Question I need information about Rear facing.

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LuciaBella

Guest
I'm planning on talking with my girls dad about turning Bella back around RF. She's 21 months, and only 24 lbs. (I'm not even going to try to turn Lucia back RF, it will be too difficult).

So...some things to keep in mind:
He is a very well educated, intelligent engineer that currently works on medical devices. He is a good dad and loves his kids.

1. What can I tell him about taking the mighty tite off?
2. What about those car seat protectors?
3. Why shouldn't he use Lucia's titan in the RF reclined position for FF?
4. Why should Bella turn back around?

If you could please help me answer these questions, I would be very happy! Also, if you could attach any articles, research or news stuff about these questions that would be great.

Remember he's an engineer!
 
ADS

wendytthomas

Admin - CPST Instructor
Staff member
Here's what I have in my ERFing stash.

http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/StayRearFacing.aspx
http://www.car-safety.org/rearface.html
http://www.aap.org/family/carseatguide.htm
http://www.aafp.org/afp/20020801/practice.html
http://aappolicy.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/pediatrics;109/3/550
http://cpsafety.com/PDFfiles/RearFacingBrochure.pdf
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2DVfqFhseo"]YouTube- The Importance of Rear-Facing[/ame]
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRP7ynNI8mI"]YouTube- Child Seat Safety[/ame]
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9916868
http://www.motionbox.com/video/player/7494d2b5161bf0/#1
http://www.stuff.co.nz/4144421a10.html
http://www.freewebs.com/sacredjourneys/newbornpreschool.htm
http://injuryprevention.bmj.com/cgi/content/abstract/13/6/398
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080129/FREE/872410421/1024/PHOTOS03
http://www.childrestraintsafety.com/rear-facing.html
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rd0wz5D_9eY"]YouTube- Crash Test of 2006 Mazda 5[/ame]
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTJzSHHHsk8&feature=related"]YouTube- Childcare Safety Seats Crash Tested - Presented By The...[/ame]
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/extract/121/3/619
http://aapnews.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/30/4/12-a
http://www.ocregister.com/articles/wilhite-bhatia-skull-2488296-jon-spine
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/8094829.stm
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8gU9zzCGA8"]YouTube- Front facing or Rear facing? Car seat safety TRUE STORY crash test videos[/ame]

Some of these links may be dead, but most work.

Wendy
 
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LuciaBella

Guest
Wow thanks Wendy-you rock!

(I'm waiting for that easy bake to arrive....)
 
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LuciaBella

Guest
Is it better for older children to be as upright as 10 degrees? I was just reading the britax multi tech manual...

What's the difference for the same child in the same car seat but installed in one thats 45 degrees and one thats 10 degrees?
 

steph_s

New member
1. What can I tell him about taking the mighty tite off?
2. What about those car seat protectors?
3. Why shouldn't he use Lucia's titan in the RF reclined position for FF?
4. Why should Bella turn back around?

If you want the easy quick answers...

1. Because the car seat manual for the seats says not to use after market products. Every manual I have seen specifically states to use the locking clip that came with the seat.

2. Again car seat protectors are in most manuals, but if you want you can go out there and take out the protector while the seat is still installed and show him just how loose the seat really is. You can't get a good tight installation with the protectors.

3. Because it's against the rules for the seat. It's a recline bar for rear facing children, she is not rear facing. It states to flip it back before turning the child ff.

4. She should be turned back around because it's safer. (see video's already mentioned).

I have found when talking to my ex that explaining how things are unsafe verses showing him in a manual that they are unsafe works best.
 

Pixels

New member
Is it better for older children to be as upright as 10 degrees? I was just reading the britax multi tech manual...

What's the difference for the same child in the same car seat but installed in one thats 45 degrees and one thats 10 degrees?

It is better for older children to be more upright (as long as the carseat is still within the allowed range, 30-45 degrees for most US carseats). When the seat is more upright, the shell takes more of the forces. More recline, the forces go into the harness and into the child's shoulders.

It's the same reason that we put newborns at 45 degrees. If they were upright (like 10 degrees upright) the carseat would provide more protection in a crash. However, newborns can't breathe when so upright, so we can't put them that way. Newborns do best when laying flat as far as breathing goes, but that doesn't provide the best crash protection. So we end up with 45 degrees as a compromise.

Older kids don't have the breathing problem when upright, so their seats can be safely installed more upright than a newborn's. Just make sure that you stay within the manufacturer's range of acceptable, because that's the only way the seat has been tested.
 

romanoma

New member
Maybe I'm imagining this, but have you talked to him and his DW about this before? Do I remember an old thread about you putting her RF and then finding her FF with the MT back on? Perhaps that's a different nanny battling the MT...

Anyway, if this is your second or 3rd go round with the dad, i would def tread more lightly on the subject. There have been many posts here about people who are turned off and even mad when someone corrects their car seat usage.

And as a general rule, I would never say "it wasn't tested that way, and you don't want your child to be a test dummy!" I've seen that posted here many times before. It seems to go over well here and make the point very well on a car seat forum, but I just think it sounds SO SO HARSH and I just would never say that IRL to someone. That's just my :twocents:. Any unsolicited advice needs to be soft, unassuming, and non threatening. And even if it is, it is still likely to make many people mad!

(I trust that you know this family very well, so some of that advice was for you, and some of it is more for general readers and in speaking more broadly on the topic).

Good luck!
 
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LuciaBella

Guest
Maybe I'm imagining this, but have you talked to him and his DW about this before? Do I remember an old thread about you putting her RF and then finding her FF with the MT back on? Perhaps that's a different nanny battling the MT...

Anyway, if this is your second or 3rd go round with the dad, i would def tread more lightly on the subject. There have been many posts here about people who are turned off and even mad when someone corrects their car seat usage.

And as a general rule, I would never say "it wasn't tested that way, and you don't want your child to be a test dummy!" I've seen that posted here many times before. It seems to go over well here and make the point very well on a car seat forum, but I just think it sounds SO SO HARSH and I just would never say that IRL to someone. That's just my :twocents:. Any unsolicited advice needs to be soft, unassuming, and non threatening. And even if it is, it is still likely to make many people mad!

(I trust that you know this family very well, so some of that advice was for you, and some of it is more for general readers and in speaking more broadly on the topic).

Good luck!

No, you are right. I was the "crazy" one who turned her RF when I drove the mom's car, removed the MT and the seat protectors. installed the seats correctly (this is before I was a cpst too). A few days later...everything back on again. I think this happened because I didn't tell them I made changes, but I figured they would appreciate them. Guess not.

I think that sounds a bit harsh too. I don't want to scare them with "you can fix broken legs, but not broken necks" or the whole Kyle Miller thing (even though I totally respect his family and am so sorry they lost him). I just want to be an adult and respectful and practical. Since dad is an Engineer, I need to PROVE why RF is safer because there's no way he will take my word for it. I do know the family very well, but it's been hard because whenever I bring it up, the kids always grasp our attention away. I'm planning a meeting where I can sit down with them kid free and discuss. Wendy is actually going to join also so there is a fresh objective brain.
 

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