Quick Need Suv/truck Help!

[LuvBug03]

My mom might be getting a new(or used) vehicle but it needs to be a SUV or truck for company reasons. It needs to MSRP at/around 20,000 or less. What ones would you suggest with great safety ratings?
Preferably an SUV to sit at least 4 people(I doubt a truck would be able to sit 4 large people for less than 20,000).
Just shoot off some ideas, or things to look at. I know about stability, ABS, side airbags...

[jen_nah]

If she needs a truck the Chevy Silverado crewcab (true 4 doors) might be a good option. We own one and I can get 3 carseats across the back seat (2 Regents & a Roundabout/Marathon).

If she needs a large SUV then the Chevy Tahoe or Suburban which has the best gas mileage for the large suv's on the market.

You can get a nice used of all 3 of those vehicles for less then $20k.

[LuvBug03]

she needs a small/midsized SUV, I think that would be better than a truck, but a truck would be an option if we couldnt find the right SUV.
What is happening is instead of my grandmother giving mom her suburban and getting herself a new vehicle, she is keeping the suburban and getting mom something because she isnt ready to give up her suburban(dont blame her, it is nice). We would prefer her get something new as the suburban is almost too much for her to handle, so it is possible she will change her mind. So if we got a suburban we would just talk her out of hers instead of both of them having one.
Im putting a lot into safety ratings, personally, because DS will be riding in it(funny how I go through all that trouble to get a seat to fit in her van and now she is getting something different lol!). So Ive already crossed out a lot of option due to their performance or safety features(if it isnt available with ABS, Stability of some sort, and side airbags then it has been crossed off).
It has been so long since we car shopped and last time I knew nothing about safety features, so now Im banking a lot on my knowledge I have learned here, especially since it will be an SUV/truck.

[jen_nah]

What about a Saturn VUE with side airbags? Or the Chevy Equinox or Pontiac Torrant? Both are small VUE's. All have ABS and do have side airbags as an option.

[lovinwaves]

Here are my personal recommendations:

This list is just a "For an Example" list of pricing and what it could possibly get you. Toyota and Honda are usually high if not the highest in crash test and safety rating:

http://www.kbb.com/kbb/PerfectCarFinder/Report.aspx

[lovinwaves]

The Saturn Vue had some poor side impact ratings. I don't know if that has anything to do with Side curtain airbags though?

http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=446

[lovinwaves]

The Chevy Equinox and Pontiac Torrent, unfortunately have not been tested by IIHS for side impacts, OR rear impact crashes? That would concern me until I saw some data for that.;) Maybe someone else knows if there is another website for that?

But the Equinox, Torrent, and Vue all got "good" frontal crash ratings. :)

[jen_nah]

The Saturn Vue had some poor side impact ratings. I don't know if that has anything to do with Side curtain airbags though?

http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=446

The VUE has not been tested with side airbags. So, Yes it is due to no side airbags.

[LuvBug03]

She liked the torrant, liked how roomy it was... seemed to be leaning towards it so far, but she hasnt looked at much.
I just checked out the freestyle, it is too pricey I think, but nice and top ratings.

[lovinwaves]

She liked the torrant, liked how roomy it was... seemed to be leaning towards it so far, but she hasnt looked at much.
I just checked out the freestyle, it is too pricey I think, but nice and top ratings.

It looks like she could get a very newer Torrent for under $20K, which is good :), but the lack of crash test ratings tho.....:(

[jen_nah]

It looks like she could get a very newer Torrent for under $20K, which is good :), but the lack of crash test ratings tho.....:(

The ratings should be exactly the same since it is exactly the same as the VUE. It does have side curtain airbags so that will help the safety ratings a ton.

I have test drove a Torrant and it was very nice and smooth. While I agree the Ody does have a smooth car like ride the Pilot rides like a truck (aka ROUGH). The Torrant is based on a car chassis so it has a lot smoother ride. I think the 2nd row on the Torrant moves forward & back 8" like the Equinox.

[LuvBug03]

the 07 torrent has much better ratings than the suv my grandmother was suggesting(kia sportage). IFL gives it a 88.4 on their list(with 70 and below being ideal, 70-100 being medium, 100+ being high risk) and I am assuming that is without the airbags??

[Jeanum]

For the money, I'd also suggest a Saturn Vue if she can find one with side curtain airbags, or a Torrent or Equinox with side curtain airbags. If she'd consider a new base model Vue with a 4 cylinder engine and manual transmission, that might squeeze under the $20K price tag if it's not super loaded with options, but it may be hard to find one with side curtain airbags. Stability control isn't available on the Vue until the redesigned 2008 model comes out in the summer of '07. A Torrent or Equinox with side curtain airbags and stability control from the '07 model year fared better than the Saturn Vue on www.informedforlife.org's safety rating system, but either will probably cost more than $20K even with year end discounts or "red tag sales." A leftover 2006 Equinox or Torrent might be a better priced and equipped alternative, but I don't remember off the top of my head if they had ESC available for 2006.

If she's looking at used model, I wanted to share a big caveat on used Vues: avoid at any price any used Vue with a 4 cylinder engine and CVT (continuously variable transmission). The CVT has a bad reputation for catastrophic breakdowns and stranding drivers. You can peruse the archives on www.saturnfans.com Vue forums for tales of CVT failure woes. The CVT was used in the '03 through '04 model years with the 4 cylinder engine only. All V6 Vues are automatics (not CVTs, but regular automatics) and the base model 4 cylinder Vues have a 5-speed manual transmission. V6 Vues from '04 and newer actually have a Honda V6 engine under the hood.

I used to drive an '03 V6 Vue and was pretty happy with how well it protected us in a sideswiping crash where we were shoved off the road and into a frontal collision with utility pole guidewires (see the photo link in my siggy for crashed Vue pictures). It was kind of a gas hog even if I drove it conservatively, rarely getting the 19 mpg city or 25 mpg highway rating, and the engine was pretty loud, but other than that and the lack of side impact crash test scores with side curtain airbags, I can't complain. The Vue is pretty carseat friendly especially for lower LATCH installations, 3 full sets of lower LATCH anchors and top tether anchors. The seatbelts were forward of the seat bight and may be an issue for seatbelt installations depending on the carseat.

Let us know what she ends up with. :)

[LuvBug03]

Honestly Im not even sure we have a saturn dealership here. I know every lot we have(only a handful) and none of them carry new saturns that I have put my finger on. So saturns probably arent an option(which is fine as the VUE wasnt something I liked from its options/ratings).
Ive only spoke with her over the phone so far and she sounded excited about the torrent, so I might go give them a look on my way home. The 07 crash rating seem decent and if we can get one with the safety options it might be a good vehicle for her. It would definitely be better than the 92 chevy astro(aka deathtrap as I call it lol!) that she is driving.

[CPSDarren]

A base model Honda CR-V should be 20k or less with a good deal. Maybe a Hyundai Santa Fe, also.

[LuvBug03]

A base model Honda CR-V should be 20k or less with a good deal. Maybe a Hyundai Santa Fe, also.

Thank you, I told her we should give the CR-V a look because of its ratings this year. The lot is on the other side of town so she couldnt go look yet.

I think Im going to go ahead and head out with my printouts and take a look on my way home. Luckily I work right on the main road where most the dealerships are. If it happens it will happen tomorrow.

[LuvBug03]

I went and looked at the torrent, it is nice... but then I went and looked at the CRV and RAV4 and I liked the RAV4 the most and can get ABS, stability, and side airbags standard on it for cheaper than the torrent standard without those.
They will be going tomorrow to look, Im hoping I can tag along to push the safety features. Since in the end grandmother gets the last say I just want to make sure whatever they get they get with those safety features.

[lovinwaves]

I went and looked at the torrent, it is nice... but then I went and looked at the CRV and RAV4 and I liked the RAV4 the most and can get ABS, stability, and side airbags standard on it for cheaper than the torrent standard without those.
They will be going tomorrow to look, Im hoping I can tag along to push the safety features. Since in the end grandmother gets the last say I just want to make sure whatever they get they get with those safety features.

What year is the RAV4 you are looking at? I'm glad you found something you like. Did you get to drive it yet?

[LuvBug03]

What year is the RAV4 you are looking at? I'm glad you found something you like. Did you get to drive it yet?

it is the 07 I believe(either 07 or 06) but the lot was closed, I was just price shopping for them to get an idea. Of course it doesnt matter if I like it or not lol! Though if she gets something nice I will steal it from time to time:p
Shes down there now looking for herself, but is trying to stick closer to the clearly under 20K mark until grandmother joins her.
She found a scion, I looked up the scores and that thing is a death trap if anyone was ever made. Its score was like 129 and 140 or something similar!!!! So I talked her out of that. I figure if we can get something in the mid risk range that scored that way without one or both of the SAB/ESC then she knows to add it and that should make it more acceptable.

Im crossing my fingers it really happens and she gets something nice(new or not). Shes had her van for almost 15 years, it has fallen apart so many time, and it having problems again. At this point it would be cheaper to get something new than continue to fix it, and safer. So even if it was grandmother's suburban it would be better than what she has.

[CPSDarren]

The Scion is rated so low by Informed For Life in part because it has not been tested at all by the IIHS. The NHTSA numbers aren't bad- there are no 3-star results at least.

When a test has not been completed, you will see blank in the chart and then that tends to lower its rating compared to other vehicles in its class. I doubt the Scion would be a top performer even with good IIHS results, but it could move up quite a bit. You can play with the calculator to see how the result would be affected.

[Jeanum]

The Scion XB was recently tested by the IIHS for side impact collisions and it did poorly if I'm remembering correctly. Let me see if I can find the link.... the results were released very recently and apparently haven't been plugged into Informed for Life's chart yet. I had been watching for side impact scores for the XB because DH had loads of head room when he tried one on for size, but I was concerned about its scores and lack of side curtain airbags. Be right back...

[Jeanum]

Voila, here's the link to the IIHS's news release regarding side impact crash tests of small/minicars dated 12/19: http://www.iihs.org/news/rss/pr121906.html

and an excerpt about the Scion XB:


"Another poor performer in the side test is the Scion xB. Side airbags aren't available, and the xB's side structure didn't do a good job of resisting intrusion during the impact. The barrier intruded into the car and struck the driver dummy's head. Measures indicate the likelihood of brain injuries, serious neck injuries, and a fractured pelvis in a real-world crash of similar severity.

"The Scion's poor side rating and marginal rating in the rear test are especially disappointing because this car is marketed to young drivers, who have the highest crash rates and thus the greatest need for crashworthy vehicles," Lund says. "Toyota says it will replace the current xB design later in the 2007 model year, and hopefully the new version will be a better performer."

[CPSDarren]

My mistake- thank you. It appears that Informed for Life has not yet updated their spreadsheet.

[Jeanum]

No problem, I have been watching the IIHS web site like a hawk for side impact scores on xB for months. DH sat in one in the Toyota dealer's showroom and discovered he could easily wear a ten gallon hat and still have head room to spare due to the high roof line and boxy design, lol. Friends of mine drive an xB. They have three kids and absolutely love it for versatility and fuel economy. I don't have the heart to tell them about the crash scores and how we've ruled it out for DH's replacement car. Maybe the redesigned version will have curtain airbags and better scores, knock on wood.

[lovinwaves]

That is extremely disappointing to hear about "Scion". Tisk Tisk for Toyota being so lazy on the safety of these vehicles....Especially since most teenagers tend to own these vehicles (my sister included) :(

[CPSDarren]

Agreed. Sure, most of the Scion buyer demographic may care less about crash tests and safety features, but that doesn't mean they deserve something less safe. If Honda can do it with base model Civics, so can Toyota on their entry level models.

[LuvBug03]

thank you. yes I couldnt believe how little the scions seemed to offer. They arent classified as a SUV so it wouldnt matter if they did test well.

I sent her to check out the santa fe, also the dodge magnum is classified as an SUV and has better scores than some of the other ones she has suggested. She also liked the nissan murano and it appears to have tested nice as well.

[CPSDarren]

The Subaru Forester lacks stability control but is otherwise a reasonable choice overall.

[lovinwaves]

My friend has a Nissan Murano. We took it for a 3-4 hour trip to the Omaha Zoo. We installed Peyton's Graco Comforsport in it forward-facing and it installed well. They are going to start though in the high 20K's. It is more of a luxury SUV. I have never driven it, but the setup inside could take some getting use to. The Navigation system is incredible, and I would highly recommend it. It seems to be more of a passenger type SUV rather than a cargo SUV (similar to Lexus RX300, Acura MDX, BMW X's). Being that it will seat four adults quite comfortably, but leaving little room for cargo. Also the drastic slant in the back takes away from added cargo space. The ride seems to be luxurious yet sporty feeling with a tinge of truck capabilities(off-roading). The controls could get some getting use to. The controls however IMO do not have a "plasticy" feel, which is good. The leather is definitely more on the "harder" side with lack of cushioning (similar to VW). The rear seats offer apple leg room (I am 5'9") and definitely don't make you feel crowded. You seem to sit down lower in the seat though. They have copied off of the idea of the VW's where the front seats back indents allowing for more knee room. Nissan over the past couple of years have seem to be trendy with their interiors like on the Maxima. I have heard this has upset die hard Maxima owners, that just want ease of controls, not a "Cool" looking interior. It seems they have been trying to appeal more to a younger crowd instead of middle aged folks. Ok anyways, getting off topic now......

And that concludes Melissa's "Nissan" review, LOL!!! :D

[LuvBug03]

well she(grandmother) didnt listen to a word I had to say about safety features and whatnot and put in a bid for an 06 T&C, but at least it has ABS(no stability or side airbags though).
Its got to be better than what shes driving I guess.

We are hoping they turn it down and we can talk her into a freestyle(mom and aunt both loved this one, grandmother didnt look at anything but). Thanks for the help. I will let you all know what happens. Im torn as to which outcome I want for her.

[LuvBug03]

well she(grandmother) didnt listen to a word I had to say about safety features and whatnot and put in a bid for an 06 T&C, but at least it has ABS(no stability or side airbags though).
Its got to be better than what shes driving I guess.

well they took the offer, so now we are going to have a new van(white, bleck lol!), but we cant complain, it was a blessing to be getting something new for her, she deserves it so much. We wont get it until tuesday because of the holiday so we went and visited it. I couldnt get in it since the dealership was closed, but it looked nice... not what we expected(SUV??), but for a van it was nice. It has bench seats for both rows, we will probably move the 3rd to the second for the cargo room. Im hoping they arent going to have to paint the business name on the side, lol! it maybe good advertisement :p

Thanks for everyone's help! Now hopefully the husky will install well in it. It is really ironic that after all my struggles with finding a seat for her van, as soon as I find the answer and order one, we get a new vehicle. It would kill if the husky/regent didnt install in the T&C well... it would really be a shot in the eye, but I am able to cancel my order incase that is the problem, since it was a preorder it isnt expected for another couple of weeks.

Ill post pictures of it soon. Im excited, its been forever since we got a different vehicle, I feel like its a new toy lol!

[Dillipop]

I can't imagine the regent not fitting in the T&C. It has fit in any installation I have tried. THe reverse belt path is awesome in getting a good fit!

[CPSDarren]

The T&C is a very reasonable van. In terms of safety, it will protect its occupants better than most vehicles on the road.

This may have changed recently, but in older Chrysler vans the lightweight locking mechanism could be prone to slippage over time. Sometimes a half-twist would help solve the problem. Installations in the third row seats were sometimes a little tricky because of the seats and seatbelts, but nothing particularly difficult. It's quite possible that newer models and those with various seating arrangements may vary considerably, so my comments may not apply.

[LuvBug03]

ohh yeah, I forgot they will probably having locking latchplates instead of ALR. Ive never worked with a locking latchplate, would it be ok to use a locking clip instead?

What is the latch weight in chrysler?

[Jeanum]

As I understand it, Britax okays the use of a locking clip with the Husky if the seatbelt won't lock or stay locked otherwise.

Here's a link to the Safe Ride News listing of lower LATCH and top tether limits: http://www.saferidenews.com/pdfs/LATCHApp_B_pg105.pdf Chrysler is listed with a 48 lb. lower LATCH and 48 lb. top tether limit. Since you have a Husky and eventually will be required by Britax to top tether it when your child is 50 lbs., here's another handy Safe Ride News link about top tethering for higher weight limit seats: http://www.saferidenews.com/html/LATCH_P49.htm

Congrats on your family's new van. :)

[skaterbabscpst]

I honestly would recommend trying the half-twist first before using the locking clip - it really is a simple fix that works.

[LuvBug03]

thanks, I guess we will see when we get it.
Im hoping there will be latch in the "middle" position on the 2nd row. That way he can be in the middle without the seatbelt blocking the way to the back. But, Im thinking if the back row is moved to the 2nd I will probably have to put it outboard since I doubt there will be a top tether in the middle and it will probably have a lapbelt(Im pretty certain it does have a lapbelt).
I wish we didnt have to wait until tuesday before we got it, I want to play with it!! lol!

On another note, he starts preschool on the fourth. Im so nervous!!! He will be in her van every day of the week at least once if not more a day, so Im really glad she got a new vehicle right before he started. I was wondering how she was going to open the sliding door when picking him up since it tends to stick and takes about 3 minutes of working before it finally opens lol! She definitely needed and deserved something in better shape. Hopefully she will let me drive it from time to time :p