Need a EH seat for traveling in Europe

[Unregistered]

Next month we are going to be traveling to England for two weeks and I need a seat for DS 3 years old - 40" and 37lbs. He currently rides in a Frontier in my car and a Regent in DH truck.

My problem is that we are going to traveling around the country, staying with different people with different cars, in London we won't even have access with to a car. I don't really want to be lugging the Frontier all over the country - plus I heard that its a PITA to install on planes.

I need a seat that is going to be easy for us travel with - can be used on the plane - can be installed with out without latch. I was looking at the safeguard go but it can be used on the airplane can it?

The cars that we will be riding in are 2007 Toyota Prius, 1999 toyota corolla, and Vauxhall Zafira not sure the year.

I'm assuming the UK has the same latch and top tethers in their cars we do? Do anyone know?

DH suggested that we should get one of the vest for the flight and then just buy something over there so we know that it works with the cars - but I was looking at british car seats and I can't figure out which ones EH - plus they don't have the chest clip - if we are buying a seat I want to be able to use it as a back up for sometime.

[wendytthomas]

I wouldn't count on the cars all having ISOFIX (that's their LATCH system). I don't know that the 1999 car would.

If you could do without something on the plane (which he may fit in, he may not, nor would he be restrained as he's used to so it may make for a much longer flight) a Ride Safer Travel Vest would work for him. All of the cars you'll be in should have lap and shoulder belts.

Otherwise my next suggestion would probably be the Graco Nautilus. After that we'd be looking at the Sunshine Kids Radian.

Wendy

[ketchupqueen]

Ride Safer Travel Vest was my first thought, too. Possibly with a CARES for the plane, though they're not as comfy, he wouldn't have to use it full-time (when seatbelt light is off he can get up and stretch, etc.)

Second thought was Radian.

Most cars in Europe don't have top tethers.

[mykidsmylife]

We are in Germany and only the newer cars have IsoFix hardly any have top tethers, but almost every single car has lap/shoulder belts. So I would try with what Wendy said. A vest would be your easiest option.

[Unregistered]

How do young kids fit in the vests? I don't know if I comfortable with him just being in the vest.

Also do I need to use something on the train for him? and what about buses?

I was looking at the Radian65 but I'm nervous because everything I read says they have compatiblity issues. realistically how easy are they to install?

I was also looking at high weight RF seats you can buy in England - would I be able to use this in the US if I waited and bought one there? because that would be awesome!!!

[wendytthomas]

High weight RFing seats in the UK? What is this contradiction? LOL UK seats RF to 9 kg, sometimes 13 kg. I haven't heard of one that goes beyond that rear facing in the UK. It would be illegal to use in the US, but it should actually fit in a car. So it'd be your decision to use it or not.

Buses and trains don't have seatbelts, so you can't use anything.

The vest starts at 35 pounds. It's a wearable five point harness, so it is a viable alternative.

Wendy

[Unregistered]

at http://rearfacing.co.uk/ they talk about places where you can buy seats that rearface to 6 years old.

I know that they wouldn't be legal here and I would have to make a parental decision to use it - but the thought of being able to keep him rear facing is very very tempting.

[wendytthomas]

Neat site! Those aren't English seats, they're Swedish, but it's awesome they'll sell them to the UK. I have no idea what the import would be like, though. Or if you'd have to be there to get it.

Are you flying a US or an international carrier? International carriers won't let you use a rear facing seat on a plane, and after 36 months most don't let you use a seat at all.

Wendy

[Unregistered]

we're flying british airways. I hadn't even thought that they might not let him be in a seat for the flight but I suppose I could check it - ugh I don't trust checking car seats - I'm always scared they will get damaged.

I'm kinda hovering around the idea of a radian65 now because I really want him in a seat for the actual flight - i think he would be more comfortable. but the rear facing seats are very very tempting.

[niccig]

Get a rider safe vest like the other pp suggested. I got one for DS for easier 3 across in my car and for visiting my 2 sisters in the UK. One has a car and one doesn't, and the vest will be perfect for some car travel and the rest public transport.

Practice a few times with it at home, so you're both familiar with it. DS loves to wear his around the house for when he play construction worker or race car driver or astronaut...so it's a good toy as well!

ETA. Your DS is about the same size as mine..actually your DS is a little heavier but teh same height. Min weight on the vest is 35lbs - we just make that and I have to have the vest as tight as the chest straps allow, but it does fit. It should be fine for your DS. I can't get the crotch strap tight, but the posters hers told me that is optional, so it's not a big deal if it's not snug. The vest itself must be snug. When you use it, the vest does ride up at the shoulder and there's a gap between DS's shoulder and the vest - again, that's fine. But make sure the seatbelt is properly routed. We like ours and it does make a nice extra seat for car pools etc.

The vest is safe - none of the CPS techs here would use it if it wasn't. Wendy's DD is wearing it in the photos in her signature, the middle photo is her DD in the vest. Maybe someone can post the test data, but I thought the vest did very well, as in better than some seats???

[ketchupqueen]

The Radian and the RSTV are the only ones who publish their numbers, so we don't know about other seats. But yeah, the RSTV's numbers far exceed the minimum performance. I use one for my daughter in my mom's car. :)

[slklady]

have u looked at the sit n stroll? we used this for years... the stroller is handy as well as the fact that you can buckle the seat in with a car seat belt. (child is in 5 pt harness)

[J-max]

My first thought was an RSTV too (and possibly a CARES) harness for the plane. We have 2 RSTVs for our 2 middle girls for traveling and they are great, I don't know what we ever did without them (well I do, lug 2 more heavy seats around with us), they also work great for visiting friends and fitting 3 across.

[InternationalMama]

Just wanted to post and say that most coaches (long-distance buses) in the UK do have seatbelts now, but as far as I remember they are lap-belt only.

Depending on where you are going to be in the UK, there are several stores that stock some of the ERF Britax/Recaro/Brio etc. seats if you wanted to take a look at them. I think they are all listed on the website you gave.

[ketchupqueen]

have u looked at the sit n stroll? we used this for years... the stroller is handy as well as the fact that you can buckle the seat in with a car seat belt. (child is in 5 pt harness)

The Sit N Stroll is a BEAST. I have a friend who had one and returned it because she was unable to get a good install in any of 5 cars she tried it in. Plus, it's outgrown rather quickly by height.

[wendytthomas]

British Airways won't allow a rear facing seat period, and no seats over 36 months. This is why we fly domestic carriers internationally. I don't know if they'd even go for a CARES harness. Saying it's FAA approved means nothing to them, since they don't follow FAA regulations.

The Sit N Stroll is probably outgrown already, and it only has a 40 pound limit, so I wouldn't buy one for a 37 pound child. But the top slots are I think about 13", so most kids outgrow it by two years old. It's also huge, bulky, odd to install, and doesn't switch between stroller and seat easily.

Wendy

[InternationalMama]

British Airways...I don't know if they'd even go for a CARES harness.

According to their website, British Airways does allow the CARES harness. They call it something else, but it is my understanding it's the same harness.

The thing I really hate about British Airways is that even if you have a car seat for your child they make you remove them from the car seat during take off, landing, and turbulence and strap them to your lap belt with a one of those baby belts. This seems horrendous to me. But hopefully the OP isn't flying BA. :)

[wendytthomas]

But hopefully the OP isn't flying BA. :)

She is. Otherwise I wouldn't have just gone on about them. :-)

Thing is, though, the flight attendants need to sit down for take off and landing and get strapped in. Once they're strapped in there's very little they can do to prevent you from putting your child back in their restraint properly. I agree, it's stupid. We flew British Midlands with Piper (only international carrier she's been on, and it'll be another six years or so before we fly one again I hope) and they made me turn her seat forward against FMVSS213 (she was only 17 pounds in an Advantage) and gave me the loop for the lap belt. I just kind of stared at them. They had to be kidding me. Somehow they think that loop is better than a carseat???? They didn't make me remove her for takeoff and landing, and if they did then I just put her back. I don't remember that being an issue. But it doesn't surprise me in the least.

Maybe now that the UK is recommending rear facing to four years their airlines will get their butts in gear.

Wendy

[Adventuredad]

Keeping your child safe on the road should IMHO be number one priority. Flying with a child is the safest anyone can do. It's also complicated to use seats while flying internationally because of different country regulations and airlines which all have different rules.

High weight Swedish seats are really catching on in UK after the latest research in BMJ saying RF to 4 years is far safer. There are many different options available, you can read more at CarSeat.se (http://www.carseat.se) (disclaimer, it's my site). Most kids can sit rear facing until 4-5 years of age with these seats and they are easy to install.

Newer cars in Europe have Isofix but it's no something you can count on.

[mommytojoshmadty]

if you do consider taking a radian or other seat without built in lock offs - you will need a locking clip.
most UK cars have emergency locking seatbelts and do not lock automatically.

[InternationalMama]

Hi -

Oh, very sorry I missed the little extra post about flying British Airways. I thought Wendy was just guessing because it's the most likely airline. Then I would suggest a CARES harness for the flight. They call it the AmSafe System on their site. Here's the link:

http://www.britishairways.com/travel/child/public/en_gb

If you did want to bring a seat I think the Radian would be your best bet because they require a very narrow seat (maximum dimensions 43x43 cm). I'll be very curious as to whether they let you use it though. I suspect they won't because of his age.

I'd go with the RSTV. Sounds like a great option. I wish my son was 35 lbs. :)

PS I don't think the CAA is going to change their rules about the not rear-facing on planes anytime soon. They have some "data" to back up their rules.

[Unregistered]

Ok so I just ordered a Radian65 AND a CARES vest. DH is going to kill me. LOL

I'm going to try and see if they will let me use the seat on the plane. My big issue with wanting him in a seat for the flight is because I think HE will find it more comfortable we are flying at night and i'm hoping he will sleep most of the flight. Hopefully we'll get it in a couple days so I can get used to installing it and he can get used to riding in it.

If they don't let me use the seat then I will use the vest. If they do let me use the seat I can always take the vest back.

I'll have to come back and let you guys know if they let me use the seat.

[wendytthomas]

The Radian is super easy to install on planes. And a neat trick I learned with it is that if you put the little forward facing foot down, and recline the plane's seat while you're installing it (then pull the seatback upright to snug it in), then when it's time for sleep you can recline the plane's seat and the Radian will recline snugly right with it. Piper slept for 7.5 hours straight on a plane back from China in hers.

If they don't let you install it it'll fit in the overhead bins folded, so it doesn't need to be handled by the baggage people.

Wendy

[InternationalMama]

Sounds like a plan! Please come back and let us know how it turned out. I'm very interested. :) Don't forget to practice doing the install with a locking clip because you'll need to use one in the UK.

Wendy, do you really know someone who has been allowed to put it in the overhead bin? I know it fits, but I think they have rules about putting very heavy metal objects up in those... Oh well, maybe the OP will find out for us!

[Unregistered]

OK so just for an update - we flew yesterday and British Airways did NOT allow him to us the seat. and they would not allow it in the overhead compartment. They did check it with the strollers at the gate instead of checking it with luggage.

He did fine in the CARES vest - although he only really wore it for take off and landing. I think he would have been more comfortable in his seat - he didn't sleep very well.

So far I've only put the seat into the Prius and it was a reasonably easy.

[Neatfreak]

I'm sorry to hear that! Did they ask you not to use the seat due to your son's age, or was there something else?

[InternationalMama]

Thanks for posting back.

Did they say why they wouldn't let you use the seat? Was it because of the seat itself (too wide, not EU-approved etc.) or was it because of your son's age?

I'm curious because I was really hoping BA would allow a Radian onboard for my future flights with them.

If it was because of the seat and not because of his age you could get a Britax Freeway online in the UK for 60 pounds for the return trip if you want it. That's the seat Britax and BA recommend to use on BA flights. But it would probably only be worth it if you plan on flying BA in the future.

[Unregistered]

They told me no because of his age. you were right after 36 months they don't want them in seats :( I didn't really query it any further to find out if the seat would have been OK with a younger child.

I got half way through installing it when a flight attendant asked me how old he was. It fit really easily into the seat so I don't think THAT would have been an issue. On the way home I'm going to try again and if they ask his age I'm going to tell a little white lie I think.

OT - but am I reading it correct does this seat NOW RF to 40lbs. I think I'm going to pee my pants - thats awesome. guess whats about to become our primary seat!!!


Thanks for posting back.

Did they say why they wouldn't let you use the seat? Was it because of the seat itself (too wide, not EU-approved etc.) or was it because of your son's age?

I'm curious because I was really hoping BA would allow a Radian onboard for my future flights with them.

If it was because of the seat and not because of his age you could get a Britax Freeway online in the UK for 60 pounds for the return trip if you want it. That's the seat Britax and BA recommend to use on BA flights. But it would probably only be worth it if you plan on flying BA in the future.

[InternationalMama]

It's a true story. If it's a US Radian with a DOM of 9/08 or later it now RFs to 40 lbs. How great is that?!

Thanks for the info. Good luck for the trip and on the way home!