Locking clips, ALR/ELR

[grumpybear]

At the most recent check, the tech said everything was fine with our installation except that since we are using the locking clip, the lap-shoulder belt needs to be on ELR mode.

As a backgrounder, our seatbelt that we use to install our RF Radian is ALR/ELR. DH installed the Radian by pulling the seatbelt all the way, install seat and slowly feed the belt back in. The locking clip needed to be used because with the way the lap-shoulder belt was sourced (all the way back towards the right in a Subaru Impreza wagon), the car seat would tip and fall to one side if pushed. But with a locking clip, the installation would be rock solid.

When I asked why the seatbelt had to be on ELR mode if using the locking clip, the tech said that it was because locking clip+ALR had not been tested and therefore cannot be considered as safe.

Is this correct?

TIA! :)

[An Aurora]

There are differing opinions on this. Some people think that it's fine to "double up" on locking mechanisms, and others think you should pick one method and stick with it. I'm with the latter group ;)

[grumpybear]

Thanks for the reply. :)
Besides issues like the one we have with our seat and vehicle, what would be other instances where the locking clip and ALR would be used?

[Mommy0608]

I'm not sure I understand how the locking clip prevented the tipping if you also locked the seatbelt retractor. :confused:

Locking clips DO help with tipping when the locked retractor is causing the seat to tip, because they allow you to leave the shoulder belt unlocked. As long as the shoulder belt is still locked at the retractor, I don't see how the locking clip (when used properly) would prevent tipping... the pressure from the locked shoulder belt would still be on the car seat.

Where did you place the locking clip? Was it on the side by the buckle, or on the other side of the car seat? Locking clips are supposed to go about 1" from the seatbelt's latchplate. Just want to make sure it was being used properly. :thumbsup:

As to your question about using both, I personally don't. They serve the same purpose. If the shoulder belt can be locked, there's no need for the locking clip, except possibly to prevent tipping, in which case, you wouldn't lock the shoulder belt since that's what was causing the tipping.

Edited to add: I thought about it more. Are you locking the shoulder belt, but not pulling it very tight (perhaps just so it's taut?) If so I can see how this might prevent tipping. The only way I'd lock a shoulder belt and use a locking clip (or built-in lock-off) would be to prevent a child from pulling the shoulder belt out and playing with it. For instance, Tyler's SS1 has a built-in lock-off, and I did lock the shoulder belt but I left it so it's not super tight, just so there's no slack. I found that he was hooking his foot in it and trying to pull it to his hand to play with it, which could be dangerous. This way he can't pull it out.

[Pixels]

Using the locking clip would keep the shoulder belt from being able to tilt the seat, even if the shoulder belt was tight. Once you put the locking clip on, the lap belt is a fixed length. The tight lap belt holds the carseat down. When the belt is locked at the retractor but no locking clip, the reason the seat can tilt is because the shoulder belt gets shorter as the lap belt gets longer (sliding through the latchplate). Tension gets moved from the lap portion, where we want it, to the shoulder portion.

There are differing opinions on this. Some people think that it's fine to "double up" on locking mechanisms, and others think you should pick one method and stick with it. I'm with the latter group ;)

I'm in the former group. :) There are seats with built-in lockoffs that are not optional, and seatbelts that it's not an option to leave unlocked (either locking latchplate or ALR-only belts). I have never heard anyone say you can't use a seat that requires the lockoffs be used with a locked seatbelt.

[grumpybear]

Where did you place the locking clip? Was it on the side by the buckle, or on the other side of the car seat? Locking clips are supposed to go about 1" from the seatbelt's latchplate. Just want to make sure it was being used properly. :thumbsup:

It's on the side of the buckle. Although completely inside the belt path, it's still about an inch from the latchplate.


Edited to add: I thought about it more. Are you locking the shoulder belt, but not pulling it very tight (perhaps just so it's taut?) If so I can see how this might prevent tipping. The only way I'd lock a shoulder belt and use a locking clip (or built-in lock-off) would be to prevent a child from pulling the shoulder belt out and playing with it.

We do try to pull the belt as tight as it could but you know how the belt sort of ratchets in increments? I think if it would ratchet about half an increment more, the belt would be super tight.
Although I really think that it's the angle of where the belt is sourced from that is causing the tipping.