of an average 6 year old and put it in 4 different seating configurations. This is exactly why parents need to know about how to make sure their own child fits in their own vehicles. The time and effort to measure 60 models of boosters in dozens of popular vehicles with various sized dummies is probably so large in scope that it would take significantly more hours and dollars to complete. That said, I would hope they did some other general checking to see if the fit of the higher rated models was generally good outside of the testing. It is also not clear to me that they did any crash testing to correlate their fitment ratings to crash test injury measures.
    I know that they can't test everything, but not being able to test everything (or at least MORE than they do) really limits the usefulness of the study.

    The main problem is that kids come in so many shapes and sizes, and crash-test dummies just don't. Also, unlike with harnessed seats, the individual type of car makes SO much difference.

    I do like that this is drawing more awareness to proper fit, but I think most parents are going to go to the store with the list in their hand and call it a day.

  10. #28
    CPS Fanatic abacus2's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by LISmama810 View Post
    I do like that this is drawing more awareness to proper fit, but I think most parents are going to go to the store with the list in their hand and call it a day.
    True, but think how many kids will be better protected if parents quit using their 3-in-1's as boosters and go buy a Vivo. A list of boosters that usually provide good belt fit is an excellent resource.
    Liz
    Mom to:
    Rachael (11/03), Emily (8/06), and Naomi (1/09)

  11. #29
    Senior Community Member BABYGIRLLYNDSEY's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    I didn't see the whole thing so I need to go back and watch the Today Show segment again tonight. I did see Darren on TV and DH thought I was nuts, jumping and yelling, hey, that's Darren from car-seat.org!
    Mom to four ages 25, 23, 18 & 11. Busia to my new grandson.

  12. #30
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by bobandjess99 View Post
    Actually, I don't think that is necesarily true. If you look closely, the nauti actually placed the belt decently in the lap portion, and acceptably in the shoulder, although they claim it was too far out? But that can possibly b fixed just by adjusting the headrest. And honestly, I think it ALL has to do with your belt geometry, and which setting the belt is, and the size of your kid. I know in my vehicle, with the headrest and belt guide appropriately placed, the shoulder guide fits dd REALLY, REALLY well. Remember, they were using a 6 yo dummy...which is the equivalent a child that probably has a harness slot to go on the nauti...and we've said all along that it really seems to make a decent booster *for children who have outgrown the harness*. The 6 yo dummy wouldn't have outgrown the harness.
    Again, i think it really comes down to your vehicle and child. I've seen some kids not fit well, and I've seen some, including my 5 year old, who fit very well into the nauti used as a booster.
    Now - if it doesn't fit her well in your vehicle, then of course she shouldn't use it. But if it does fit her well, I don't think you should dismiss it out of hand.
    I agree. The Nauti fits my son, (5 years, 4 feet) beautifully as a booster. Shoulder belt is positioned perfectly, lap belt low on his thighs. Furthermore, the Nauti performed very well in the TC testing recently. I'd be perfectly comfortable with my kid using it as a booster.

  13. #31
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by bobandjess99 View Post
    ok, i fiund it. towards the bottom of the "middle" category that is neither recommended or not recommended. And, as we all suspected, it does better backless with clip than highback.
    hmmm...
    might have to keep that stupid frontier after all.
    Can you link? I'm not finding the list, just seeing the abbreviated photographs (no Nauti there).

  14. #32
    CPS Technician crunchierthanthou's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by Maedze View Post
    Can you link? I'm not finding the list, just seeing the abbreviated photographs (no Nauti there).


    Quote Originally Posted by crunchierthanthou View Post
    here's the pdf with all the ratings. It took me a minute to find it.

    http://www.iihs.org/externaldata/srdata/docs/sr4411.pdf
    pages 3-4

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  16. #33
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Whoa, weird how seats have bounced around from their recommendations last year. The backless TB was formerly a 'best bet'.

  17. #34
    CPS Technician bobandjess99's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    I think it comes back to you have to evaluate the individual fit of your child, your vehicle and the booster, it's a combo. But putting certain boosters as "good bets" helps parents know which ones are *likely* to work, sort of like how we tend to recommend the turbo a lot, because it tends to fit most kids most of the time in most cars.
    Also, i think the biggest service that has been done is to show that the 3-in-1 dorel seats almost NEVER make a good booster, and continuing to get THAT word out is extermely valuable.

    Alex, 8 Katie, 12 and Annabelle Jan 2017

  18. #35
    Senior Community Member Mama Jo's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Maybe I'm blind, but is the Monterey in there somewhere??
    Mama to
    DD - 9 yrs. - FN booster, Vivo
    DS - 4 yrs. RNXT, RA50

  19. #36
    CPS Technician Qarin's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by Mama Jo View Post
    Maybe I'm blind, but is the Monterey in there somewhere??
    #3 as backless into the in-between seats, 17th in that group as a highback.
    Homeschooling mama to safely transported kids-
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  20. #37
    CPS Technician Anne's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    So will any of you be changing your general booster or combination seat recommendations based off of this list?
    DD - 6/12/08 - FF in a Plum RXT
    DD - 7/13/12 - RF in a Cherry Pie CCO

  21. #38
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by Anne View Post
    So will any of you be changing your general booster or combination seat recommendations based off of this list?
    I don't think there's much terribly shocking about the 'not recommended' list.

    I disagree with their recommendations of the Dorel seats in the 'best bets' page, because they have vehicle seatback requirements that other highbacks don't. Obviously that's nothing to do with belt fit, but it's still an important issue.

    I am really surprised that the Harmony Secure Fit did so poorly. However, they only tested it on a 6 year old dummy and I generally recommend it for much older kids with hips, or younger children who are obese, so I think it's still a good option.

    I think they would have found the Monterey and the Nautilus did better in booster mode if they'd used older, bigger dummies.

  22. #39
    Senior Community Member mamabear's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    Quote Originally Posted by BABYGIRLLYNDSEY View Post
    I didn't see the whole thing so I need to go back and watch the Today Show segment again tonight. I did see Darren on TV and DH thought I was nuts, jumping and yelling, hey, that's Darren from car-seat.org!
    Oooooh, I missed it...do you think there is a link to view it online??





    About the list.......I knew DD's booster wouldn't be on there (Jane Indy, since it's discontinued) but it's a great fit too, if anyone was wondering. It fits her very similarly to the TB. IMO(lapbelt may be ever so slightly higher on her thighs though), the Frontier was by far the best fitting booster for her average 7yo body.....

  23. #40
    CPS Technician Anne's Avatar
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    Re: New booster ratings: 9 best bets & 6 good bets; 11 out of 60 seats evaluated aren't recommended

    The Nautilus was the main one I was thinking of. It's on my short list of combo seats that I recommend, specifically if someone's looking for a booster for a young child. It's easily accessed since they have it at walmart, decent price and has the high harness limit. But if it's not going to fit a lot of kids well in booster mode, then I don't know if I want to throw it out there to parents who may or may not actually check the fit of the belt.

    I've always heard the Nauti was a pretty good fit. I wonder how big of a difference it makes using the dummy's compared to actual kids. I also wonder why they use the dummy's for a fit comparison. For something like this, they could be using real kids in a range of ages and sizes. It seems like this would give a better indication of how well the seat really fits kids.
    DD - 6/12/08 - FF in a Plum RXT
    DD - 7/13/12 - RF in a Cherry Pie CCO

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