Safety First Complete Air

Maedze

New member
Safety First Complete Air *now with photographic evidence, page 2*

What am I missing here?

I went to install the durned thing today. I'm not exactly a novice, and the only time I've ever not been able to install a seat is when a true incompatability exists.

This wasn't a case of "just tug a bit more". This was a case of the LATCH being completely, totally incompatible with the SHELL of the seat. It just wouldn't work.

The vehicle is a 2005 Ford Freestar. The bench seat is almost entirely parallel to the ground, and the rider is almost four, so I installed without pool noodles. It installed extremely upright even with the flat bench, probably less than thirty degrees.

That being said, the way the shell is designed, extending out, above, around, and below the belt path, the only way to install with LATCH (the shell is substantially wider than the anchors, naturally), was to wrap the connecters up and around the shell. No go, of course. The flare on the shell isn't designed to take that sort of pressure in a crash.

It's not like with other seats where the connecters come up over the base a little and that's just fine. The webbing has to literally wrap around the flare of the shell before it gets to the belt path. No way around it.

The only way I could fathom this possibly working is if I had it installed with a pool noodle pyramid.

It went in beautifully with the seatbelt, incidentally.

I'm going to assume that I'm missing something, because how can a LATCH system be incompatible with its own seat? Enlighten me. I don't want to look daft at a check, kwim? :eek:
 
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Mommy0608

New member
This is one of the (many) reasons I returned mine. Can't explain it, but I completely 100% agree with you. I even tried it with noodles. Still a no-go with LATCH in my vehicle. Seat belt install wasn't great either.
 

bobandjess99

Senior Community Member
?? Now I'm curious. I want to know what you're talking about, lol.

(and really, THIS is what you think might make you look daft...???:p)
 

Maedze

New member
Yeah, I know it's a doomed prospect. LOL.

I should have taken a picture. I was totally bemused. I wasn't fighting it or getting all sweaty and aggravated.

I just sat back, took a good look and said, "Yeah. NO."
 

ketchupqueen

CPST and ketchup snob
Staff member
I pulled the LATCH strap into the belt path, back through the cover, and was able to get it in without much difficulty.

Maybe it's an issue of where/how the anchors are seated in your car?

In mine the anchors kind of angled in front of the shell IIRC.
 

Maedze

New member
Possible. Ford LATCH is a little weird. Slightly forward of the bight, and bolt upright, not out at an angle.

Do you have yours in with a towel/noodle?


I did all the same tricks you do with any seat that is budging up against the anchors, and of course I tightened through the belt path. I could get it tight. I just couldn't get the webbing to an acceptable routing.
 

ketchupqueen

CPST and ketchup snob
Staff member
One noodle to get a 30 degree recline. But right now it's in with seatbelt anyway, for the 3 across.
 

bobandjess99

Senior Community Member
I'm dying for a pic...I can not conceive of what you mean.
does this mean tomorrow's "homeschooling field trip" is to BRU to look at carseats??:whistle:
 

Maedze

New member
It's nine o'clock, not going out there right now :p But I'll snap one tomorrow. It is seriously the oddest thing. I can't figure out how they crash tested this puppy.
 

Maedze

New member
I'm dying for a pic...I can not conceive of what you mean.
does this mean tomorrow's "homeschooling field trip" is to BRU to look at carseats??:whistle:

Have your kid bust out a protractor. Voila, math skills.

Then have her listen to you try to install it. Vocabulary.

When you hurl it across the parking lot, physics.
 

lovinwaves

New member
I might be a little confused as to what your problem is, so forgive me if this isn't it....but I literally have to take the cover OFF on the side and thread the latch strap through. I then put my two finger in the latch strap, and ever so carefully pull just the way the webbing needs me to pull. It's a pita for sure and everytime I do it it ends up installing differently for me. Once I got the hang of it, still a *****, btw, it seems to be getting easier and easier.
 

bobandjess99

Senior Community Member
Have your kid bust out a protractor. Voila, math skills.
well, ya, cuz I have a pile of those sitting around:rolleyes:
Then have her listen to you try to install it. Vocabulary.
not NEW vocabulary....:whistle:
When you hurl it across the parking lot, physics.
won't the BRU guy get angry?

maybe they didn't crash test it, and are hoping the NHTSA people are too embarassed to admit they can't LATCH it when they pick it for compliance testing, and so will just pass it anyway. :cool:
 

DahliaRW

New member
I would guess it has to do more with your anchors than the seat. I can install mine with a pool noodle and LATCH in my sienna (captains chair) without too much difficulty. I can isntall it in the rear seat (almost flat bench) without a noodle with latch or seatbelt. I'm not sure exactly what issue you're having, though. I do have to have the cover off to install it, and then I just tuck it down between the shell and seat back afterwards.
 

Pixels

New member
maybe they didn't crash test it, and are hoping the NHTSA people are too embarassed to admit they can't LATCH it when they pick it for compliance testing, and so will just pass it anyway. :cool:

When they do compliance testing, they will make sure the line that's supposed to be parallel to the ground is parallel to the ground. If Maedze's problem is what I think it is, that might change the routing enough to make it not a problem.
 

joolsplus3

Admin - CPS Technician
The bench seat is almost entirely perpendicular to the ground, and the rider is almost four, so I installed without pool noodles. It installed extremely upright even with the flat bench, probably less than thirty degrees.

Trying to envision this... or do you mean parallel? The seat cushion or the backrest? :eek:

I've been told the only way is to pull the cover back (that's what I could never figure out on my Scenera, either, maybe Dorel thinks their knife-sharp bottoms will grip to the vehicle seat, who needs a good install? :whistle:)

Wait for the new version with the base. You can see what it'll be like on the super-new AOE's at BRU (not that I've tried it, but it's got to be easier than baseless, it's just got to :eek:)
 

Maedze

New member
When they do compliance testing, they will make sure the line that's supposed to be parallel to the ground is parallel to the ground. If Maedze's problem is what I think it is, that might change the routing enough to make it not a problem.

Oh, you may be onto something here! However, if it's physically impossible to achieve that angle in any vehicle without the addition of pool noodles/towels, they really should have addressed that in the seat design :mad:
 

Maedze

New member
Trying to envision this... or do you mean parallel? The seat cushion or the backrest? :eek:

I've been told the only way is to pull the cover back (that's what I could never figure out on my Scenera, either, maybe Dorel thinks their knife-sharp bottoms will grip to the vehicle seat, who needs a good install? :whistle:)

Wait for the new version with the base. You can see what it'll be like on the super-new AOE's at BRU (not that I've tried it, but it's got to be easier than baseless, it's just got to :eek:)


In my defense, I'd like the court to know I noted and corrected the error before you pointed it out, Your Honor :eek: (Ok, so it was about thirty seconds before I read this, but still!)

I had no idea it was coming with a base...that would fix the problem, I think, just by creating a 'gap' below the shell flares.

I did have the cover pulled back. I'm going to go take pictures after I get dressed so you can all ooo and ahh at the absurdity.
 

Pixels

New member
Oh, you may be onto something here! However, if it's physically impossible to achieve that angle in any vehicle without the addition of pool noodles/towels, they really should have addressed that in the seat design :mad:
You mean like they did with the Scenera and Avenue?

I'm going to go take pictures after I get dressed so you can all ooo and ahh at the absurdity.

Why wait? Oh, that's right, you're not Judi. :p
 

Maedze

New member
I don't think the Scenera is quite the same. The flares come out more, and the belt path isn't quite as obstructed. I've installed it with LATCH (granted with a little fussing) successfully. I haven't personally installed the Avenue, so it may be the same seat shell there.
 

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